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EGR Valve cleaning


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#1 mikeholroyd

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 15:13

Quick question: my Octavia flew through the MOT last Friday, and passed the emissions with one single rev on the machine, giving a reading of 0.84.

Would there be any benefit at all to clean out the EGR valve? There's no sign of any rough running or poor economy, no engine light on, no nothing. Just wondering if cleaning could improve things to even better that things are.

Or is it very much a case of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".

It's a 1.9PD, BJB engine,now with 53k miles on it, and the EGR valve has never been off.

Thanks

Mike

#2 vRS_Pagey

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 17:43

As I understand it, they are very efficent up to about 30k, beyon that they start caking up which will reduce performance, and mpg.

I have fitted a delete pipe on mine, its not a big job to remove the EGR valve so you could pop it off and have a look. If it is nasty, soak it over night in carb cleaner or petrol, and refit.

#3 Dougall

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Posted 08 September 2011 - 11:07

vRS_Pagey,

Does the gasket need replacing if you pop off the EGR valve for cleaning?

#4 Wardy

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Posted 08 September 2011 - 11:17

No, gasket will be OK.

That's reminded me Mike - sorry, I've not sent you through those EGR photos. Will sort that out later.

#5 vRS_Pagey

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Posted 08 September 2011 - 12:17

What Steve said, the one on mine is fine. :thumbup:

Here are some pictures to illustrate a bit better.
My OE EGR valve -

Posted Image

Delete pipe -

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Fitted -

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Mine had covered a little over 45k, and tbh wasn't that bad, the last picture is from a vehicle which had covered less miles. Poor servicing, fuelling and enviroment can all play a part in how bad they can get. Imo, for 70 quid it's a no brainer, as I noticed increase throttle response and over a couple of runs the mpg increased slightly.

Posted Image

HTH, Lee.

#6 Wardy

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Posted 08 September 2011 - 12:40

That picture is ridiculous! It's any wonder the engine still functioned! And at that, I'd be surprised if the flap control was working even slightly, with that amount of build-up.

Despite the short comings of the EGR system, and its tendency to clog up, it's not the fault of the system that it's ended up like that. That'll be incorrect servicing intervals (if any at all!) and perhaps even the incorrect oil spec being used.

#7 k.young

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Posted 08 September 2011 - 20:23

Do they do a EGR delete for the 140 BKD engine, and does it need coding out ??

#8 Wardy

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Posted 08 September 2011 - 23:24

Yes a couple of options available. I'd recommend the Darkside Developments option.

Yes, some coding is almost always required, as the standard setup is expecting the EGR to be there.

#9 vRS_Pagey

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Posted 09 September 2011 - 07:10

Yes a couple of options available. I'd recommend the Darkside Developments option.

Yes, some coding is almost always required, as the standard setup is expecting the EGR to be there.

+1 for DD, as you can see from my pictures above, thats who supplied mine.

They don't have the BKD listed on the website but drop them an email, I dealt with Scott and Ryan, and they were both extremely helpful. The kit is £70 including postage. :thumbup:

#10 k.young

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Posted 09 September 2011 - 19:20

Thanks lads.

#11 Mattc3156

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Posted 11 September 2011 - 05:51

My engine warning light has been on for the passed couple of days - this followed it going into limp mode which I reset by stopping and restarting the engine.

Not had it scanned yet (Mon) but due to the mileage (50K) I suspect the EGR valve is the culprit. Thinking of giving the EGR delete kit a go. I understand it'll need to be remapped to stop it throwing up more errors but will a custom one need doing or will something like Bluefin do the job?

#12 vRS_Pagey

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Posted 11 September 2011 - 06:54

My engine warning light has been on for the passed couple of days - this followed it going into limp mode which I reset by stopping and restarting the engine.

Not had it scanned yet (Mon) but due to the mileage (50K) I suspect the EGR valve is the culprit. Thinking of giving the EGR delete kit a go. I understand it'll need to be remapped to stop it throwing up more errors but will a custom one need doing or will something like Bluefin do the job?

If the fault code is P0401, then that relates to the EGR valve. If you already have a remap on the car, your tuner will be able to tweak it to remove the EGR from the system. Your standard map can also be modified to do the same. Tbh, fitting the delete pipe and living the map as is, will not cause any problems, the only issue will be the CEL on the dash, if that doesn't bother you then you could leave it. Obviously the only problem with that is if another problem occurs you won't know about it!

Does that all make sense, because I think I just confused myself..... :giggle:

#13 Mattc3156

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Posted 11 September 2011 - 13:50

If the fault code is P0401, then that relates to the EGR valve. If you already have a remap on the car, your tuner will be able to tweak it to remove the EGR from the system. Your standard map can also be modified to do the same. Tbh, fitting the delete pipe and living the map as is, will not cause any problems, the only issue will be the CEL on the dash, if that doesn't bother you then you could leave it. Obviously the only problem with that is if another problem occurs you won't know about it!

Does that all make sense, because I think I just confused myself..... :giggle:


Yep that makes sense :yes: I'll get it scanned and see what it throws up and work from there. I'd rather not have the CEL on the dash all the time just in case so will look at a different map and delete pipe if that's what's needed. Beginning to get fed up with the car and that amount of money it's cost me in the last few months with various faults and thinking about chopping it in for something else :(

#14 mikeholroyd

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Posted 12 September 2011 - 17:54

OK, having had a good look at the EGR valve on the Octavia, and having had advice from Lee (Pagey), I've decided to leave it well alone. I couldn't see any way of accessing the bolts, so I took the rubber pipe of the end, and looked inside to find it wasn't actually bad at all, not even as bad as Pagey's in post 5.

However, the idea of cleaning the EGR got me intrigued as to what it was like on the Leon (1.9TDI, ASV engine, non PD). This was easy to take off, and I was horrified to find it probably 40% caked up with black sludge, worse in fact than the last photo in Pagey's post. Sorry there's no photo, but I wasn't touching my camera with my hands in the state they were!

It took nearly a full can of carb cleaner to remove all this, but it has all come out, and the difference in the way the car is running is tremendous. It's far more pokier, revving more freely, and seems a lot quieter as well. So a big thanks to Lee for all his help on this.

I'm just thankful that the Octavia isn't in the same state -- possibly because I use nothing else but Texaco or Shell fuel, never supermarket stuff. But I'm not opening that discussion again! Makes me wonder, though...........

Mike

#15 vRS_Pagey

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Posted 12 September 2011 - 17:59

OK, having had a good look at the EGR valve on the Octavia, and having had advice from Lee (Pagey), I've decided to leave it well alone. I couldn't see any way of accessing the bolts, so I took the rubber pipe of the end, and looked inside to find it wasn't actually bad at all, not even as bad as Pagey's in post 5.

However, the idea of cleaning the EGR got me intrigued as to what it was like on the Leon (1.9TDI, ASV engine, non PD). This was easy to take off, and I was horrified to find it probably 40% caked up with black sludge, worse in fact than the last photo in Pagey's post. Sorry there's no photo, but I wasn't touching my camera with my hands in the state they were!

It took nearly a full can of carb cleaner to remove all this, but it has all come out, and the difference in the way the car is running is tremendous. It's far more pokier, revving more freely, and seems a lot quieter as well. So a big thanks to Lee for all his help on this.

I'm just thankful that the Octavia isn't in the same state -- possibly because I use nothing else but Texaco or Shell fuel, never supermarket stuff. But I'm not opening that discussion again! Makes me wonder, though...........

Mike

:thumbup:

#16 Plantman

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 11:54

My two pence, my previous octy 2.0 PD had 160k on it when i had the EGR cleaned. No increase in power or mpg was noticeable.

#17 Wardy

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 14:40

Well done guys. Another good bit of Briskoda spirit evident :thumbup:

I think you're quite right Mike, but I know it's a can of worms! EGR caking can only really be down to a fairly limited number of factors - I'm thinking the main ones are quality and correct spec oil, regular services and good-quality fuel....

#18 Golf-Fiend

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 15:32

Well done guys. Another good bit of Briskoda spirit evident :thumbup:

I think you're quite right Mike, but I know it's a can of worms! EGR caking can only really be down to a fairly limited number of factors - I'm thinking the main ones are quality and correct spec oil, regular services and good-quality fuel....


Not entirely sure about your thinking re the oil spec? Only if it were burning oil should any of it get into the exhaust system / EGR etc? Fuel quality and a clean air filter more likely to be good. Also a good hard thrashing now and then to get it hot and burn off deposits would be better, no?

#19 cheshire cat

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 15:51

My two pence, my previous octy 2.0 PD had 160k on it when i had the EGR cleaned. No increase in power or mpg was noticeable.

maybe it's less of a problem with the cooler fitted?

#20 Wardy

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 15:58

Not entirely sure about your thinking re the oil spec? Only if it were burning oil should any of it get into the exhaust system / EGR etc? Fuel quality and a clean air filter more likely to be good. Also a good hard thrashing now and then to get it hot and burn off deposits would be better, no?


I was meaning more that if an incorrect spec of oil was used, one of the side effects might well be more build-up inside the EGR. I agree though, fuel quality is likely to be a bigger contributing factor.

Just thinking out loud really :)

Air filter's another good shout. And yes, running it properly too. Think all too often diesels are just driven around between 2-3k and therein lies an opportunity for deposits to start accumulating.

#21 Andehh

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 14:19

My 2.0PD VRS has the CEL on (and has for the last few 1000 miles) and a scan shows it to be due to the EGR valve. The car is always serviced on time (every 10k, so 2-3 times a year) by a garage I trust, and whilst the EGR has been on my to do list It isn't high on my priorities...

Does anyone know of instructions for a 2.0PD engine to remove & clean the EGR valve? Are there many difference between the 1.9 and the 2.0PD?


[excuse bumping an old topic, but it is still relevant IMO]

Edited by Andehh, 15 October 2012 - 14:22.


#22 cheezemonkhai

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 14:55

The 2.0 PD is probably easier as it's at the front of the engine.

You'll need a 6mm and a 5mm allen key and if you've got a set of allen keys on sockets, then that with a ratchet helps.
You'll also need a fairly wide flat headed screwdriver to allow you to pop the clip open on the bottom hose of the EGR/Anti-Shudder valve.

Finally some carb cleaner, a couple of pairs of rubber gloves (disposable), a fair amount of kitchen roll and some old newspaper.
A few cocktail sticks and an old toothbrush prove to be helpful too.

1) unplug the electrical connector and carefully place it out of harms way.
2) Use the screwdriver to slide it behind the spring clip on the large lower hose connection and pull to open the spring lock.
Once this is open (Taking care not to damage anything) then you can slide the hose out of the bottom and clean up any oil that leaks out.

3) Using the 5mm allen key, undo the long bolt at the rear (slightly left) of the EGR/Flap body.
4) Undo the two 6mm allen bolts attaching the EGR feed pipe on the body and put these in a safe place.
5) Undo the two short bolts that hold the top of the EGR to the inlet manifold.
Don't bother separating the EGR and flap as it's probably not needed.
6) Remove the section, and clean it all out carefully, making sure you don't damage anything and don't try and force the flap.
The flap won't move, so don't try as doing so will break it.

7) Refit everything in reverse, using new gaskets if required and a small amount of threadlock on each of the removed bolts.


Spend ages cleaning your fingers even though you had gloved on.
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#23 Plantman

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 10:08

My 2.0PD VRS has the CEL on (and has for the last few 1000 miles) and a scan shows it to be due to the EGR valve. The car is always serviced on time (every 10k, so 2-3 times a year) by a garage I trust, and whilst the EGR has been on my to do list It isn't high on my priorities...

Does anyone know of instructions for a 2.0PD engine to remove & clean the EGR valve? Are there many difference between the 1.9 and the 2.0PD?


[excuse bumping an old topic, but it is still relevant IMO]


cheezemonkhai's instructions above are spot on.

Let me know if you want some pictures of when I did mine dude. It's not hard, though having decent tools really helped. My previous 05 Octavia needed allen keys to undo the bolts so having strong allens with the angled head really helped on this one.

My current 06 have changed to star bits, so this was easier since I could use a socket set with star bits.

Try not to let any bits of carbon etc fall in to the intake manifold if you clean this since these wouldn't be good for the engine.

I could reuse all of my gaskets ok too.

#24 Andehh

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Posted 18 October 2012 - 10:13

Hi mate, some pictures would be brilliant! I don't have much experience working on cars, so whilst willing to give if a go I'd feel much much happier with some pictures! Thanks guys :)

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2



#25 cheezemonkhai

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Posted 18 October 2012 - 10:34

I didn't take any of the disassembly as I didn't have my camera until later and it was too mucky for much else to be taken.

Sorry

#26 Plantman

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Posted 19 October 2012 - 12:28

EGR and IMF cleaning for the 2.0 PD. Pics from the BKD engine.

Remove the plastic engine cover first

Unclip the large circle clip from the bottom of the Intake Manifold Flap [IMF] (bottom circle in this pic) by using a flat head screwdriver or pliers (mine didn't need to come fully out). Then pull the black intake pipe down and out of the IMF housing.

Unplug the IMF electrical connector (right). Unplug the EGR vacuum pipe (left):

Posted Image

Undo the allan bolts in the above picture next. There will be three (2 short and one long) which hold the EGR and IMF to the intake manifold.The last one around the back is arrowed on the left.

Then I needed a star bit to remove the EGR feel pipe bolts (2) which are the bolts to the right of the picture. The one behind is hidden in this picture and again arrowed.

The whole assembly will then come out. I actually also undid the other 2 allan bolts to separate the EGR from the IMF.

You will be left with this gaping hole:

Posted Image

Then it's time to get dirty and clean:

EGR at 110k
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IMF at 110k
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Intake Manifold
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EGR Macro
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Clean enough
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Then when you are filthy and you have covered all your clothes, shoes, drive and carpets in soot and oil put it all back in reverse order.
Posted Image

Edited by Plantman, 19 October 2012 - 13:56.

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#27 Plantman

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Posted 19 October 2012 - 13:28

After that you can decide whether you want to put this gasket in too:

http://www.briskoda....s/#entry2958515

Posted Image

Picture stolen from this post:

http://www.briskoda....problem-solved/

Edited by Plantman, 19 October 2012 - 13:28.


#28 octimark

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Posted 19 October 2012 - 13:47

Those pictures are a great help - Thanks

Whats the best cleaning product to use?
Is it better to soak it or pick/brush it off? (assuming its not rock solid)

Just for info - heres a couple of links to a new EGR and the EGR delete from Darkside:
New EGR - http://www.darksided...131-501-an.html
EGR Delete - http://www.darksided...-race-pipe.html
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#29 Plantman

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Posted 19 October 2012 - 13:53

I removed most of the gunk with a plastic toothbrush handle, not wanting to scratch anything.

For actual cleaning I just used baby wet wipes lol :D

Edited by Plantman, 19 October 2012 - 13:55.


#30 Black_Sheep

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Posted 19 October 2012 - 17:53

Did anyone see the episode of 'Wheeler Dealers' where they used an engine decarbonizer on a Jag XK8 to reduce emissions? Could this be used on EGR valves?




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