JohnKH

Battery positive is fine. Definitely no 'whirr' - or at least none that I can hear from the other side of the engine bay as I reach in to turn the key - just a relatively quiet click. The scrapper started first time EVERY time. I took the mechanical part from the one that didn't sound like a bag of spanners (the original) and put it on the scrapper motor. It works first time, second time - and then (after securing everything and putting everything back in place) it doesn't. It has to be the solenoid - which is the one from the original - right? [edited bit: I'm assuming it is the feed from the solenoid to the motor casing. Some sort of fault there. It isn't the cable - because the cable is from the motor housing that was on the scrapper. So, I'm thinking that it has to be inside the solenoid where it connects to that cable.] It doesn't look possible to swap that over from the scrapper to the original - or is it?

OK... can anyone shed any light on this bit of darkness! Stripped it for a third time (and then a fourth and a fifth time) today. What I had decided to do was to take the motor from the scrapper and put it on the nose cone/mechanism and solenoid from the original. I notice that there is a difference in the nose cone - the scrapper has a bit of a chamfer to it, the original does have one - but very small in comparison (not damage - definite casting differences). Slotted together like a dream - tested the unit - perfect. So - fit it to the car, hand tighten the bolts - fire it up - BEAUTIFUL! Turn it off, fire it up again - AGAIN, PERFECTION. So I am like the man in the advert - I am feeling absolutely epic. I tighten everything up, refit the battery tray, secure the battery. Before I refit the undertray and bring her down - I decide to start her up a final time - CLICK.... the single click - the single click that I had right at the bloody outset. So I disconnect everything again - checking as I go... I take her off again - inspect it - fit it back again - hand tighten, connect to power - CLICK. I do the electrical tests again: NO ISSUES - 13.6 v at the ignition switch/S-post; 14 v power, no earth fault. What is wrong with this bloody car?!

Further update: did some googling and there was a suggestion that loosening off the bolts and starting it a couple of times helped the starter 'find its natural place'. So, stripped her down again, loosened the retaining bolts off a few turns and started it... Surprisingly, it didn't sound too bad. Did it a couple more times, tightened them back up... Like a bag of manky spanners still. Deflated, dejected and well and truly beaten. Plenty of blood, sweat and tears - and £100 down - and still not driveable... And I've spotted a leaking brake drum... And the car slipped off the jack and stoved in the sill. Time to part company with this vehicle I think.

If 'deflated' was the description of yesterday's mood, I'm not sure what the word is for today... 'devastated', perhaps!? I put everything back together - turn the key - and INSTANT JOY! The problem, however, is that it sounds like 'a bag of marbles' - it is definitely coming from the starter and I can only assume that it is failing to disengage. So after all this - it looks like i have fitted a dud.

Well... Got a starter... Tested it - jumped the positive to the S post: shoots out and spins... Great. Spend the afternoon battling through the awful weather, and at least an hour into the darkness... A relatively simple job with a lot of awkwardness thrown in - but - I get it fitted. Desperate to give it a try - before refitting all the trim (and by that, I also mean before even refitting the battery plate and the battery) I decide to run jump leads between the battery and the car' battery cables. So I place the key in the ignition, turn her partway - the dash comes to life... Turn her ALL the way: click, click, click... A very strong, very loud click, click, click - but click, click, click nonetheless. To say that I am a tad deflated is an understatement. It is an improvement on what I had - but it isn't what I had hoped for. I'm kind of hoping that it was a poor connection between cables and jump leads - made all the worse by everything being sodden and absolutely wet through. BUT... Tomorrow is another day: we try again! This time after giving that starter a hefty belt with the thick end of a big spanner to make sure it is bedded in. Sigh...

Thanks for your assistance. I've sent a request out through a certain website (not sure if I can name it) which feeds your details to a number of scrap yards - 2 offers so far - cheapest being £36 delivered with a 3 month warranty.

Ignition feed: I get 13.6v - so I have power from the switch - it's not the ignition switch at fault. Feed at the starter: starts at 14v, drops to 9v on key turn. I'm not sure whether I should be getting power to it before I turn the key and that seems a bit odd to me. Moreover, it certainly seems to be a bit of an excessive drop to me.. Earth to engine block: 0v before and after key turn. What is rather troubling, and what I am getting now that I didn't have before is the ABS light coming on when I turn to start position.

Thank you, very grateful for the advice.

Thank you - I'll go through this and if the results are as expected - I'll get the starter - is it an easy job to replace, do you know? It didn't look like it could be done from above. Presumably it is swap out from below?

Apologies... I'm not an expert - but I just found it difficult to understand - or find it difficult to understand - how a mechanical item like a starter can be perfect or completely defective. My experience of mechanical things is either working or not working - not where it will work occasionally, and usually where it is mechanical - there are warning signs before failure. But if you say that it is the starter

I've tried giving it a tap and then going to start it myself - but nobody on hand to give me a hand... My first ever car, an old '77 Ford Capri used to need a belt with the stilson every now and again... not much room in the Octavia bay to give the starter a thump - but it has had a few - and no difference. I'm am going to take some persuading that it is the starter - for the simple reason that there has never been a problem with starting until the last couple of weeks - and it was total failure. It was never struggling, it always fired up first time, every time - no sluggishness - nothing. And even when it DOES start - even when it does fire - that one in a million times now (I hope) - it is instant engagement. Do starters go 'all of a sudden' and do they exhibit total failure at the same time as faultless starting? Because that is what I have here... it does strike me as something electrical - I keep thinking - try Relay 109, but then I've been advised that the car would crank and crank and crank if it was 109 - and I wouldnt get the glow plug light.... I get the glowpplug light (before it goes out - as per usual). Really am frustrated by this.

Well... This now has me, not only beaten into submission, but I'm just about done with thrashing around begging for mercy, I'm spent and in my death throes - a bit like my Octavia itself. Spent the afternoon stripping out the new battery, the battery tray and disconnecting and cleaning all the wiring connections. I was positive that this would be the answer I was looking for. I get everything back together; I eagerly take the key in my had - I give her a kiss for good luck - but I guess it was the kiss of death. Nothing had changed. Well, I guess it might have - I haven't been able to get her to fire AT ALL since putting it back together. I am getting 14v from that spanking new battery. When I first turn in the ignition, the lights on the dash etc see her drop to about 13.4, then as the lights go out, it goes back to 14s... I turn the key to start position - there is the click - and the voltage drops to 13.6, but nothing. Stays at 13.6 while the key is turned to start position, release it, back to 14s. I am now well and truly defeated. It has been one of my most traumatic weeks and I had hoped that I might have a little victory today - alas not. I now have to decide what to do about her... I certainly can't afford to have her towed in and sorted out - I think we are going to have to part company and my future is on two wheels and pedal power. :(

So... the bad news. This morning - at 8am, it starts on the 6th key turn. I do my morning Parkrun, I get back in the car - starts 2nd key turn. I go to the gym. It starts on about the 20th key turn. I take it to a local 'battery shop' and he assures me that it is the battery; if the electrics in the car are working, it isn't the alternator (he says), if there is an audible 'click' it isnt the solenoid... So - knowing it is the original battery - at east 11 years old, I take his word for it and splash out seventy notes for a new one. I fit the battery - and guess what... NO DIFFERENCE... in fact, it takes me 20 minutes to get started - so many key turns that I wouldn't even BEGIN to estimate how many attempts to get her started. So - no nearer resolution, the cost of a new battery down, and back to the drawing board.

On further consideration of this, I think this should be highest on my list of things to check. I've had the car from 18 months old - since 2005 - and in that time, it has never had a new battery. I'm pretty sure that it is the original battery but it has always been first class. Last year, in 2012 I thought I had probably killed it - I accidentally left the interior light on for a few weeks and left it standing. I got a jump start - gave it a good run, and it was back to usual service! But maybe it has now reached the end of its life... 11 years and 120K - it certainly doesn't owe me anything, I guess!

I will also add that the reason why I am looking further down the line from the ignition switch is the fact that there is a very definite, very audible 'click' of the starter when the key is turned to start position. It is the sort of click that you get with a dead battery - but, obviously, the battery is not dead. So - aside from the point about trying a different battery, I am focussing in on this being the starter or solenoid as the cause.