2.0TDi PD140 turbo dying (now How to upgrade to a hybrid turbo)

[Antimus]

No worries. The biggest issue is getting a trusted place to sort the work for you.

For this setup and running slightly more power, average fuel economy won't be affected. Especially not if you choose to maintain the standard map. In fact, engine mapping set to take account of the hybrid unit would see your economy on a run increase. The only time I've seen economy diminish is when I had my Fabia set up to make fuller use of the hybrid setup, plus an FMIC. That was mapped upto 220bhp but average economy was still 45mpg, compared with 48mpg average when I had it at stage 1 power, or around 175bhp. Not a bad trade-off I would say...

I am liking the sound of this immensely. Just need that quote back from DD. or to find a local specialist. Anyone know somewhere trustworthy around Yorkshire area? the fact I'm willing to travel to Derby to DD is telling I'd imagine

[Wardy]

RS Tuning in Leeds spring to mind. Their maps are reputable as well.

http://www.rstuning.co.uk/

[Stuart_J]

Also look for a lowish mileage s/hand one. I bought one earlier this year for a Petrol VRS for £100, still going perfectly. NOTE they come matched to a manifold as will a new one so make sure you get that with it

Edited 24 August, 2011 by Stuart_J

[Antimus]

RS Tuning in Leeds spring to mind. Their maps are reputable as well.

http://www.rstuning.co.uk/

Just called them, they've quoted 5 hours at £45 +vat so £270, not including the map.

They also offered to convert my current turbo into a hybrid for £595, now given that I can get one from Turbo Technics for around £650 I'm assuming it's a better idea to stick with the TT one? mine's on it's way out so I'd rather not re-use parts from it.

He also said it's unlikely that the £650 one from TT is new as I'd be looking at over a grand for that? I hate being a newb in these situations, I've no idea if he's right or not...

Edited 24 August, 2011 by Antimus

[Wardy]

OK - that gives you some more info. Have you talked to TT direct yet? Yes, it's likely that the unit they'll sell at £650ish is a refurb unit, where they'll take it in, upgrade it, then supply it with warranty. That's the route I took.

Then you could always sell your old unit on, for someone who wants to send that off for re-building. You'll get some cash back that way, probably via eBay.

[vRS_Pagey]

Pretty useful?! Can't think what else you'll need to know....

Yes, that's just it yeah. Map adjustment is advisable, even if you don't want more power as the spooling characteristics of the hybrid is different, and will produce peak torque slightly later. But it is OK to leave it on the original map if you wanted. Obviously if you're going to remap anyway, the hybrid will give you access to more power, or produce stage-1 power more easily, with less effort. I'm going down the latter route, for info

Derv Doctor would be a good shout. And there are also other turbo companies who could oblige, aside from Turbo Technics. Turbo Dynamics, AET Turbos, CR Turbos - I contacted all of these and they each had options for the PD140 BKD. I chose Turbo Technics based on my mechanic's prior relationship with them, he was happy - and the warranty was decent too.

Cheers,

Steve

Funny you should say that.......STS and stage 1 ordered from Ben approximately 3 minutes ago!

[Antimus]

OK - that gives you some more info. Have you talked to TT direct yet? Yes, it's likely that the unit they'll sell at £650ish is a refurb unit, where they'll take it in, upgrade it, then supply it with warranty. That's the route I took.

Then you could always sell your old unit on, for someone who wants to send that off for re-building. You'll get some cash back that way, probably via eBay.

Yep spoke to TT directly, they sell their Hybrids on the basis you send your old one back to them after the swap. TT do a 2 year warranty... may find out what RS's warranty is though, may be worth getting it all done at the same place.

[Antimus]

Also look for a lowish mileage s/hand one. I bought one earlier this year for a Petrol VRS for £100, still going perfectly. NOTE they come matched to a manifold as will a new one so make sure you get that with it

Problem with that is the issue is with the quality of the turbo's that come with the Octavia TDI PD engines, some fail at 30k some at 70k I wouldn't want to buy a slightly used one and find out I got it near the end of it's life then have to go through this all over again in 6 months

[mcgiver]

Problem with that is the issue is with the quality of the turbo's that come with the Octavia TDI PD engines, some fail at 30k some at 70k I wouldn't want to buy a slightly used one and find out I got it near the end of it's life then have to go through this all over again in 6 months

Is there any bad years for turbos on tdi? I have never had a single problem with octavias tdi pd and i am driving a 2006 car with 120k mile. Is it a problem with more recent cars?

[Wardy]

It really is luck of the draw. Not very helpful I know, but I haven't yet come across a system or pattern to spot faults, or predict at what mileage/age they might occur. Driving style doesn't seem to help predict either...

[Antimus]

Let's just say I've lost my trust in the standard ones

[vRS_Pagey]

Let's just say I've lost my trust in the standard ones

Let us know how it turns out mate, be interested to know the total price for the conversion.....

EDIT: Just found this which could be a cheaper option if you decide against the hybrid. Or this which is a brand new unit and doesn't require an exchange.

[Antimus]

Me too! Will definitely update regularly

[matt_theforce]

My PD140 turbo failed at approx 55k in May 2010. Luckily mine was replaced under warranty, total bill on receipt was approx £800 for everything. The garage I bought the car from offered me the chance to upgrade to a Hybrid for the difference in turbo cost which was only £150 but I went for standard rebuild as I wasn't intending to mod the car.

15k later and the car now runs a stage1 map from Shark and I don't have any issues at all .

As Shark Performance are now doing servicing you could ask them what their prices are on fitting/mapping as they're not far from you if your in South Yorkshire

Matthew

[Antimus]

Didn't realise shark was doing service work too now, will call them tomorrow! Thanks

[matt_theforce]

Didn't realise shark was doing service work too now, will call them tomorrow! Thanks

Yes,

And the quote they gave me today was very well priced.

[Antimus]

Yes,

And the quote they gave me today was very well priced.

They've got that offer on at the moment what with the new premises move. Also Ben's a good bloke, talked to him a few times on here. Fingers crossed they'll do a turbo swap

[Antimus]

Ok, update on quotes I've got, not much info but it's something.

Derv Doctor still hasn't got back to me, will call him later, he's probably busy.

RS Tuning got back to me with a quote:

with them doing the hybrid turbo conversion

1225 excl vat (£1470)

With them using a turbo supplied by someone else (cost for them converting my turbo into a hybrid is (£595 excl vat)

£630 excl vat(£756)

Both of those include 5 hours labor at £45 per hour excl vat and the remap for the new turbo

Called Shark, they're going to get back to me with a quote this afternoon, said they could probably do me a deal with the STS included given it's a big job, hopefully they'll come back with a better quote.

Left a message on the turbo technics workshop number to get a quote for them fitting the turbo, though unless they can do a remap at the same time I doubt I'll be using them.

Edited 25 August, 2011 by Antimus

[Stuart_J]

Problem with that is the issue is with the quality of the turbo's that come with the Octavia TDI PD engines, some fail at 30k some at 70k I wouldn't want to buy a slightly used one and find out I got it near the end of it's life then have to go through this all over again in 6 months

failure is often due to driving style I think.

Ive bough 2 s/hand turbos in the past for Skodas & both have been fine, like you say its luck of the draw but if you hunt around you can get some really cheap ones. On the Octy 110 tdi I fitted one off a fabia VRS, car under 10K & the turbo was £70, OK about 4 years ago but its just a case of trawling around on forums like this & the smaller breakers who are just breakers & dont know the true value of parts. At those prices you can take a chance

Edited 25 August, 2011 by Stuart_J

[Antimus]

failure is often due to driving style I think.

Ive bough 2 s/hand turbos in the past for Skodas & both have been fine, like you say its luck of the draw but if you hunt around you can get some really cheap ones. On the Octy 110 tdi I fitted one off a fabia VRS, car under 10K & the turbo was £70, OK about 4 years ago but its just a case of trawling around on forums like this & the smaller breakers who are just breakers & dont know the true value of parts. At those prices you can take a chance

Maybe so, I'm not saying every turbo in the PD140 engines have the issue, there are thousands of members on briskoda, hundreds likely have an octy 2.0tdi PD140 and not all of them have had the issue. So driving style may be it, or it may be luck of the draw.

Everywhere I've read says the hybrid turbos are better, stronger, more durable. I'd rather spend the extra cash now than less now and risk even the small percentage chance of getting another problem like this.

It's all about perception, mine is now that the standard fitted turbos aren't up to scratch, through experience. Yours is the opposite, neither of us are wrong

Besides, I'm drooling at the thought of more power, don't tell the wife(to be) though.

[Stuart_J]

Besides, I'm drooling at the thought of more power, don't tell the wife(to be) though.

Im glad to see you are doing it for the right reasons

You wont regret it Im sure

[Antimus]

question, is it worth me doing all this to an engine that's already done 100k miles? I know modern engines are better wearing now but it is extra strain, could I actually do damage to other areas of the engine that will need more work doing?

That is a question for the garages true, but thought you guys may have an opinion

[g_tee]

Would be more concerned about the clutch if anything...

Engine block should be good for 200K I'd have thought, though not sure about long term longevity with a remap..

[Antimus]

Would be more concerned about the clutch if anything...

Engine block should be good for 200K I'd have thought, though not sure about long term longevity with a remap..

Yeah I'm not looking for an agressive map at the moment until I get a new clutch, so nowhere near the maximum for a hybrid turbo, whish is around 240bhp I think?

Quote from Derv Doctor, very nice prices! (Am confirming whether they are inc or exc vat at the moment.

As standard exchange turbo with 2 year warranty is:- £500 plus £175 to fit and £40 for gaskets, oil and filter. (£715 all in)

I offer the Hybrid Turbo package for £1150 all in fitted and map'd to suit.

Edit: they're including vat, woop

Edited 25 August, 2011 by Antimus

[gregoir]

JBS in Chesterfield are/were VW group tuning/service specialists. Close enough to South Yorkshire.....

Edited 25 August, 2011 by gregoir