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Fabia power steering warning light advice please


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hi everyone

ive been reading through posts on this very informative site for some time and now seeking some advice please

I purchased a 2001 skoda fabia 1.9tdi with full service history about 4 months ago and other than a sticking rear brake from sitting for while everything else seems ok ,that is until the last couple weeks wet and colder weather ,after not using the car for a few days I drove a mile or so to the shops in the evening and the steering warning lamp came on but no loss of steering power

so next day I decided to remove the steering rack sensor and as it slid out dirty water poured out so obviously not great ! I notice the sensor was changed to the newer metal case design 2 years ago and also a new power steering pump fitted

I thoroughly dried and carefully cleaned the sensor then blasted out any remaining moisture from the cavity it slides into before refitting ,on driving the car I noticed the steering felt better at speed as when I purchased it felt very light and vague at speed which I now presume was caused by the water in the sensor causing the pump to activate when it shouldn't have ,I then drove the car for about 20 mins around town before going up a long steep hill at which point the warning light once again came on ,so I turned off the engine and then restarted it and have used the car for a week or so with no issues until this evening when after a short journey to the shops the light again came on

on restarting it again went out and didn't come on when using the car later on

ive read all the posts I can find here regarding power steering issues but couldn't find anything quite the same as I'm experiencing

so far I have:

removed and cleaned sensor and checked cable for any damage

removed and cleaned up all earth lead connections including the one under inner arches

checked steering rack fluid level ( all ok and clean )

checked electric connectors to the pump itself

removed wiper motor ect to thoroughly clean out scuttle drainage holes

checked voltages at battery which appear to be ok and car starts fine though I understand this doesn't guarantee battery is good

 

at no point so far has the power steering stopped working even when the light comes on ,any ideas or advice would be much appreciated !

thanks

Edited by turtlepower
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Welcome to the forums, You could do with having it scanned with VCDS which will pickup any faults in the system, save the log and clear the fault memory to see if anything reappears as it could be the g250 sensor which I believe are about £80 (ouch), other than that it could be the vanes that the g250 sences  in the steering rack which involves changing the whole rack (which we have just done 3 times on my sons car !) so hopefully now its alright. cheers Stuart

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hi Stuart

thanks for the reply , I'm hoping its not the sensor as this was replaced a couple years ago with the newer metal case version though it could be the water ingress has damaged it ! the vanes in the rack sounds a bit of a nightmare so really hope its not that !

does the VCDS come with software or is there free software available to download ?

thanks

lee

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From what you are describing it's either the sensor/sensor cable or something inside the pump that's it's not working properly causing bad communication with the sensor.

I can't understand how water gets inside the sensor...

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I can't understand how water gets inside the sensor...

 

I think it's more a case of water getting into the cavity that the sensor fits in. There should be a gasket or O-ring there.

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hi dm222

thanks for the reply ,today I removed the sensor again to see if any more water had found its way in which it doesn't appear to have but I decided to blow dry it with a hairdryer ,on reinstalling the sensor the warning light now comes on when turning the ignition key then goes out and then comes on straight away as the engine starts and stays on

so I decided to disconnect the sensor at the pump and see what happens ,the steering feels exactly the same without it connected as in heavier than it originally was but not as it would be with no assistance ,ive read the pump runs constantly at low power then boosts power when turning and receiving signal from sensor , so does this mean the pump is running as it should and giving some assistance and is ok to drive for now ?

as TMB says its water getting into the cavity that holds the sensor ,I think the problem was that at some point the steering rack had been removed and on reinstalling the rubber shroud that goes over the lip on the rack a couple inches above the sensor had been squashed up rather than lipped over so allowing any water that ran over that area to seep into the sensor cavity ,when I first removed the sensor the cavity was full of rusty coloured water which would have been enough to submerge the sensor

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Can be either the sensor or the pump, I would replace first the sensor since it's cheaper, easier to change and seems that removing it and installing it again changed your symptoms.

 

There is no way to know what it causing the problem without vcds and even with vcds in this particular case most errors can be caused by the sensor or the pump for example I had this errors and the problem was the pump but they can also happen if the sensor is bad:

 

00816 - Power Steering Sensor (G250): Short to Ground

00816 - Power Steering Sensor (G250): Faulty
 

My symptoms were like yours, but in my case sometimes all assistance was gone others it was just heavier like in your case, and eventually after some miles all the assistance was gone for good.

 

Just an advice, at this times we have a tendency to start and stop the car many times in a row, I would not do that, from my experience it's a bad idea. Wait between starts.

Edited by dm222
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i will hopefully get it hooked up to friends laptop with vag-com in the next couple days and see what that comes up with ,I'm more used to dealing with mechanical issues with cars to be honest so finding this pretty frustrating to figure out !

it still drives fine at the moment just a bit heavier steering which isn't to much of an issue ,hopefully it will keep working like this until i can figure out the fault and fix it !

is there any particular place that would be best to purchase a sensor from ?

thanks for the advice

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Seems to me that you first need to stop any more water ingress.

Items 20 and maybe 14 here required?

(I'll just re-look-up that for 2001, my default is 2005). One moment.

 

Not sure if any differences, but this is the equivalent page for 2001.

Edited by Wino
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hi thank you for the information

yes quite agree ,on mine I cant see pt 14 as this area is covered by a rubber cowling that slopes out from the bulkhead and then lips over the rack were pt 14 is shown in the diagram so I'm not sure if that's all that's there or if pt 14 is somehow hidden under this cowling ? the cowling was squashed up and not lipped over which ive now rectified and was hoping that was the original cause of the water getting in

could you tell me if it should be possible to separate the sensor from the cable on a sensor like the one pictured ( its the same as mine ) it appears that it should unplug but doesn't seem to want to so didn't want to force it without being sure, I just wanted to be able to test the cable for any issues

3305teo.jpg

Edited by turtlepower
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It's not possible to separate. You need to replace the whole thing.

There are two versions the other one you can remove the cable but this one is all one part, you have to buy an identical to the one you have as they are not compatible between them.

 

 

Seems to me that you first need to stop any more water ingress.

Items 20 and maybe 14 here required?

(I'll just re-look-up that for 2001, my default is 2005). One moment.

 

Not sure if any differences, but this is the equivalent page for 2001.

 

Good point, this stuf:

is_191107_rizeni-trw-xs-6q1423061m.jpg

Edited by dm222
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thanks for the replies

on further investigation I found the rubber gasket pt14 was not fitted correctly and not lipped over the rack housing properly and just squashed in to place at an angle on top of it so offering very little protection to water ingress so my guess would be the rack has been replaced at some point and for some reason the rubber gasket wasn't located correctly before tightening up the bolts

ive now lowered the subframe and refitted the gasket pt14 correctly so hopefully that will have solved the water ingress into the sensor cavity issue, where are these gaskets available from should I end up needing to fit a new one ?

thanks

Edited by turtlepower
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hi wino , it didn't appear to be damaged so hopefully its solved the problem of water getting in the cavity ,so now trying to hunt down a sensor at a reasonable price ,is there any where that's recommended to get one from ?

just rang the local skoda dealer and they want £150 exchange which seems pretty steep !

spoke to a guy in there parts department who said the problem could be the engine wiring loom is knackered !! though ive not heard of this anywhere before so not sure if its anything to worry about ?

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I think the part number you need is 6Q2423291A or the same with an X on the end (which just means your old one may be required in exchange).  Ebay has a new one at a distinct saving compared to what you've been quoted, and is on a best offer so you may even be able to get it cheaper still. Here.

 

I don't see the relevance of the engine wiring loom, I think that sounds like a herring of reddish hue.

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yes that sounds the correct part number ill take a look at the one on ebay thanks

he was on about water ingress into the front loom causing random issues and then requiring the complete front loom to need replacing for £1100 !!!

as you say I don't really see the relevance to my situation

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well local motor factors say they can supply a angle sensor for £81 outright though I don't think this is a vag original supplied item ,though it would be coming from Germany I'm told so not sure if its just the same part without the branding ? has anyone else used one like this ?

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It may well be that your motor factor is selling the very same item from the same factory. I'm not much of a gambler though, so I'd spend the extra £15 or whatever for the genuine one on ebay. 

 

Buuuuut. Wait and see whether your re-seating of the top seal results in things starting to behave properly again, having hopefully excluded water.

 

I seem to think the sensor works on capacitance, and water would really confuse matters for the sensor. Take away the wet and it may be completely OK again.

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unfortunately the sensor doesn't appear to be working at all now and steering warning light has been on last several days , the power steering is still working but at less assistance than would be normal ,I even disconnected the sensor and this had no further effect ,having researched the system as best I can it appears the pump runs at low speed constantly and then uses the sensor to boost up speed and assistance when turning hard ect ,so my system appears to be running at the fixed lower speed and getting no signal from the sensor so feels a bit heavier than it should especially at low speed but its not lost all assistance at any point 

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unfortunately the sensor doesn't appear to be working at all now and steering warning light has been on last several days , the power steering is still working but at less assistance than would be normal ,I even disconnected the sensor and this had no further effect ,having researched the system as best I can it appears the pump runs at low speed constantly and then uses the sensor to boost up speed and assistance when turning hard ect ,so my system appears to be running at the fixed lower speed and getting no signal from the sensor so feels a bit heavier than it should especially at low speed but its not lost all assistance at any point 

 

I would try to change the sensor

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Sometimes, and quite often the problem is deeper than you might think.

I myself had the same problems that the steering was not working. In fact, I solved it by buying a used part was replaced.

I have not opened the old pump yet but I think the problem is the same style as in this link will be displayed ..

http://www.elektroda.pl/rtvforum/topic1472480.html

When the circuit board is broken so VCDS can give almost anything, depending on the fault code which place is broken printed circuit board.

I got a fault code G250 sensor which was indeed quite functional .... This was revealed when I changed the new pump to replace ....

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thanks to everyone for the info and replies

ive purchased a new original sensor which will take a few days to arrive and fingers crossed hopefully will solve the issue !

I will update with the results when its fitted

Edited by turtlepower
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