Would Adblue put you off another diesel

[ernieb]

If I had the choice I'd take the ad blue over the old non ad blue.

 

Agreed, at least the AdBlue seems to be doing it's job and is relatively a low cost addition.  

[Rooted]

re post #198,

Once a year filling up if you do not drive many miles a year, others might need to fill up twice or 3 times a year if they buy a diesel because they cover the sort of miles that many drive a diesel to cover.

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/376945-actual-adblue-usage

 

See the variety of Ad-blue tank sizes in VW vehicles.

http://volkswagen.co.uk/technology/diesel/adblue

Edited 15 October, 2016 by Offski

[Jimrod]

re post #198,

Once a year filling up if you do not drive many miles a year, others might need to fill up twice or 3 times a year if they buy a diesel because they cover the sort of miles that many drive a diesel to cover.

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/376945-actual-adblue-usage

 

Exactly, I do about 10k a year, I'm on my second warning at 8850 after 10.5 months use, the first was at 4017. It's already more of an annoyance than it should be due to the fiddly nature of topping it up, the Adblue tank is tiny compared to other cars using it too.

[bluecar1]

Food for thought....................................

 

http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/future-cars/news/a31097/german-government-votes-to-ban-internal-combustion-engines-by-2030/

 

this is why the car companies are making the push to hybrids as the first step as current EV's don't have the range yet,

 

battery tech is not there yet at a reasonable price but give it another 5-10 years and we may be there

 

in the mean time hybrid I believe will start to take over from diesel due to better low down torque of the electric motor and the mpg of a diesel or better (and VW dieselgate didn't help)

 

THat's interesting, but of course will leave millions of legacy vehicles still polluting so it will be a tapper down effect unless there are substantial buy back schemes? 

 

the problem will be what will happen to the opec countries who's whole economy is based on oil and cars, and HM gov who depend on the tax from fuel

Edited 15 October, 2016 by bluecar1

[VAGCF]

Yes, I've been having a discussion with colleagues at work as to how the government will replace the lost revenues from petrol and diesel if and when folks start moving to electric in greater numbers.

Coming up with a fair system will be very difficult.

[Llanigraham]

Simple, we'll all pay more tax another way.

[bigjohn]

Exactly, I do about 10k a year, I'm on my second warning at 8850 after 10.5 months use, the first was at 4017. It's already more of an annoyance than it should be due to the fiddly nature of topping it up, the Adblue tank is tiny compared to other cars using it too.

 

On some cars you can specify an optional bigger Adblue tank - eg Audi A4

[bigjohn]

I've moved back to petrol for various reasons - including avoiding DPF & car was much cheaper.

 

Next - probably not diesel (not 100% sure though) , but possibly a hybrid of some sort. I have a four friends who run these and they have all been impressed (two Toyota Prius, Toyota Auris & Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV). It's not just the economy that has caught my attention (the Auris is stunning on a long run) but other factors such as refinement, brakes last over 100k due to regenerative braking.

The Mitsubishi is also interesting where the car runs solely on electricity on my friends commute with electric motors on both front and rear axles with a clutch feed to directly engage engine at speed (no gearbox) - not just driving a generator

 

The big issue I have with the Prius and Auris is they are pug ugly 

[Expatman]

this is why the car companies are making the push to hybrids as the first step as current EV's don't have the range yet,

battery tech is not there yet at a reasonable price but give it another 5-10 years and we may be there

in the mean time hybrid I believe will start to take over from diesel due to better low down torque of the electric motor and the mpg of a diesel or better (and VW dieselgate didn't help)

the problem will be what will happen to the opec countries who's whole economy is based on oil and cars, and HM gov who depend on the tax from fuel

[Expatman]

So where is the electricity to come from? To get zero emissions can't use any fossil fuel generated electricity so unless there is a step change in renewable sources then this won't happen.

[Llanigraham]

So where is the electricity to come from? To get zero emissions can't use any fossil fuel generated electricity so unless there is a step change in renewable sources then this won't happen.

 

Quite!

As much as many hate it, the only option appears to be nuclear.

I do think we could do a lot more with hydro.

[Jimrod]

I've moved back to petrol for various reasons - including avoiding DPF & car was much cheaper.

 

Next - probably not diesel (not 100% sure though) , but possibly a hybrid of some sort. I have a four friends who run these and they have all been impressed (two Toyota Prius, Toyota Auris & Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV). It's not just the economy that has caught my attention (the Auris is stunning on a long run) but other factors such as refinement, brakes last over 100k due to regenerative braking.

The Mitsubishi is also interesting where the car runs solely on electricity on my friends commute with electric motors on both front and rear axles with a clutch feed to directly engage engine at speed (no gearbox) - not just driving a generator

 

The big issue I have with the Prius and Auris is they are pug ugly 

 

Exactly, the problem with diesels now is that they're becoming more and more strangled, especially the VW ones (BMW still seem to make nice ones though) - you had the EGR valve to start, then DPF to solve problems with that and now Adblue for that, it's getting more and more complicated (ie. expensive to repair) so it seems the boom in diesels of the last 10 years may be coming to an end. Petrols are now getting seriously good too - better economy and power from ever-smaller capacities.

 

I'm on a lease until December 2017 so may well give the Tesla model 3 a look if it's out then, pure electric like that seems to work better than hybrid and the range is ever-improving. There's now available tech to essentially double the capacity of Li-ion batteries (or halve the size for same output) which is basically ready to go, it's also safer and less likely to explode! Once that's in common use I think electic cars will really start to gain ground - 500 mile range will be viable, plenty for most!

Edited 15 October, 2016 by Jimrod

[bigjohn]

Quite!

As much as many hate it, the only option appears to be nuclear.

I do think we could do a lot more with hydro.

 

Indeed Electricity generation source is a big fundamental issue, the other one availability/consistency/reliability  and standardisation(all makes seem to be different!) of charging points 

 

Before the above is sorted I'll probably just move to tried and tested hybrid technologies - I can't comment on the Outlander yet (newish) but all the people I know with Toyota hybrids have found them to be very economical and supremely reliable although I don't think they will suit every driver type   

Edited 15 October, 2016 by bigjohn

[bigjohn]

 Petrols are now getting seriously good too - better economy and power from ever-smaller capacities.

 

 

 

I'll also keep an eye on the VAG petrol technology as current higher capital or lease costs ruled out hybrid technology when I bought my Superb last year. We shall see next time around.

 

My previous gen EA111 1.4 has been impressive in real life (performance, refinement& economy), so presumably the EA211 1.4(ACT) or the soon to be launched 1.5 should be a step up although the GPF will be with us next year

Edited 15 October, 2016 by bigjohn

[VAGCF]

Simple, we'll all pay more tax another way.

I know that Graham, but how?

Increasing income tax has for many years been avoided by governments and folks who don't run cars won't be happy subsidising those that do wherever the tax is collected.

[bluecar1]

I've moved back to petrol for various reasons - including avoiding DPF & car was much cheaper.

 

Next - probably not diesel (not 100% sure though) , but possibly a hybrid of some sort. I have a four friends who run these and they have all been impressed (two Toyota Prius, Toyota Auris & Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV). It's not just the economy that has caught my attention (the Auris is stunning on a long run) but other factors such as refinement, brakes last over 100k due to regenerative braking.

The Mitsubishi is also interesting where the car runs solely on electricity on my friends commute with electric motors on both front and rear axles with a clutch feed to directly engage engine at speed (no gearbox) - not just driving a generator

 

The big issue I have with the Prius and Auris is they are pug ugly 

my 12 reg GLII was the first diesel I had with a DPF and the last, I replaced it last year with a 1.2 petrol Hyundai i20 after having driven diesels for 20 years

 

my next car will be a hybrid, if you are looking at a prius, have a look at the Hyundai Ioniq, due in showrooms 27th / 28th October, £3k cheaper than prius and more plain but not fugly like the new prius

 

the other thing looking at this what will happen to the 2nd hand diesel market?

 

you also have the Kodiaq coming out later this year, but no hybrid, skoda risk getting left behind by sticking with diesels

[VAGCF]

Exactly, the problem with diesels now is that they're becoming more and more strangled, especially the VW ones (BMW still seem to make nice ones though) - you had the EGR valve to start, then DPF to solve problems with that and now Adblue for that, it's getting more and more complicated (ie. expensive to repair) so it seems the boom in diesels of the last 10 years may be coming to an end. Petrols are now getting seriously good too - better economy and power from ever-smaller capacities.

 

I'm on a lease until December 2017 so may well give the Tesla model 3 a look if it's out then, pure electric like that seems to work better than hybrid and the range is ever-improving. There's now available tech to essentially double the capacity of Li-ion batteries (or halve the size for same output) which is basically ready to go, it's also safer and less likely to explode! Once that's in common use I think electic cars will really start to gain ground - 500 mile range will be viable, plenty for most!

I don't think its all good news with petrol though? There's been comments that even those will begin to get more complicated to reduce emissions/particulates further.

Probably still a better choice though than diesel.

I've had a succession of diesels and love this one but will probably go petrol again when I replace the Yeti and will have a good look at hybrid and electric.

[bluecar1]

I recon give it 5-10 years you will see houses with solar panels charging a large battery  which then dump power into a car overnight, with the option to top up off mains when not enough sun

 

that would be true zero carbon motoring

[Ryeman]

It seems 'freeways' are likely to become tollled over time as motoring taxes move to annual mileage driven and perhaps cars have a transponder also.

Don't worry, they're on to it.

Petrol is getting DPFs v soon.

[Urrell]

I recon give it 5-10 years you will see houses with solar panels charging a large battery  which then dump power into a car overnight, with the option to top up off mains when not enough sun

 

that would be true zero carbon motoring

Not quite as you would have to factor in the carbon produced in manufacturing, transportation and installation of the solar panels, batteries and associated control gear.

[Ryeman]

I recon give it 5-10 years you will see houses with solar panels charging a large battery which then dump power into a car overnight, with the option to top up off mains when not enough sun

that would be true zero carbon motoring

We haven't paid an electricity (or any other energy) bill since we extended our panels.

The credit we build up over three seasons more than pays for winter.

Going off grid is inevitable once storage prices start coming down.

Tesla even suggests the option to using the car storage to reverse power the house if needed.

Edited 15 October, 2016 by Ryeman

[Llanigraham]

I know that Graham, but how?

Increasing income tax has for many years been avoided by governments and folks who don't run cars won't be happy subsidising those that do wherever the tax is collected.

 

Don't know, but we can be assured of one thing, the poor will get poorer!

[Ryeman]

A full explanation of the workings of SCR using ad blue - 90% reduction in NOx

http://www.dieselforum.org/about-clean-diesel/what-is-scr

[gumdrop]

I don't understand the aversion to Ad-blu, it is

a feature of nearly every manufacturers cars

nowadays

[bluecar1]

I don't understand the aversion to Ad-blu, it is

a feature of nearly every manufacturers cars

nowadays

SCR is yet another expensive system to go wrong and needs regular infusions ad blu (all be it cheap at the moment until HMGov realise the more miles you do the more you use? nice way to tax high milers with efficient engines?)

 

yet another restriction in the exhaust system strangling performance and reducing fuel economy (not as bad as DPF though )

 

all these systems are great when the car is under warranty,

 

But how expensive is it when it goes wrong and SCR cat needs replacing?