Hi all, having some trouble with my 2011 Superb 2.0 Diesel DSG FWD. Driving in heavy rain, took off from traffic lights, front wheels lost traction and the car was axle tramping ( hopping when losing traction) and the car stalled and turned off. Now when I try and start it the starter motor turns but it seems the starter motor is slipping and not catching onto the transmission. Just wanted to ask whether anyone has had this experience and what is the problem

1 hour ago, Blukie said:

the car stalled and turned off.

Never known that happen with a diesel.

1 hour ago, Blukie said:

when I try and start it the starter motor turns but it seems the starter motor is slipping and not catching onto the transmission.

Well maybe. There are 2 different fault modes that could apply here:-

1. Solenoid is not engaging starter pinion on ring gear.
2. Ring gear is worn out.

I could tell which in about 2 minutes if I was with you.

I had a similar problem decades ago, on a non-Skoda car.

The problem was a knackered Bendix pinion.

Ken o N's 2 possibilities are unlikely but possible.

 

KenM's experience is 40 years out of date and not relevant to a pre-engaged starter.

 

What I believe it to be (and have had experience of several instances of) is failure of the one way sprag clutch between the motor shaft and the pinion gear, it resembles a needle roller bearing but is in fact a roller ramp bearing.

 

When the starter turns the pinion is locked to the motor shaft and cranks the engine, when the engine fires and the revs increase beyond the starter cranking speed the pinion revolve freely on the shaft preventing the starter motor from doing 50000 rpm if the key is not released!

 

My only slight concern is the mention of axle tramp (presumably high revving and maybe traction control intervention) and then stalling, that should not have any effect on the starter motor but when a diesel stalls there are huge inertia forces on the flywheel and crankshaft, maybe the ring gear has jumped, hopefully nothing worse.

Edited 11 October, 20223 yr by J.R.

@J.R. Reblocked for arrogance!

12 hours ago, Blukie said:

Hi all, having some trouble with my 2011 Superb 2.0 Diesel DSG FWD. Driving in heavy rain, took off from traffic lights, front wheels lost traction and the car was axle tramping ( hopping when losing traction) and the car stalled and turned off. Now when I try and start it the starter motor turns but it seems the starter motor is slipping and not catching onto the transmission. Just wanted to ask whether anyone has had this experience and what is the problem

 

Is the engine turning at all - double check looking a crankshaft pulley - making sure it's not just failure due to lack of compression - eg potential cam belt issue! If engine has no compression it will spin quickly on the starter motor.

 

Starter motor should engage with the ring gear turning the primary mass of the DMF and turn the engine  - so should turn engine even if DMF is in trouble ie probably not that!

Edited 11 October, 20223 yr by bigjohn

Hi all, 

            thank you so much for your valuable respones. What I'm experiencing correlates with JR and BigJohns responses. 

 

Many Thanks to all of you.

OK, the outcome is that I had an alternator or air con belt (an outer belt) which was frayed/damaged. It Seems that part of that belt has come off  jumped behind the harmonic balancer and has now ended up tangling into the timing belt as the picture below will show. I can only hope that no valves are bent.

 

Lesson is CHECK YOUR BELTS regularly if you choose to service your cars yourself.

 

 

I’d be fearing the worst.

I would imagine you’ve got bent valves, 

The car stalled and you’ve tried restarting it.

The valves would have made contact with the pistons right away .

could be worth putting a new belt on and turning over manually 1st to see if the engine turns ok 

Edited 12 October, 20223 yr by Snapper1725

That is very bad news, definitely worth trying a new timing belt, if you have access to a USB camera with a mirror if the valves are really bent you might just be able to see from through the spark plug hole or down the intake tract.

 

It sounds like the axle tramp shook the engine about causing either the belt to jump or a frayed part to catch.

 

In recet years I have known of more cam belt failures caused by auxiliary belt failures than from the belts themselves failing, most owners replace the cam belts religiously, I dont but I regularly inspect it, maybe we should be paying more attention to the more exposed auxiliary drive belt which ironically is both easier to inspect and to change.

Edited 13 October, 20223 yr by J.R.

On 11/10/2022 at 13:28, KenONeill said:

Never known that happen with a diesel.

Well maybe. There are 2 different fault modes that could apply here:-

1. Solenoid is not engaging starter pinion on ring gear.
2. Ring gear is worn out.

I could tell which in about 2 minutes if I was with you.

No 2 highly unlikely with pre engaged starter motors ring gears don't get the battering like they used to with the old bendix drive starter motors. 

Edited 21 October, 20223 yr by Derbyshirebod

You may have earned yourself a blocking for arrogance 😆