New Brakes

[Juhagpl]

Hello All

i am not sure if You know that, but i am front of brake renewal, and found a good website.

for all brakes and pads it is more then 100eur less then from the official way.

full origi oem brakes and lot of discounts

hope i helped

 

https://shop.ahw-shop.de/

[TLV]

100 € less than the official way? Autodoc currently sells both the Brembo front discs and pads I have on my car for 76.42 + shipping. If you shopped around, you'd surely get them even cheaper.

 

These are the cheapest discs said site offers, which are the 282mm rear discs.

 

Brake discs-pads are consumables and are priced accordingly, at least in other places.

 

UV coated 282mm discs from Autodoc:

[Juhagpl]

It is apple vs pear.

 

for sure aftermarket much cheaper, but in my view only ATE is very close to the oem brakes. The rest is just something.... deformating etc...

[TLV]

Brakes are wear items like tires. Do you also buy OEM tires? Because the local dealership is interested in asking more for the same product.

 

You pays your money and you takes your choice.

[chimaera]

14 hours ago, Juhagpl said:

It is apple vs pear.

 

for sure aftermarket much cheaper, but in my view only ATE is very close to the oem brakes. The rest is just something.... deformating etc...

So those supercar manufacturers who specify Brembo have overlooked something?

[Rooted]

As we know, 'supercar manufacturers', even VW Group with Porsche, Veyron, Buggatti, Lambourghini might not be penny pinching with rather garbage OEM parts, 

as to Skoda, VW, SEAT and Audi that is a whole different kettle of fish, 

or just brakes, suspension, tyres etc. Stack high from the suppliers supplying cheap and flog as many complete vehicles as you can.

[xman]

6 hours ago, chimaera said:

So those supercar manufacturers who specify Brembo have overlooked something?

 

A fundamental difference between OE and Aftermarket braking parts. The Brembo parts you buy from ECP etc are Aftermarket parts, manufactured somewhere random with a licence to use Brembo branding. It is NOT the same factory that makes OE Ferrari brake pads/discs.

 

The same is true for ALL brake parts bought with non vehicle manufacturer branding/packaging, be it Pagid, Bosch, Textar, Jurid, Ate etc. Even if they actually were an OE supplier for a particular manufacturer/car the parts are highly unlikely to be made on the same production line/location. 

 

All brake pads and brake discs* sold in the EU have to conform with ECE R90 regulations. So, in theory, they all should fit and perform very similarly to OE pads or discs. Whether they wear as well etc is another matter. Some may very well wear better, of that I have no doubt.

 

And there is another major issue. Skoda and VAG dealers will often supply and fit "Fourplus" parts to cars. These are simply cheaper aftermarket parts that have the blessing of VAG UK to be called "genuine parts" by dealers, but they are not.

 

They simply are not OE, but aftermarket.

 

https://tps.trade/fourplus-parts

 

Are OE parts any better though? 

 

Having said all that, just last week, I had a go at fettling the front original discs on one of the 63 plate fabias. The one that does regular high speed high mileage runs on the motorway. The discs developed strange darkly coloured high ridges on the inner 10-15 mm and outer 5-10 mm of the disc. Imagine my surprise when hammering the edge rust off the circumference, I decided to give this ridge a bash, and it flaked away in big rusty lumps. The disc had subsurface rust and had laminated.

 

So much for OE quality!

 

*ECE R90 is not compulsory for discs fitted to vehicles manufactured before Nov 2016

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECE_Regulation_90

 

https://tmdfriction.com/ece-r-90-regulation-for-brake-discs-and-brake-drums/

Edited 28 January, 2018 by xman

[Juhagpl]

I fully agree above. 

The rear disc is bit cheaper at brembo but in hungary the front disc is nearly the same price. For 170hp i would not play with aftermarket, maybe for fabias yes. 

In my previous cars the front disc always waved after 1 year even if i had no hard brakes in highway.

so now i collected the price for an aftermarket set (bosch, ate, brembo) and it is not really cheaper.

Anyway i just wanted to help if somebody wants to order oem brakes or any other stuff there.

cheers ; )

[TLV]

As I wrote before, the front Brembo discs and pads combined were 76.42€. shop.ahw-shop.de is asking 154.90€ only for the front discs.

170hp is nothing special. The only difference between a larger and a smaller commuter cars' brakes is the size. The materials are the same. They're designed to stop within the same distance.

 

If your brakes never last longer than a year, all the more reason to shop smarter. If a car sits around for a while, the brake discs corrode. If you don't drive at all or only brake lightly, corrosion will never get worn off the surface. Like for every other part of a car, it's good for the brakes if you actually use them. When the brake discs have corroded, I find a safe place to do a hard braking to clean up the surface of the discs. No more noise from the corroded discs and the smoothed surface will help you stop better later.

 

I do my own brakes and have worked in fleet maintenance. I know what works and what doesn't. OEM brakes offer nothing more than decent aftermarket ones do. Infact, good aftermarket parts are superior to OEM ones. Do you really trust VW group, even with their shady dealers, dieselgate and a million other issues they have going? They have ridiculous markups. There are several part numbers for the same parts with differing prices and if you buy a part for your Audi with the same part number from a Skoda or a Seat dealer, you get said part with less markup.

 

Even shop.ahw-shop.de tries to pull a fast one on you. They have ridiculous markups on their parts, plus they offer "ECO" parts like VW dealerships do. ECO Original parts are the same parts as Original parts, except you're only meant to buy them if your car is older than 5 years and if it's not an Audi. Or is it okay to sell you inferior parts when your car is out of warranty? How mad do you have to be to pay almost a hundred euros for a single cast steel disc for a commuter car?

 

E:

VW, like nearly all other car makers don't make their own brake pads or discs. They're sourced from official suppliers (bosch, ate, brembo, etc. ). OEM parts are the same parts as those supplier branded ones, except the car maker has them stamp their logo on them instead of the suppliers'.

Edited 30 January, 2018 by TLV

[Rooted]

Skoda fitted some of the crappiest brakes they could come up with to the 180ps Mk2 Fabia vRS, and not only that they fitted 25KG of Ballast Weights on the rear crash bar to get the car as heavy as the estate version and still it was not as heavy as the sister cars in the Polo GTI , ibiza Cupra & A1 185ps with the same crap brakes

. *Designing and manufacturing the ballast weights and the cost must have far outweighed the cost of decent brakes and suspension, but VW Group and others fit thinner glass, less paint, less trim to save weight, but add ballast to a Euro 5 emission car incase it was faster than a VW / Audi that costs more to buy, it also put the still lighter car in a higher VED band.....*

(2013 the Ibiza Facelift gave the Option of paying more and getting Brembo as a factory fit.)

 

So as to VW Group having road users safety at heart and fitting the best available for the job, that needs taking with a pinch of salt.

That same salt that has VW Brake discs as some of the worst corroding there are fitted in the modern era.

 

If anyone has access to VW Parts catalogues maybe they can come up with the Retail Price of a set of Ballast Weights and fasteners and the Post & Packaging price.

The cost of producing these would be interesting to me.

Edited 30 January, 2018 by AwaoffSki

[safari hunter]

On 1/27/2018 at 11:32, Juhagpl said:

Hello All

i am not sure if You know that, but i am front of brake renewal, and found a good website.

for all brakes and pads it is more then 100eur less then from the official way.

 

 Not sure how you will balance price and quality, just an example from yesterday brake repair performed at 160K km to my car:

- front axle rotor 1 pcs - Ate - 230 RON / 50E and Ate brake pads set  - 208 RON - 45E

- rear axle rotors 2 pcs - Ate - 335 RON / 72E and Ate brake pads set - 148 RON - 32E

I always go for quality parts for my personal safety and comfort.

[xman]

17 minutes ago, safari hunter said:

- front axle rotor 1 pcs - Ate - 230 RON / 50E and Ate brake pads set  - 208 RON - 45E

- rear axle rotors 2 pcs - Ate - 335 RON / 72E and Ate brake pads set - 148 RON - 32E

I always go for quality parts for my personal safety and comfort

 

You only changed one front disc (rotor)?

[MikeHig]

Awaoffski; that's an amazing pic! Is that the original position of the weights? If so, why would they be placed off-centre like that?

Just to be clear, is the total 25 kg or are they 3 x 25 kg - they look pretty chunky?

With all of the emphasis on trying to make cars lighter for better fuel economy, it is just bizarre to find Skoda adding ballast!

[safari hunter]

Of course not, I replaced all 4 rotors 

[Rooted]

MikeHig,  they are there on a Right Hand Drive car.

At the other side on a Left Hand Drive car. 

25KG total. 

 

They added ballasts to early Audi TT when there were 'Handling issues'.  

http://f1technical.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7949 

 

But VW / Skoda engineers fitted these to Mk2 Fabia vRS Hatches giving the Hatch a Kerb Weight 5kg higher than the 9 3/4" longer Estate Version.  Journalists and Salespeople even boasted about the faster Estate car!

They also fitted a spare wheel as standard to the Skoda Hatch & Estate, so that is another 19kg over the sister cars.

 

So the Polo got the Battery in the Boot and no Spare wheel as standard, and 215/40 R 17 Tyre as did the Ibiza & the A1 185ps instead of 205/40 R 17.

(the Polo & Ibiza & A1 can have tow bars fitted, the Fabia vRS can not.)

The Ibiza and the Polo 3 & 5 door weighed more actually and later the Kerb Weights were corrected,

but the Polo & A1 were given lower Co2 g/km figures and so were a VED group lower. From 2013 the Ibiza with the same engine as the Fabia had the VED band go 1 lower as well.

That is where VW Testing / cheating comes in with Irregular / Implausible Co2 g/km results.

 

..............

If you stick 'Success Ballast' weights in a BTCC you handycap it.   Weights from 9kg - 75kg.

VW Group put 25kg at the rearmost point of a road car, and make the front go light under acceleration, and they seem to think that is an Engineering solution.

They never found the need to do it on the other Fabia like a Monte Carlo with 105 ps. 

Who adds weights to improve a cars 'safety', improve the handling and braking?

 

Edited 7 February, 2018 by AwaoffSki