Timing belt change, and EuroCarParts bargains...

[WRCSixtyThree]

So, clock's ticked over 60K on the Superb and I have no evidence to suggest a belt change in the past (other than that it was sold to previous as Skoda Approved Used less than a year ago and I would expect that it may have been done by the supplying dealer as it would be overdue for a change according to the 'Four Year Fleece').

With that in mind, decided to get myself a timing belt kit and water pump ready for doing the job (which I plan for sometime over the next few weekends) from ECP. They have a sale on (until midnight tomorrow, I believe) which means that the ContiTech belt kit including tensioner and idler, plus a metal-impeller water pump came to a total of £100.49.

With a set of the locking tools on order (£15 from eBay) making the total less than £120, I'm pretty pleased with the total cost.

When I get to doing the job, any call for photos to be taken of any stages? I'll try and remember if there is, but for anyone contemplating doing the job (and bear in mind here that I have spanner-twiddling experience and many far more complex TB jobs under my belt) there is an excellent video guide for a Passat which gives a good visual reference of the work involved which is

.

[iwannasuperb]

Would be a very good resource to have on the site! I don't think it's been covered before!

[WRCSixtyThree]

Would be a very good resource to have on the site! I don't think it's been covered before!

Sadly I don't think I have the commitment or patience to do a full how-to; apart from anything else the actual belt change is well explained in the video I posted above, but I did think the 'service position' procedure might be worth photographing for future use?

[WRCSixtyThree]

Locking tools have arrived this morning... now, do I start this weekend or not?

Actually probably not - I have to get my loft organised ready for the loft-boarding man on Monday. Damn, looks like good weather too.

Mind you, gives me time to assemble the requisite parts and fluid for the ATF change which is my only other bit of work to do on the car.

[rotodiesel]

Once you have the bumper skin off, the "service position" is obvious - if you can't manage this you should not be changing the belt.

A couple of tips: Get 2 M8 x 125 bolts from B&Q and use these as pegs to hang the lock carrier on whilst you do the job. A block of wood in the snub mount location keeps the lock carrier out of your way. The access is then very good.

To remove the fan from its bearing spindle, unscrew the bolt through the access hole at the back of the bracket with an 8AF hex key. There is a special VAG tool to hold the fan drum which engages in the 2 holes on its front face. An easier way to hold it is to fold a piece of glass paper and place it between the belt and the drum. If you then apply extra belt tension with a 19AF spanner on the tensioner, you can unscrew the bolt. The glass paper stops the belt slipping on the smooth drum. Use it again on reassembly.

A cambelt change is a dead easy job on this engine but make absolutely sure you understand how to do it. There must be no locked-in torque whilst you set the tensioner position and the TV damper bolts are stipulated by VAG to be single use. It is easier to hold the crankshaft using the flywheel teeth and a big screwdriver through the slot in the bell housing, which is under the coolant reservoir (get an assistant).

I do not tighten the tensioner retaining nut to the specified 20 Nm + 45 deg. as I believe this damages the stud - which then breaks next time you do the job. 20 Nm + 20 deg. is enough. I've seen a few wrecked PDs with broken studs. You need to make up your own mind on this.

rotodiesel.

I've just noticed your car is an auto. You will need to deal with the ATF cooler lines in the radiator. There may well not be a slot in the bell housing to hold the crank - use a 12 point 19AF socket on the central bolt instead.

Edited 3 January, 2013 by rotodiesel

[WRCSixtyThree]

Once you have the bumper skin off, the "service position" is obvious - if you can't manage this you should not be changing the belt.

Perhaps not to everyone, though?

A couple of tips: Get 2 M8 x 125 bolts from B&Q and use these as pegs to hang the lock carrier on whilst you do the job. A block of wood in the snub mount location keeps the lock carrier out of your way. The access is then very good.

I have studwork in stock which will suffice...

To remove the fan from its bearing spindle, unscrew the bolt through the access hole at the back of the bracket with an 8AF hex key. There is a special VAG tool to hold the fan drum which engages in the 2 holes on its front face. An easier way to hold it is to fold a piece of glass paper and place it between the belt and the drum. If you then apply extra belt tension with a 19AF spanner on the tensioner, you can unscrew the bolt. The glass paper stops the belt slipping on the smooth drum. Use it again on reassembly.

I'll probably just fabricate a tool to hold the drum, if one of my existing adjustable tools won't suffice.

A cambelt change is a dead easy job on this engine but make absolutely sure you understand how to do it. There must be no locked-in torque whilst you set the tensioner position and the TV damper bolts are stipulated by VAG to be single use. It is easier to hold the crankshaft using the flywheel teeth and a big screwdriver through the slot in the bell housing, which is under the coolant reservoir (get an assistant).

I'm pretty sure I'll manage. I think I understand.

I do not tighten the tensioner retaining nut to the specified 20 Nm + 45 deg. as I believe this damages the stud - which then breaks next time you do the job. 20 Nm + 20 deg. is enough. I've seen a few wrecked PDs with broken studs. You need to make up your own mind on this.

Thanks. Now that is useful information.

rotodiesel.

I've just noticed your car is an auto. You will need to deal with the ATF cooler lines in the radiator. There may well not be a slot in the bell housing to hold the crank - use a 12 point 19AF socket on the central bolt instead.

I may well change the ATF at the same time, in which case I plan to disconnect the cooler lines and vacuum out the cooler to remove more of the old fluid. If not, I'll work something out. I'd planned to counterhold using the crank bolt in any case.

Before I start, this isn't meant to start an argument, but rather just to remind you that not everyone is some kind of moron.

Don't take this the wrong way, but your post does rather sound like you're assuming I'm some kind of beginner. Please don't make those assumptions, it does come across as rather patronising.

As I mentioned in my first post, I'm not a beginner. I've plenty of experience with vehicles from the 1950s onward, petrol and diesel, motorcycle, car and commercial, military and civilian, 1-12 cylinders and both chain, belt and geared timing drive.

Thanks for the tips, in any case. I'm sure I'll manage.

On a more positive note, the reason I posted here offering to take photos for people, was that although I have read many of your posts extolling your experience of timing belt changes, I haven't seen any photographic guides. Yes, the service position may well be obvious to you and maybe even me (assuming I'm bright enough), but perhaps not to everyone else; hence the offer of photos. Whilst there are plenty of shared-platform guides to service position around on the net, I've not seen a pictorial guide for the Superb, and as you know the front end can be more of a pain when there's a grille to remove or foglights in the bumper as on a Passat.

Just thought it might be useful to some, but since you have the position of resident expert sewn up, I'll probably not bother.

[rotodiesel]

Just occasionally it's possible to save time and trouble by taking note of the observations of other people who have actually done the identical job. Advice is always optional.

Best of luck with yours.

rotodiesel.

[WRCSixtyThree]

Just occasionally it's possible to save time and trouble by taking note of the observations of other people who have actually done the identical job. Advice is always optional.

Best of luck with yours.

rotodiesel.

I agree totally. No arguments with what you're saying, just the way you chose to say it.

[rotodiesel]

1. Don't waste Forum space by quoting the whole of a previous message.

2. It's just a car - all factual stuff and nothing to get worked up about.

rotodiesel.

Edited 4 January, 2013 by rotodiesel

[allclownsareevi]

Before I start, this isn't meant to start an argument, but rather just to remind you that not everyone is some kind of moron.

Don't take this the wrong way, but your post does rather sound like you're assuming I'm some kind of beginner. Please don't make those assumptions, it does come across as rather patronising.

As I mentioned in my first post, I'm not a beginner. I've plenty of experience with vehicles from the 1950s onward, petrol and diesel, motorcycle, car and commercial, military and civilian, 1-12 cylinders and both chain, belt and geared timing drive.

Thanks for the tips, in any case. I'm sure I'll manage.

On a more positive note, the reason I posted here offering to take photos for people, was that although I have read many of your posts extolling your experience of timing belt changes, I haven't seen any photographic guides. Yes, the service position may well be obvious to you and maybe even me (assuming I'm bright enough), but perhaps not to everyone else; hence the offer of photos. Whilst there are plenty of shared-platform guides to service position around on the net, I've not seen a pictorial guide for the Superb, and as you know the front end can be more of a pain when there's a grille to remove or foglights in the bumper as on a Passat.

Just thought it might be useful to some, but since you have the position of resident expert sewn up, I'll probably not bother.

To be fair to Roto buddy, when posting on a forum, he's not just posting for you to read. Anyone and everyone can read the forum so you do have to word posts so that people, regardless of experience, can understand what is meant.

As for a guide, nice idea man. Look forward to it.

[WRCSixtyThree]

1. Don't waste Forum space by quoting the whole of a previous message.

2. It's just a car - all factual stuff and nothing to get worked up about.

rotodiesel.

1. I'm sure the extra few kilobytes of database size won't hurt. Unless you're a DBA like me and know better?

2. Who's worked up? I was just asking you to think of how things sound when you post them. If you'd simply posted your tips without the 'Mummy knows best' tone, I'd not even have bothered to reply with anything other than 'Thanks for the tips Rotodiesel, I'll bear them in mind'.

[WRCSixtyThree]

To be fair to Roto buddy, when posting on a forum, he's not just posting for you to read. Anyone and everyone can read the forum so you do have to word posts so that people, regardless of experience, can understand what is meant.

As for a guide, nice idea man. Look forward to it.

I understand that - but the tone wasn't about making things understandable; and the point I'm making is that yes, everyone can read them - and everyone will make their own interpretation of what's being said and how it's meant.

My interpretation was that the reply was a reply to a thread I started, a post I made (bearing in mind that at that point 3 of the 4 posts in the thread, and the most recent two, were made by me), and that therefore making statements such as 'Once you have the bumper skin off, the "service position" is obvious - if you can't manage this you should not be changing the belt.' was making assumptions about me as the person making the post to which the reply was addressed.

How the post was meant may well be different to how it sounded in the poster's head. In 'Real Life' I'm sure Rotodiesel is a very nice person, but on the internet one's persona is only shown by their posts. Whilst the posts doubtless are of high quality in content (I am not for one moment trying to undermine the technical aspects), the tone of some of the posts I have read (and believe me, I've read quite a few) leaves a bit to be desired.

As I said at the beginning, I wasn't trying to start an argument, merely asking that everyone thinks about the tone and wording of their posts before clicking 'Post'.

All IMHO. Can we just draw a line under it now?

[WRCSixtyThree]

Apologies first off - best laid plans and all that, but when I came to start this job I found my camera battery dead as I'd left the bloody thing turned on... so no pictorial walk-through I'm afraid.

Anyway, the job went as expected. 3 hours 27 minutes start to finish, and only two scraped knuckles to show for it.

Bumper Removal - straightforward. The process has been described well enough in the past, the only sticky bit is the overly complicated wheelarch liner/undertray arrangement. There's an extra little bit of plastic which hangs down into the airflow between the undertray and liner, which clips on the top of the undertray and can be a right little bugger to get placed correctly when it detaches itself.

Crash Bar - straightforward, although someone had clearly been there before me and done the big Torx (T45 IIRC) bolts up gorilla-tight with a windy gun, which meant I sheared off a Teng Torx bit in the process of removing the first bolt. Having ground the bit down so it was a very tight fit in the head, and using a hammer and penetrating fluid to shock the bolts into submission, judicious application of a 4ft breaker bar got them undone. Removing the intercooler duct eases access and it's just a clip on.

Unclip and remove the headlight washer tubes, and the crashbar come off. The PAS cooler bolts were next. The centre bolt was straightforward but the one on the passenger side nearest the flexible pipes was seized solid and needed to be cut off, subsequently replaced with a stainless nut and bolt.

Unclip the grey coupling cover from the bonnet release cable (drivers side, under the plenum chamber cover) and released the bonnet cable. The little grey coupling is tight, it will feel like it's going to break when you prise it open, but it's actually quite flexible, and won't.

Remove engine cover and remove the intake duct from the drivers side where it joins the airbox and is mounted to the lock carrier by three screws.

Unclip the ATF (if auto) lines from the passenger side clip at the bottom of the lock carrier, which gives enough movement to pull the front end into service position. Unclip the intercooler line from the cross tube at the bottom of the lock carrier on the passenger side only. Drivers' side has plenty of length. You could probably do without removing the passenger side but it's a good opportunity to drain any oil from the intercooler if you remove it.

Undo the front mounting on the washer bottle from the passenger side where it's mounted to the lock carrier. There's a wiring loom with three connectors which are mounted behind the passenger side headlight, which is all on a clipped plastic holder just forward of the PAS bottle. Remove the PAS bottle cover and you'll see how it's clipped on, it can be unclipped to give additional room for pulling the carrier forward.

Mount M8 studs (I used some offcuts of tube I had lying around over the studs to increase their diameter closer to the size of the lock carrier holes) with two nuts (locked together) and repair washer on the forward end to prevent the lock carrier coming too far, and remove the final fixings (one either side under the front edge of the wing, and two on the top at the front corner of the wing. One of mine (passenger side) was seized and had been chewed up in the past - I drilled it out and retapped and replaced with a new stainless countersunk allen bolt and washer on each side for a 'factory, but upgraded' look.

Pull lock carried forward, checking as you do that you've not missed anything that's preventing it coming away. I placed a small Land Rover bottle jack and a block under the front edge, and used two wooden blocks between the chassis rails and lock carrier to keep everything in position.

Then it's a case of just following instructions as in the video above to remove and refit the timing belt. That part of the job is very straightforward, and took me no more than 40 minutes including draining coolant and replacing water pump (actually it took about 10 minutes more than it should, as I accidentally picked up the old belt and refitted at first - got almost to the point of tensioning before I realised).

The belt and tensioner I removed weren't that old. I suspected that since the car had been 'Approved Used' sold by Skoda last year that it may have been done, and it looked like it was. However, the idler hadn't been replaced and was showing signs of the factory fill grease being thrown out of the seal - so I'm glad I did the job now. The water pump also appeared new, but was a genuine VAG part with the plastic impeller. I replaced the coolant at the same time.

I didn't remove the entire viscous fan drum, just unbolted the fan from the drum itself via the four fixings on the fan. There is just enough clearance to remove the alternator tensioner bolt past the drum this way - it's close but entirely doable. Don't think it really saves any time doing it like this, but it is slightly easier than removing the fixing through the rear of the mounting web which I looked at and couldn't really be bothered with - lazy!

Having got everything back together and re-tensioned, the camwheel was in a slightly different position on the slotted holes to before. Looking at the tensioner which was on the car, it seemed to have been put on a little tight - I'm happier with how it is now and it's spot on tension wise.

Interestingly, the car now starts better and the armrest no longer vibrates at idle. I can't really explain that other than by the fact that the timing must have been fractionally different before the change - it can only have been a tiny amount but there's definitely an improvement, which I wasn't expecting.

If I was to do it again, I reckon start to finish I could do it in three hours which is not bad considering the amount of dis/re-assembly involved.

[WRCSixtyThree]

Just a quick addition since I've had a couple of other thoughts:

• If you're doing it, buy a 6mm long-reach allen key - it's easier to work around than a Torx bit when setting the tensioner.
  
• Spend £15 or so on the locking tools from eBay. I bought item number 320965695470 and it was fine. No point spending more.
  
• Replace the serpentine belt and A/C belt at the same time. I didn't, which I should have done - as it turned out the serpentine belt was almost new, and the A/C belt was in very good condition, but if I were doing it again, I would replace them as a matter of course as they're pennies.
  
• Take the opportunity to drain and replace the coolant, as the access to radiator bottom hose and drain tap is very good with the lock carrier pulled.