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How to remove stuck rear brake drums Felicia 1.3


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#1 PaulWalls

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Posted 16 January 2013 - 15:41

Hi, I would appreciate any help on how to remove the brake drums of a Felicia 1.3 GLX. I have seen some videos on youtube where you must hammer the drums but I am afraid to brake something. How about using 12 x 70 mm bolts to release the drums? Thanks.

#2 KenONeill

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Posted 16 January 2013 - 16:24

This is usually fairly standard irrespective of exact model:-
  • Jack up car and support on axle stands
  • Back off rear brake adjusters as far as possible
  • Give the backplate a sharp tap near the wheel cylinder to get the shoes to retract.
  • The drums should now pull off (using a puller if necessary).
On some models, it is necessary to remove the outer wheel bearing in order to remove the drum.

In a few extremely extreme cases I've heard of drums being so worn that you can't retract the shoes far enough to pull the drum off.

#3 djaychela

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Posted 16 January 2013 - 19:23

The adjusters aren't accessible from the outside, it's a little serrated wedge that forces one of the struts open. On one of the many Fel's I broke I needed to get the drums off, and the only way was to lever them off against the back plate as the drum had worn enough for the shoes to be inside a recess (about 1mm). Not that easy, but not that hard. In my experience, hammering them will be a waste of time, you need to progressively wedge them from each side of the drum in turn to get it off. I had one that was so worn that the only way I could get them off was to destroy the spring hold-down hardware (from the back of the brake plate) to allow the shoes to 'hinge' a bit to get it off. I think Tom would refer to this as "pikeying" it, and so would I! Did the job though, the hold-down hardware was only a couple of quid.

#4 adurer

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 04:06

Felicia drum brakes never get seized from rust only (as you saw on youtube), so you don't need to bash them a lot with a hammer.
When too much or uneven worn out, drums form an inner ridge (lip) that might prevent shoes to slide past it.
In any case you have to use a proper screwdriver to pry UP a small springed wedge that keeps shoes close to drum.
See photos below for rear LEFT wheel. Front of the car is to the left.
Posted Image
PRY UP

Posted Image
WEDGE DETAIL INSIDE

Edited by adurer, 17 January 2013 - 04:16.

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#5 adurer

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Posted 18 January 2013 - 07:13

Inspired by daverapid's like, I got out 4 more photos from my goody-packed vault.
I believe they are self explanatory.

Posted Image

Posted Image

Posted Image

BRAKE DONE. READY TO PUT DRUM BACK ON.
Posted Image
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#6 PaulWalls

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 22:37

Thank you very much for your support. I would try to "paraphrase you" so I can understand the procedure in my own words:

You suggest to use a screwdriver (like in the first photo) to attempt to release one of the ends of the springs that support the shoes, by doing so, the pressure of the shoes against the drum will be loosened and I will be able to remove it. Is it correct?

I am sorry but since I am not a English native speaker, it takes some time for me to understand. Thanks anyway.

#7 PaulWalls

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 22:55

Ok I think I got it. I have to use the screwdriver as a lever and try to move it up (not the spring) but the tip of a mechanism that will release the pressure of the shoes. OK I am not an expert mechanic but I love to learn.

#8 PaulWalls

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 23:08

I am glad you guys have the same car as mine. I've got many many questions. Breakes are just the tip of the iceberg. The next issue we must talk about is why my car is so weak. I have performed a engine rebuild 3 months ago with the hope it will get better, but it is still the same, I have cleaned the carburetor, I have checked the electric system. The spark-plugs are always covered with carbon, I have to clean them regularly. Additionally, this little monster is sucking too much fuel and for being a 1.3 liters engine, it so so dissapointed, it is sucking my wallet out and I don't like that! But I still don't want to give up, I still think is a good car, my wife is really mad at me, blaming me all the time for such a bad purchase, she wants to sell it ASAP.

#9 adurer

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 05:18

Create a new topic and I will tell you how to fix your carburetor to get normal consumption. If you can, upload on youtube a video showing your engine running at idle.

Inicia un nuevo tema y yo le dirá cómo arreglar el carburador para conseguir un consumo normal.. Si puede, sube a youtube un video que muestra el motor en marcha al ralentí.

Edited by adurer, 20 January 2013 - 05:23.


#10 PaulWalls

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 22:14

Adurer thank you very much for your support. Creating a video and uploading on youtube is not possible at the time. Thanks anyway.

#11 TeflonTom

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 22:21

Thanks for those pictures of the rear drums adurer. these will help somebody out for sure...

#12 adurer

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 03:41

Adurer thank you very much for your support. Creating a video and uploading on youtube is not possible at the time. Thanks anyway.

We can solve it even without that video, if you give us as many details as possible.
I repaired many carburetor cars in Warsaw. They used to 'drink' 16-17 liters/100 km (16 MPG !!) exactly like yours.
But I feel your wife won the match... :)

#13 adurer

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 03:58

Thanks for those pictures of the rear drums adurer. these will help somebody out for sure...

No problem. Like I said, I have in my jewish lair :) tons of photos and illustrations about Felicia.
I prefer posting annotated images, rather than writing. Guess I'm kind of lazy :think:

#14 PaulWalls

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 14:17

I will iniciate a new post. I am thinking to provide more information about my carburetor with photos.

#15 KenONeill

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 14:24

I will iniciate a new post. I am thinking to provide more information about my carburetor with photos.

Pall, given where you live, could you indicate whether or not your car's previous owner lived at a significantly different altitude when you do?

#16 PaulWalls

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 01:08

Yes, In fact I live at 2,850 meters over sea level, that's very high! And the former owner of this car surely lived at the same altitude, by judging at the car's number plate that belongs to where I reside.</p>

#17 KenONeill

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 11:49

Yes, In fact I live at 2,850 meters over sea level, that's very high! And the former owner of this car surely lived at the same altitude, by judging at the car's number plate that belongs to where I reside.</p>

That's ok then; I was thinking in terms of, if the car had come in from the coast, or down from even higher, you needed to retune the mixture and timing but if it's been kept local to you that doesn't apply, so it's just fault diagnosis and finding.

#18 PaulWalls

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 17:24

Hey, I've been trying to remove those stupid brake drums without any result, in fact I use a screwdriver as lever to push up the mechanism with that spring and what I caused is a new problem: the spring fell off inside the drum and now the shoes don't work (which worries me a lot!) and you can hear a sound of the spring rolling with the drum when you drive the car. The brakes are weaker, I have to be very careful!

I hammered the bloody drum for half an hour and nothing! I even use a couple of 12x60mm bolts to get sufficient pressure to release the drum and I think I've worsen the situation! Now I'm really preocupied, what if I broke something inside! I think I am missing something regarding a big nut "remove the large nut and split pin holding the drum on" (I don't understand this part), which nut? the one that is on the wheel axis?

#19 PaulWalls

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 17:31

"On some models, it is necessary to remove the outer wheel bearing in order to remove the drum". Is that what I've been missing?

#20 adurer

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 21:38

It is not a good idea to drive your car with that spring moving inside....

Here is how to get brake drum out.

1) Remove cap 9. Use a rubber hammer to loosen it, then a screwdriver to pry it off
2) Remove split pin 8
3) Remove castellated element 10
4) Unscrew nut 7
5) Pull out drum 5. Bearing 6 and washer 11 will come out when doing that.

Posted Image

#21 PaulWalls

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 02:11

Thanks Adurer you are my hero! Very clear explanation. I will do it first thing tomorrow. MUCHAS GRACIAS AMIGO!

#22 adurer

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 10:56

De nada.

#23 PaulWalls

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 02:59

Hey, guess what folks, I FINALLY DID IT! Thanks to the last illustration provided by Adurer, I am very happy! But I had the brilliant (or stupid perhaps) idea of removing the old black dirty grease with a brush and gasoline. I cleaned the drum very carefully, and I greased it again using a darkblue-color grease: ABRO HIGHEST GRADE, #3 Synthetic lithium grease, NLGI 3, penetrating range 220-250, dropping point 288ºC, viscosity index 145. I hope I didn't use the wrong grease!

I couldn't remove the shoes, it was very difficult, the horizontal tension springs were very hard to move away but the shoes seem to be in a still good condition (????), you need to see them by yourselves through a photo. Perhpas if Mr. Adurer can explain us how to release the shoes I will do it next time.

The tension spring that I have previously broken was there, but without one of its ends, I just had to use the same one streching it (sorry it was Sunday!) so it reached a hole on the lower part of the left shoe. A big horizontal tension spring that joints the shoes below, was affected by the 12x60mm bolt that I clumsily used to release the drum!

I think some grease leaked into the drum because at the beginning I couldn't notice any improvement, but after driving a while, the brakes worked wonderfully!

#24 adurer

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 08:42

You didn't mention what is wrong with rear brakes. You only asked for help to remove a stuck drum.

#25 adurer

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 11:22

Mr. Albrecht Durer B) uploaded a tutorial on uploading and sharing photos.

http://www.briskoda....hen-share-them/

#26 PaulWalls

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 13:39

Yeah I didn't mention why I wanted to check the brakes.

Well when I am doing 70 km/h or more I feel a rapid unconfortable vibration on the steering wheel and in the car, when I am driving at lower speeds, I don't have that vibration.

Another reason is curiosity and the need of learning. I just wanted to check how my rear brakes were. I wanted to see it by myself.

Adurer could you comment on the grease I used? Is it everything ok?

#27 KenONeill

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 14:11

Vibrations under braking, particularly if they're coming back through the steering, are more likely to be in the front brakes than the rear ones.

Starting with visual checks, examine the discs for any evidence of big rust patches in, or for deep scores running around, the polished swept area that the brake pads bite on. If either of these exist, you should replace both the discs and the pads. Incidentally, you can replace the pads without needing new discs, but not the other way around.

If the discs look ok, swap the wheels front to rear. If the vibration goes away or moves to the back, it's caused by one of a damaged tyre or bent wheel (now one of the 2 rears). Inspection should show which.

If that hasn't worked, you need to measure the disc run-out using a dial guage. You almost certainly don't have one yourself, and it's not worth buying one if you don't have regular use for it. Ask a garage, and if they give you a straight answer that involves about half an hour's work, then get them to do it. This might show up an out of tolerance run-out, in which case the hubs and disc mounting flanges need cleaned or the discs are warped, or it might not which would suggest pad residues on the disc swept areas.

In the last of those cases, you might be able to fix it with some abrasive-faced pads, and then using the handbrake rather than the foot brake when stopped in traffic.

#28 adurer

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 15:05

Well when I am doing 70 km/h or more I feel a rapid unconfortable vibration on the steering wheel and in the car, when I am driving at lower speeds, I don't have that vibration.


I understand that he is having a vibration in steering wheel at speeds over 70 km/h WITHOUT ANY BRAKING INVOLVED.

That is not related to brake system. Probable causes are:
- bad tires (imperfections)
- wheels not balanced
- lug nuts loose
- missing counterweight on longer CV axle (the passenger side one)
- bad wheels alignment (toe angle) or car has the chassis bent from an accident
- very badly worn CV axles

The grease is good. Do NOT let any grease on brake surfaces! Use a brake cleaner spray.

Edited by adurer, 28 January 2013 - 15:06.


#29 KenONeill

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Posted 28 January 2013 - 15:37

I understand that he is having a vibration in steering wheel at speeds over 70 km/h WITHOUT ANY BRAKING INVOLVED.
{snip}

I mis-read the OP; I'd agree about the likely causes of vibrations at speed, with the notes that:-
  • Loose lug (wheel) nuts usually make a deep rumble as well as vibrating.
  • Worn CV joints are normally noisy as well, and will be noiser when going round corners regardless of road speed.


#30 Maged_samy

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 19:37

You can use spring pliers

Posted Image

you can view this vedio :