Slipping clutch?

[keesfabia]

Hi everyone! 

 

Just signed up to get some advice on my clutch.

Car details:
Fabia Mk2, Combi, 5 door, Diesel 1.6, 110 hp

Currently 145,000 kms

Just went through the revision less than a year ago and replaced the timing belt. 

I followed the information in this thread: 

...and wanted to create my own to get confirmation. 

I performed some of the tests that were recommended in the thread which were: 
- Stopped car with engine running, select 2nd gear and let the clutch out. Result: Car stalled (which it should)
- "engaging clutch, the gear disengages very easily." Result: Nothing abnormal noticed. 
- With 1000 - 1500 revs, select 5th gear. Car should pull through. If the revs go round without the car really pulling like it should, the clutch is slipping. 
Result: The car "put up with" being in 5th gear at such low revs, it pulled through and eventually got to "5th gear speed". 
But it was at that point where I'm at 80 - 90 km/hr where the revs shoot up, without any corresponding increase in car speed. 
 

The first two tests suggest I don't really have a slipping clutch but the last test showed up what I've been experiencing for about a month now. 
After selecting 5th at 1500 rpm, it got up to speed eventually without any rev abnormality. It's when I got up to 80 - 90 km/hr that the revs shot up from approx 2500 to 3500 approx. 
This happens sporadically in 3rd, 4th or 5th gears. 
A typical scenario is:

I make a lot of motorway trips and I notice it a lot in 5th gear. I might be at 110 - 120 km/hr, maybe going up a significant rise, press down more on the accelerator asking for more from the car.
The answer from the car is the shooting revs - no increase in car speed. 
In summary, at the high end of the spectrum in 3rd, 4th and 5th gears, if I press down harder on the accelerator, the revs will just shoot up another 1k. This didn't happen before. 

Any thoughts? Thanks!! 

[pearce_jj]

If engine speed increases without any increase in car speed then absolutely the clutch is slipping and will need replacing.

[keesfabia]

Yeah, when you put it as simple as that, I guess you're right. Thanks for the reply. 
I get the impression it's "starting" to slip, but is driveable at the moment. The slipping only occurs at high speed. 

 

I have a long journey coming up in a week and hope it lasts for that. I just don't know when it would fail completely. 

[pearce_jj]

If the friction material gets completely worm through the metal on metal will also ruin the flywheel.

[mrgf]

Feeble clutches on these cars... Seems to be a weak spot!

[keesfabia]

20 hours ago, pearce_jj said:

If the friction material gets completely worm through the metal on metal will also ruin the flywheel.

 

Ouch! So...as in...damage a part of the engine. I'd want to change it asap? 

 

15 hours ago, mrgf said:

Feeble clutches on these cars... Seems to be a weak spot!

 

Really? Is is a common problem? You had your own experience? 

[mrgf]

I have 1.4 diesel gremlin. Replaced the clutch twice in 120,000 miles. It is used as driving school car though but still, to be on the third clutch!!!

As mentioned above, dual mass flywheels CAN be damaged too and that will double the cost or repair at least from the parts side of things. Labour is not really any different except they might need to stop work to order one in. Half a day wasted. Genuine Skoda clutches are around £600 but Mr Clutch come in at around £330-ish. As they use branded parts and have a two year warranty, the saving speaks for its-self!

 

I have found slight slippage can take some while to become a nuisance, though. If driven gently, it may last another year but keep it spinning and slipping... Well, you can kill  a clutch in a day if you are trying to! If it slips, come off the gas, let the revs drop, then accelerate gentler. If you smell burnt cabbages, say, when reversing up hills etc, its slipping. Let it cool down or drive with minimal clutch use (Duel carriageway/motorway etc) To let the heat dissipate. Keep letting it overheat and the damage will be permanent and more severe.

 

The nature of a clutch, is to slip. It separates the driving force of the engine to the wheels, and applies it gently to move off safely without jerking or stalling. This gentleness is actually the clutch "Slipping"  So its going to wear naturally over time anyway. Think of brakes... They wear more, the more they are applied. They are cheap and relatively easy to replace though. That said, replace them once a year, along with discs, at a fast fit centre or dealer and over the life of a clutch, brakes will be a similar price. 

[pearce_jj]

Yes if it's worn right down the rivets can make contact leaving scoring, meaning the flywheel has to be machined (skimmed) as part of the job.

Edited 21 August, 2017 by pearce_jj
Typo

[mrgf]

....And a damaged flywheel will kill a newly replaced clutch. If and I do mean, IF the flywheel needs replacing, Its best to bite the bullet and get it done at the same time. Trust in your fitter is key, here. No fitter will want to have you come back in two months to ask them to replace the clutch under warranty as the flywheel killed it but they failed to warn you of this. Likewise, no-one wants to be ripped of the cost of a flywheel, if it was fully serviceable when the clutch was changed. If in doubt, ask to see the faulty part, prior to replacement or at the veery least, after the car is fixed, although this does not mean it was not from another car and they "Sold" you your own part! (Better to buy a part you did not need even, then to be bull dropping-ed about a fake replacement)!

[keesfabia]

Hey guys! Thanks for the replies and really sorry I didn't get back for ages. Life gets in the way sometimes. 

 

On 21/08/2017 at 13:42, mrgf said:

have found slight slippage can take some while to become a nuisance, though.

 

On 21/08/2017 at 13:42, mrgf said:

If it slips, come off the gas, let the revs drop, then accelerate gentler

 

That's exactly what I'm having to do. If I'm going up a decent hill from start where you have to go high into the revs before having enough speed to change gears, the slipping starts. It's getting to be quite annoying, and I have to do what you say - come off the gas and just go slower. Once I get up to 80,90,100 km/hr in 4th and 5th, It rarely happens. It's more in the high revs in 3rd and anywhere in 4th. 
Over a month has gone by and I use the car every day. 

 

On 21/08/2017 at 13:42, mrgf said:

it may last another year but keep it spinning and slipping

 

Yup. If I can put up with the aggravating loss of power to the wheels - which is only going to get worse I presume. Although I wouldn't want to wait too long because: 

 

On 20/08/2017 at 16:53, pearce_jj said:

If the friction material gets completely worm through the metal on metal will also ruin the flywheel.

No real way to know when you start damaging the flywheel ? Maybe I'll start hearing strange grinding noises? 

Thanks again!! 
 

[keesfabia]

Hi again! 

 

So I eventually got it changed. Took a trip out to the in-law's place and it was terrible - revs shooting up all the time. Clutch clearly slipping. 
Left it there to get it changed in a "garage friendly with the family" since they bring all their cars there. 

 

Turns out the cluth AND flywheel were knackered. 865 euros all in: parts and labour. He rang and said they both needed changing and he'd show me the part to prove it. This might be me just being paranoid but that sounds like a typical garage trick where they have a worn cluth+flywheel to show customers. 

Anyway... the car is going like a song now. So just had to bight the bullet. 

 

Any opinions on that price? 

[pearce_jj]

It ruined the flywheel because it was driven in that state repeatedly.

[keesfabia]

Yup, there's a good chance that's what happened. 

 

Thanks for the support with this! 

 

Happy driving :-)