Lift off oversteer - tyres or suspension

[JWvrs25]

So I had a bit of an 'experience' today in my vrs. Came into a roundabout in the wet, half way round had to lift off as pulled out quite closely in front of me, back end just let go and slid a fair bit, to the point I had to correct slightly and step on the power to bring it back in line. Now I know Im probably going to answer my own question here when I say- almost new Goodyear Eagle f1 tyres on the front, and some cheap kenda tyres on the rear with 3-4mm tread (and less on the edges). I understand that the tyre combination would mean the front would grip a lot better than the rear but I wanted to rule out any issues with the suspension. 

AFAIK it's the original shocks and springs all round and 12 years 130k miles

Am i best swapping the tyres and just taking it steady or should i replace the cheap tyres with something more reasonable. 

[Breezy_Pete]

10 minutes ago, clarendon462 said:

should i replace the cheap tyres with something more reasonable

 

Probably the best first step.

I was looking at the rather worn rear tyres on the missus's car at the weekend and trying to work out whether they should serve another winter or not. 

[sepulchrave]

Hahaha, get the missus to wash your pants, AND CHANGE THOSE TYRES!

[JWvrs25]

Thought so, should I go for Kumho, Uniroyal or Avon. They seem to be a good mid range tyre all a good price. Or any other suggestions?

[Breezy_Pete]

My pants seem irrelevant to this, and please stop shouting.

 

Haha. Just worked out you weren't talking to me. 

Edited 20 November, 2017 by Wino

[sepulchrave]

45 minutes ago, clarendon462 said:

Thought so, should I go for Kumho, Uniroyal or Avon. They seem to be a good mid range tyre all a good price. Or any other suggestions?

 

Get black rubber ones with TREAD!

 

Anything is better than those teflon pucks you currently have fitted, brand fairies will be along shortly to persuade you to buy what they bought.

[JWvrs25]

well they do have tread in the middle. around 5mm right in the centre, its the edges which are worn. 

I dont believe its the tread issue, more the compound hence why i was asking for suggestions.

 

[Breezy_Pete]

Match them to the fronts?

[Rooted]

Remember that as well as H2O on roundabouts there can be Diesel and oil, and regardless of the best tyres and being a driving god that understands lift off  oversteer no traction no action or just too much.

[JWvrs25]

18 minutes ago, Wino said:

Match them to the fronts?

They are £100 each and I think they may be overkill for the rear. Rather get something cheaper. I know uniroyal are rated well for grip but wear out quickly, but that shouldn't be an issue on the rear as they do so little in the way of load. Never had experience with Kumho but they seem a fair price and have a rated wet grip which attracted me.

Another thing is, my car is supposed to have ESP as it has the code on the boot sticker, however surely this would have kicked in or at least given me a warning light that something unexpected was happening?

[GeneralDogsbody]

As posted earlier in another thread.......  Just had a bit of a scary moment on a right hand corner near me - changed down from fourth to third (damp road) and the back end decided to 'step out' at 20mph! The rear of the car is very wobbly after having the front end done. Could the front subframe be causing rear-wheel problems? The rear tyres are down to 3mm, though. It does feel as if something's loose, mind you. 

 

I have found four of these tyres for less than 160 quid fitted. Half decent reviews, as well (see photo)  

 

 

[JWvrs25]

I wish my tyres were as cheap as the 195/50 15s

Mine are 205 40 17 

The front alignment shouldn't cause an issue with the rear unless it was really far out. Whats it like in the dry? Mine grips perfectly in the dry even pushing the limits of the decent front tyres doesn't cause the back to have any issues.

Slightest bit of moisture and its a different story

 

[GeneralDogsbody]

Hiya C. My car's pretty good in the dry. I had a little moment the other day on a left hander at 50 mph, as the rears caught a rut in the road. Today's was a proper 'tank slapper'! I've got a right mismatch of rubber, mind you - I was told that one of them dates back to 2006! I nearly bought a set of 4 VRS wheels that had been refurbished with decent rubber for £140 the other day - until my Wife's plans got in the way *Waves fist* 

 

 

Edited 20 November, 2017 by GeneralDogsbody

[Golf-Fiend]

If you are going to drive beyond your limits make sure first that your limits are better than your driving ability. 

 

If if you can drive properly then this won't happen. And 17" rims...Really? Gets some skills on a skid pan or advanced driving course. And get rubber that matches on all 4 corners so grip or loss of grip is consistent and predictable   

[TMB]

Not that I'm saying it's related to your incident but those dampers will be past their best at 130k.

[Rooted]

Goes well after Terra-Clean fitted with ditch finders, handles crap, what is the worst that can happen?, wintry later this week.

[sepulchrave]

2 hours ago, Golf-Fiend said:

If you are going to drive beyond your limits make sure first that your limits are better than your driving ability. 

 

If if you can drive properly then this won't happen. And 17" rims...Really? Gets some skills on a skid pan or advanced driving course. And get rubber that matches on all 4 corners so grip or loss of grip is consistent and predictable   

 

Obvious troll is obvious 

[Golf-Fiend]

6 hours ago, sepulchrave said:

 

Obvious troll is obvious 

 

Just stating the obvious. FWD cars suffer from lift off oversteer. The op seemed surprised at this though admits to having ditch finders on the rear that would exacerbate this problem. If you are going to drive into a wet round about at speed you need to expect the unexpected and have experience in handling a car when grip lets go. Skid pans and advanced driving courses are a great place (and fun) to get this experience safely. 17" rims on a Fabia or any small low powered car are overkill especially on current UK roads. 185/195 profile good rubber gives more than enough grip in these cars and gives a better ride so your not crashing about over bumps and potholes.

Just sayin' like 

Edited 21 November, 2017 by Golf-Fiend

[Rooted]

Audi had 225/35 R 18 on Audi A1 with all of 122ps, even on 1.2 TSI's with 105ps,

and 215/40 R 17 on ibiza, Polo & A1 with 105ps, 205 /40 R 17 on Fabia mk2 with 78,86 or 105 ps, and now on the Mk3 Fabia.

 

The 17" rims are not an issue just what rubber go on them.

Edited 21 November, 2017 by Headinawayoffski

[JWvrs25]

Who said it was at speed? this is why it surprised me. I was actually following about the same speed as a flat bed van and that wasn't exactly flying round.

It does sound like it could have been more like an oil or diesel spill making it worse as it hasn't done it on any other roundabout yet although does feel quite 'loose' most of the time in the wet when pushing on a bit.

 

[JGrindel]

Match the front tyres and then rotate the fronts with the backs when the fronts wear down to like 5mm. The backs are like trailer wheels and wear very slowly! But I guess you already known that  

[FinnVrs]

I also had the same problem, I solved by buying new tires, then the problems would disappear.
I looked at the tire and noticed that it was made about  10 years ago. Even though there were 6mm left, the  rubber  was

too hard and no grip left.
Last summer i bought another tyres and wheels  size is 215/45/ 16 and wheels is 7 inch wide and offset is 42.  that tyres  size is sooo nice because it is  higher than the original size 205/45/16. i have  stock suspenson and springs.

[vindaloo]

It'll be the tyres. I'm actually impressed you managed to get it to arse-slide on standard suspention. Don't have a RARB do you?

 

The no £££s option is to swap the ditch finders to the front, so the better tyres are on the rear.

Better is to match all 4 tyres as previously suggested.

 

J.

[GeneralDogsbody]

Well, I'm also a silly Billy, as I've just looked at one of my tyres - Maribor? What the poop is that? 

[KenONeill]

4 minutes ago, GeneralDogsbody said:

Well, I'm also a silly Billy, as I've just looked at one of my tyres - Maribor? What the poop is that? 

According to Wikipedia, it's a city in Slovenia. There is no mention of a tyre brand by that name.