'Relay' car theft

[Dave77]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-42132804/relay-crime-theft-caught-on-camera

 

Just spotted this on the BBC site, the guy near the garage is picking up the signal from the key in the house and transmitting it to the guy next to the car

 

How the hell did manufacturers not see this coming!

 

If you're worried, a post on another website suggests these to put your keys in to prevent it from happening

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B01HETGX00

[Orville]

Simple solution. Do not purchase a car with KESSY.

[buck890]

Use one of these, https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B01HETGX00/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1, problem solved, unless they break into your house and take the keys.

[Orville]

Having to place the key within a metal box or carrying a pouch everywhere you go defeats the convenience objective of KESSY. It's easier just to use a key.

[Dave77]

8 minutes ago, Orville said:

Having to place the key within a metal box or carrying a pouch everywhere you go defeats the convenience objective of KESSY. It's easier just to use a key.

 

Yeah totally agree, do KESSY keys still have buttons and allow you to turn it off, might be the best solution for existing owners.

 

Edit: Although they don't have ignition locks so that will be useless

Edited 27 November, 2017 by Dave77

[langers2k]

6 minutes ago, Dave77 said:

Although they don't have ignition locks so that will be useless

 

All cars should have at least one ignition lock to allow access when the battery is flat...

 

Normally on the drivers door but commonly covered with plastic trim to hide it

[mobilone]

buy a krooklock for the steering wheel

[Ads230]

(Information) Security has long been an issue in the motor industry, other than the 'physical' element (locks, keys etc) - particularly with the more complex infotainment systems, and manufacturer's 'forgetting' / not bothering to segregate networks between Infotainment and Engine / Vehicle Management Systems. Or producing a wide range of RFID codes so that similar fobs don't open multiple cars (looking at you, JLR).

 

IMHO, and working in the InfoSec industry, don't let anyone tell you you're being 'paranoid' when you want to protect your assets. Do as much as you want in your own cost/benefit appetite.

 

KESSY was on my write-off list as soon as I researched my car. Additions of a decent GPRS / SMS car tracker, internal control locks (e.g. steering locks etc), RFID blockers, or simply working smarter when doing things like storing keys inside the house are all ways of mitigating the threat of theft. 

[SWBoy]

25 minutes ago, Ads230 said:

(Information) Security has long been an issue in the motor industry, other than the 'physical' element (locks, keys etc) - particularly with the more complex infotainment systems, and manufacturer's 'forgetting' / not bothering to segregate networks between Infotainment and Engine / Vehicle Management Systems. Or producing a wide range of RFID codes so that similar fobs don't open multiple cars (looking at you, JLR).

It's not helped by the EU rule that requires data to be available to independent garages not only franchised garages - that allows car thieves to setup a bogus garage to get the information and tools to defeat KESSY (which a genuine owner might need if/when they lose the keyfob or the KESSY system "has a bad hair day" - like all computer systems occasionally do!).

 

KESSY is on my "no go" list too - as a retired software developer and "Chinese Wall" tester.

[ColinD]

Wasn't it better w hen cars didn't start  Or had dizzy caps/cables to play with. 

 

I think a metal/rf shield box for storing should be on everyone's list... of course if you're away that won't help. I use a RF wallet for cards, a similar for a key seems sensible. Only moderately more annoying.

 

As I say to folk, if it's on some device it's public, if you own it, someone wants it. In fact if isn't a thing, it's when, it will be worthless or priceless, either way it's not yours to keep.

[crispymorgan]

Only a matter of time before these relay devices can go over data network and they start following people in public and have someone ready to take car.

 

I'm thinking of getting one of these  https://www.ghostimmobiliser.co.uk/

[GoneToBeemer]

2 hours ago, crispymorgan said:

Only a matter of time before these relay devices can go over data network and they start following people in public and have someone ready to take car.

 

I'm thinking of getting one of these  https://www.ghostimmobiliser.co.uk/

 

I’m pretty sure Revo / Superchips / Shark do vehicle defeat systems as part of their software.

I’m sure there was also something posted not long ago about having a button combination on the steering wheel activated so the car physically can’t be started even with the key - great idea! 

[flybynite]

The problem is if they want it they will get it. You can do a lot but some measures can have consequences.

 

Cars became harder to steal so they started breaking in for the keys. Biometrics have resulted in them using owners fingers. If you make it difficult to get they sometimes don’t just walk away. The path of least resistance will often be through the owner.

 

The thieves don’t often think rationally if they are high on something while doing it, just like the guy who was run over and killed with his RS3. By all accounts the guy who did it was high and  was prepared to do all that for £500. 

 

I am not advocating just letting them have what they want, far from it, but you have to think carefully sometimes. Metal can be replaced.

[andyvee]

You can disable Keyless Entry by locking the car with the button the remote and then touching the door handle as if you were locking with KESSY - in the owners manual.

 

They can boost the signal all they like then, it won't open without the button on the fob being pressed.

[Swirly182]

Having not had to turn a key to start a car for ~7 years I was slightly disappointed to be going back to one after ordering the vRS. This has softened the blow for me. But clearly still a serious issue for keyless cars, although I doubt my wife's keyless Mitsubishi ASX isn't that desirable! 

[vRSAnt]

Given the reasonable measures now given for people to defend themselves ( almost eye for an eye, if it comes to it as justifiable force)

what self respecting crim is going to risk breaking into someones house to try and nick a Skoda

 

And thats from someone who genuinely appreciates all my Skodas. If it was a Merc or BMW I'd probably let them steal it.

 

[Gerrycan]

I suppose wrapping the key in silver foil would offer the same protection as the ebay bought items?

[xpower]

16 hours ago, crispymorgan said:

Only a matter of time before these relay devices can go over data network and they start following people in public and have someone ready to take car.

 

I'm thinking of getting one of these  https://www.ghostimmobiliser.co.uk/

 

I have one of these fitted, works with KESSY also. They can still open the car - however they can have whatever signal they like but until the correct button sequence is pressed, the cars not going anywhere. 

https://www.autowatch.co.uk/products/security-solutions/autowatch-immobiliser-systems/68-ghost-product

 

the only way is force you to enter the password, find the ghost in the loom (that’s not going to be quick), or lift the car.

[Dave77]

3 hours ago, xpower said:

 

I have one of these fitted, works with KESSY also. They can still open the car - however they can have whatever signal they like but until the correct button sequence is pressed, the cars not going anywhere. 

https://www.autowatch.co.uk/products/security-solutions/autowatch-immobiliser-systems/68-ghost-product

 

the only way is force you to enter the password, find the ghost in the loom (that’s not going to be quick), or lift the car.

 

The Ghost website is very vague re fitting, do you need to go to Birmingham to get it fitted

[Gabbo]

10 hours ago, Gerrycan said:

I suppose wrapping the key in silver foil would offer the same protection as the ebay bought items?

 

Yes

The crazy guy in the movies with the tin-foil hat doesn't seem so stupid these days...!

[roo]

A metal box would do it too.  You just need something to act as a faraday cage.  

With the RFID debit/credit/oyster cards it helps if you have more than one and all together as you get card clash. Two or three cards together mean the data struggles to get transferred.  I've had it at football grounds with a season ticket and on the tube.

Although the sleeves are still better.

[xpower]

1 hour ago, Dave77 said:

 

The Ghost website is very vague re fitting, do you need to go to Birmingham to get it fitted

 

You just need to find an installer, I think they are located up and down the country.

i had mine installed a bass box audio in Birmingham, they were really good

[brettikivi]

for cards I'd recommend one of these: https://www.secrid.com/en/

 

you can also drop an Oyster / HSL / whatever RFID card in the wallet versions outside the rest and it will work nicely.

 

 

 - Bret

[Dave77]

2 hours ago, xpower said:

 

You just need to find an installer, I think they are located up and down the country.

i had mine installed a bass box audio in Birmingham, they were really good

 

Cheers, found it cheaper if any is interested , no Android app though, only Apple iOS

https://www.autodefence.co.uk/autowatch-ghost.html

[xpower]

4 hours ago, Dave77 said:

 

Cheers, found it cheaper if any is interested , no Android app though, only Apple iOS

https://www.autodefence.co.uk/autowatch-ghost.html

I did try to contact autodefence by both phone and email - no response to either.

 

Boss box is the same price though £399 but if you go to them.

you can just sit in the cafe attached to the front whilst you wait.

Edited 28 November, 2017 by xpower