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Petrol engines are due to start getting Gasoline Particulate Filters in the next couple of years. Direct Injection petrol engines have been found to be far 'dirtier' than the good old indirect systems were (up to 1,000 times worse). Expect an SCR equivalent to come along too :-(

If I had known how poor the mpg was on the 190 I would never have bought one. A friend of mine has an X6 M50d (3-litre triple turbo) and that produces better mpg! Something has gone seriously wrong with the way the emission controls have been implemented in these SCR equipped engines.

 

Correct - on petrol indirect/port injection engines production of particulates were classed as negligible but unfortunately a side effect of direct injection was MUCH higher production of particulates. With Euro 6 C "SOME" engines will need a GPF to achieve this.  Some engines still have port injection and some now have a mixture of port and direct injection. 

 

There are already petrol engines that have both port and direct injection (EG European spec VAG EA888) - these may not require GPF (they might be fitted with them anyway!)

 

As for SCR's on petrol - not yet heard of this one, YET!

Edited by bigjohn
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Seriously considered it but couldn't bear the extra visits to the fuel pump!

 

When I bought my Leon 1.4 TSi I was originally considering buying the 2.0 diesel version. Had diesels since 1996 and loved the torquey nature of the engines, modern 16 valve petrols are too much like hard work with the narrow power bands and constant gear changes to maintain decent progress off the motorways.

 

But having read a test of the new 1.4 TSi 140 I decided to give it a try and what a revelation. Better than any diesel I had owned/driven and £2000 less than the 150 PS diesel. I did some calcs based on 8,000 miles a year with an estimation of 45 mpg for the petrol and 53 mpg for the diesel, both the real world figures that were being reported at the time. I found both widely optimistic since the best i had ever seen over several years out of a petrol was 35 mpg and that was a much smaller less powerful car, the best i had got long term out of a diesel was my then car, a BMW 118D which had averaged just over 47 mpg for over 5 years.

 

3 1/2 years on I know I made the correct decision and that is why its a petrol Superb that will be sitting on my drive come March. The calculated mpg over that period has been just about deal on 45 so the reports for the petrol were correct, since Honest john's real mpg figure for the diesel is 53.6mpg I guess the 53 being reported at the time was realistic as well.

 

In those 3 1/2 years and 28,000 miles I have spent £3394 on petrol assuming a £1.20 average. If I had bought the diesel I would probably have spent about £2900, as saving of about £500. I might have got more in PX for the diesel car but doubt I would have got the £1500 necessary to break even.

 

Obviously a higher mileage user is going to save but its not as big a saving as many still expect. The 1.4 TSi engine is good enough in the real world to make the diesel redundant to all but the mega mileage users.

 

And no DPF to worry about and no potential bans in various parts of the country either.

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I've had various deisels for the last 12 years or so and they've got better and better. However this time I seriously considered a petrol for the pollution issues etc. My mileage is just on the balance - about 12000 miles - so it could have gone either way. After testing it was the torque that mattered as I tow a caravan and only the deisels gave me it unless I went silly with the petrol engine spec. I have towed with a petrol in the past but it was hard work and appalling fuel consumption.

Things are changing and in 5 years the decision may be different again. Until then, though, deisel it will have to be.

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  • 3 months later...

Can anyone post some details about the service bulletin and estimates of the off the road time?  I've just got the "ERROR Adblue no engine start in 650 miles". Spoken to local dealer and I felt I was reporting something unknown to them.  They can look at it a week from today and time to rectify was "possibly 2 days".  Adding to the pool of knowledge on this - last week the adblue range was over 6000 miles and the maxidot display had the error message along with  min and max top up 0.75 gallons.  Topped up the adblue and the error remains displayed but the top up has gone - so level sensors working??

The only good thing so far was the cost of adblue - local Case tractor dealer charged me 60p/litre (inc VAT) to fill my own container.  I'll try and find the adblue "where to buy" thread and post details there.

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Mine (and others) have had this.  No error code is logged on the fault system and in my case it cleared itself within 100 miles.  All I can think is something is blocking the pump so the system warns that it is running out of fluid.

 

This is not an unknown issue and the remedies have varied from it sorts itself out to the system needs bleeding through.  I have not had the error return and the only time it did it was about 1000 miles after being topped up, on a very cold morning.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Update on my Adblue error from 21/4.  3.5 days at the dealers.  All the adblue system "removed and checked" at Skoda's request. No difference and no issues found. Back to Skoda again who then  authorised a software update and problem fixed. Dealer says Skoda are only aware of one other instance of this problem.  

Whole affair has left me puzzled - Why not update the software first before removing tank, sensors and injectors (it was known that the tank level sensors were working and the pump was pressurising the system and the pressure was holding)? - unless Skoda have to buy software updates from VW.

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  • 2 weeks later...

My AdBlue system just fell over again with the 'Error.  No start in 650 miles......' warning.  It cleared itself after about 100 miles but it seems the system is at best fragile.  It does not bode well for anyone buying these cars once they are out of warranty!

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peter_K, who at a Dealership says 'Skoda are only aware of one other instance of this problem'?

 

He / She is a liar or is talking to someone at Skoda UK that is a liar or has no long term memory or access to a keyboard.

Always get them at 'Dealerships' to put in writing what they tell you, their job title and qualifications and the name of the person at Skoda they get information from and have them sign it.

Edited by Awayoffski
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There is no doubt that this fault is known - the AA recovery "VAG specialist" wasn't in the least surprised with his test results and stated that he believed that the diagnostic error of P207f00 although throwing the "no restart IN XXX miles" error message would not in fact prevent a restart at zero miles!!!! 

I believe that the "Service Reception" staff member believed what was said.  It seems to be the norm for reception staff to have little technical knowledge but that's not their fault - I presume the job description is formulated by the dealer.  In respect of Skoda UK and their instructions to the dealer as to the work performed I cannot make any factual comment other than observe that if a Windows PC threw an error I would look for a "software update solution" before spending 3 days taking the machine apart before spending less than 1/2 a day performing an update (called around 12:00 to say car ready and Skoda Technical Support opens at say 08:00) .   It may also be that the software update could have been a reversion to earlier VAG software and isn't the software version used to get "emissions certification" - hence the 3 days checking the system.

I have no previous experience of the Skoda brand to judge the experience but there did seem to be little interest in getting or recording the fault history from me ( only comparison is BMW service reception who ordered two replacement rear light clusters on the strength of two emailed photos of the condensation and summoned a mechanic to get details of an intermittent sat nav fault).

One identified failing was the provision of a loan car.  The AA report form stated "Dealer to arrange car via MOBEX" .  Dealer stated this was my responsibility - didn't bother discussing it, just rang the AA who rang back in 15 mins and told me that the dealer had been educated, given a 1hr deadline to ring me back and if no call was received to ring back the AA who would log a "compliance failure"(?) against the dealer and arrange a car for me.  

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Thanks for the link.  What I was trying to say was that the "AA man" had experienced the error before and must have some knowledge to say it wouldn't inhibit restarts i.e. the software causes the error to be displayed and triggers other actions and it's not the "error displayed" that triggers the start inhibition.  Putting what I'm trying to explain in it's simplest form there are a limited number of error messages available to programmers but hundreds of fault codes so a best available message is selected for coding/display and in this particular case the error message displays mileage remaining since fault logged but the error code not the error message drives what action to take.

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Gah...yesterday morning I had 8000KM adblue range...a few KM later I get an alarm to tell me "Error: AdBlue (DEF). No engine start in 1000 km". There is no top up advice, i.e. min/max litres, being given - I wouldn't expect it to be ready for a top up so it looks like it's not the level sensors.

 

I rang the dealer as it's also due a service and they were inclined to have me call Skoda assistance to get it brought in and a loan car issued. Given that the nearest dealer would not be my preference and I've to collect a ladder later meaning I need my roof bars I've stalled on this for the moment. 

 

They've still booked me in for a couple of days as a priority case and didn't seem all that surprised to hear of the issue.

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And it's sorted itself after two and a half days of whinging at me with the error - back up to 8500KM range with no error yesterday evening.

 

It may have been a reset similar to the post-fill 30 second ignition wait that did it?

 

Basically I had a ladder on the racks yesterday evening and before I set off I wanted to check the straps. As it was a warm afternoon I turned on the ignition and lowered the windows first so the car would be a bit more comfortable. Thing is I left the ignition on for the minute or two that I was checking the straps so maybe that did it?

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  • 6 months later...

At the risk of resurrecting an old thread, this issue hit me in September. 3500 miles on a 17 plate Superb. I topped up the Ad-blue when I got the "650 miles before no engine start message". It took 9 litres and despite my best efforts refused to accept the fact that I'd put any in

 

I took it to my dealership, who said I'd over filled it and they'd need to drain the entire system and refill it.. The removed 15 litres, implying there were about 6 litres left in the tank as when started complaining about being low... something wrong there.

 

Anyway, it was drained, refilled and... "no engine start in 600 miles" now. The dealership couldn't get it to clear. Tried all sorts apparently.

 

Skoda Technical support said change the knock sensor. So they did, no difference.

 

Change the adblue injector. No difference.

 

Remove the tank from a working car and swap them over. Take several hours apparently. Did so, No difference.

 

Everyone appears to be stumped.

 

They've now had my car at the dealership for almost 6 weeks. I'm now at the point of requesting that they take this car away and get me a new one - I kind of expect my 30 grand+ cars to last more than a few months, 3500 miles and half a tank of adblue.

 

Shame really, as the car itself is lovely, but if I can't start the engine, then it's not a lot of use to me.

 

sigh.

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Is it a 13 litre tank?

9 litres was not really too much added after 3,500 miles. maybe a bit more ad-blue than it should of needed, use over that 3,500 miles, but you could not be sure the ad-blue was not a bit low from the PDI.

?

What did the screen show at the time as Max you should add?

 

Skoda UK should have had the vehicles fault resolved long before now if the Dealership doing the Warranty Work can not.

Are you dealing with Skoda UK yourself, and what are they saying about it?

 

My SEAT has a 16 litre Ad-blue tank and it shows 7,000 mile range when full.

here it shows max Ad-Blue to add is 10.2 litres (2.25 gallon) when showing a 3,000 mile range.

DSCN3540.JPG.46a2368f1617a7efeb74c88f71c1388e.JPG

Edited by AwaoffSki
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I'm told it's a 13 litre tank with 2 litres of over-fill in the pipe. I managed to fill the thing to brimming, which is how they got 15l out of it. I'd put 9l in so there must have been 6 left in the tank when the warning appeared... meaning it was whining when it was a little under half-full.

 

Indeed - the consumption was very high if the warning was to be believed. Of those 3500 miles, the car had been to the south of France and back - say 1000 miles, so 2.5k miles "around the doors".

 

When I got the car from PDI it showed 7,500 miles left in Adbue, so I've no reason to believe it was short-filled. That's one of the reasons why I was taken aback when the "650 miles to go" warning appeared at 3470 miles or so. It was way too early.

 

I'm dealing with the dealership at the moment - they are stumped, as you can tell. It's now had pretty much all of the ad-blue system replaced, and the fault is still there.

 

I'm told that when they drain the system, and refill it, they need to take it on a "reset" drive. This involves putting the car into a mode, and having to complete a sequence of driving within a time window. Something like "drive at at least 50 mph, at 2000 RPM, for one minute". Something along those lines. It's this "reset" drive which is not being accepted by my car and until it's done, the ad-blue warning won't clear.,... I'm told. Whether this is horseshít or not, I don't know.

 

"Technical Germany" have been contacted last Thursday, and have yet to reply after 8 days, so I think it's safe to assume they are stumped too.

 

When I enquired today about getting a replacement car, as I was talking to the service department, I was told to contact VW Finance. When I stated there was no finance on the car, and I'd paid cash, I was told I'd get a call back today from the dealership staff. We'll see if that call arrives but I'll be going up to the dealership tomorrow to have a little sit down and a chat about what next.

 

Ideally, I'd like my car sorted out - it's got 700 quids worth of G-technic paint, leather and glass protection on it, which I don't really want to have to re-do if this car is swapped out. 

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Best talk with the Importer & Warranty Provider, not DEalership Employees.

Horses mouth and organ grinder... 

Get in writing everything from Skoda UK.   Dealership employees tend to be a bit iffy if allowed to be. When not their car....

http://skoda.co.uk/about-us/contact-us 

 

 

Odd i have a 16 litre tank and was 7,000 mile range at PDI, and now at 16,000 miles, filled twice now and 7,000 mile range at each fill of Ad-blue.

DSCN1207.JPG

Edited by AwaoffSki
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56 minutes ago, AwaoffSki said:

What did the screen show at the time as Max you should add?

 

1 gallon to 1.5 gallons, so I added 7 litres. Left the car for 5 minutes with the ignition on, and engine off, as per the handbook. Still no clearing of the warning - still said add 1.5 gallons when you turned the ignition on. Left the car overnight. No difference. Drove it for 20 miles - no difference.

 

Assumed I needed to add more, so I added a further 2 litres, making 9. this brimmed it and this is why the dealership said I'd overfilled it. Since then, its been drained, refilled, new knock sensor, new injector and a new tank/piping/sensor fitted (well, a donor from a working car anyway). Still no difference.

 

 

Edited by Mindbomb
Missed the minimum...
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Nothing more for the Dealership to do,   the Warranty Provider needs to get their backsides in action, they should have long before now.

 

If the master tech is at a loss and Skoda CZ really in the loop, then Skoda UK need to act.  Repair or replace car, not the usual trial and error, mostly error.

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Just had a call from the dealership. Online diagnosis from Tech indicates that it probably needs a new EMU. New one ordered and we'll see what happens after that's fitted.

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16 minutes ago, Mindbomb said:

Just had a call from the dealership. Online diagnosis from Tech indicates that it probably needs a new EMU. New one ordered and we'll see what happens after that's fitted.

Sounds very similar to my issue.

On 02/05/2017 at 16:36, peter_k said:

Update on my Adblue error from 21/4.  3.5 days at the dealers.  All the adblue system "removed and checked" at Skoda's request. No difference and no issues found. Back to Skoda again who then  authorised a software update and problem fixed. Dealer says Skoda are only aware of one other instance of this problem.  

Whole affair has left me puzzled - Why not update the software first before removing tank, sensors and injectors (it was known that the tank level sensors were working and the pump was pressurising the system and the pressure was holding)? - unless Skoda have to buy software updates from VW.

 

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@peter_k - Yup, you'd think you do the easy stuff first. This is after 6 weeks of faffing about, stripping two cars down to get a donor tank and suchlike.... the only saving grace is I'm not paying for the "you overfilled the tank" issue, as they wanted to charge 2 hours labour to drain and refill it!

 

Still, I'd have happily paid that if I'd know I'd be without a car for 6 weeks...

 

Quite pleased I'd held off on any VCDS updates so far, or I'd be concerned they'd point the finger at me for changing the coding...

Edited by Mindbomb
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  • 4 weeks later...

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