My 5 Speed box on my Superb 1.9 TDi is beginning to play up at the moment. Occasionally when i goto select first gear it will not go in and i have to double clutch it, also when the box is cold 2nd gear snaggs as it goes in unless i select 2nd really slowly and finally sometime when i get it into 1st gear i get a clunk, is that a layshaft problem ?

Is this normal or should i be thinking about doing something about it ? Car has 30,000 miles on it.

thanks

Second gear sychro is useless on these boxes when the oil is cold. Baulking into first happens very occasionally with my Superb but not often enough to be a problem.

Are you absolutely sure the clutch is clearing properly? The B5.5 has synchromesh on reverse which will mask the "crunch" caused by a dragging clutch. If the clutch biting point is low down (it's normally fairly near the top of the pedal travel on these cars, even with a good clutch) the clutch hydraulics probably need bleeding.

Obviously you should check the gearbox oil level (17AF Hex key, and a sod to get at) and top up only with the recommended VAG oil, but generally, the 5 speed manual transmissions on these cars are reliable.

rotodiesel.

thanks for your reply. I am pretty sure the clutch is clearing properly like you mention as it had a new clutch and flywheel fitted about 3,000 miles ago.

Is it easy to bleed the clutch hydraulics on these cars as someone else mentioned it might be worth a try. Am i correct in thinking they share the same system as the brake system ?

When the clutch was fitted i was told that the gearbox oil was replaced, would that be correct ? Would it be easy enough to drain and refill with correct VAG oil and if so where is the cheapest place to get some ?

thanks again

If a new clutch has been recently fitted, look here first. The easiest way to check for a dragging clutch is to jack up the front RH corner, leaving the wheel on. Use a mirror or an assistant to see when the wheel starts to turn when the clutch pedal comes up (in gear).

Bleeding the clutch hydraulics is easy enough if you are a contortionist (try moving the coolant reservoir aside, leaving the pipes connected) and the clutch system shares the same fluid reservoir with the brakes. It's arranged so that a clutch leak doesn't completely empty the reservoir.

It's easy enough to drain and fill the gearbox if you have the right gear. Firstly, check you can get the level plug out - it's usually damned tight and you don't want to find you can't shift it when you have just drained all the oil out. Then check you have the giant security Torx bit for the drain plug. I can't remember the size - I just took an imprint with blutack and went to the tool stores... Finally, if the oil is not suitably packaged, you need an oil gun to fill the box. I use a 1 litre Wanner - beautiful tool with a variety of other uses such as priming the fuel system after fitting a new filter.

Who changed the clutch? Is their workmanship above reproach - there are lots of potential ****-ups when doing this job.

rotodiesel.

thanks for your reply. I am pretty sure the clutch is clearing properly like you mention as it had a new clutch and flywheel fitted about 3,000 miles ago.

Is it easy to bleed the clutch hydraulics on these cars as someone else mentioned it might be worth a try. Am i correct in thinking they share the same system as the brake system ?

When the clutch was fitted i was told that the gearbox oil was replaced, would that be correct ? Would it be easy enough to drain and refill with correct VAG oil and if so where is the cheapest place to get some ?

thanks again

First of all, if they changed oil and did not use VW, that's your problem right there, probably worked fine in summer but now the syncros are slipping. I had similar behaviour with "racing spec" VW oil in the Octavia, it was excellent when hot, but on cold gearbox you'd get crunches all the time. Just use standard VW oil specified.

Regarding clutch bleed, no exact idea about the 5-spd, but on 6-spd and V6 TDI you need to either take exhaust off or have long arms - I had the second option readily available

The bleed nipple that you need to access is close to gearbox, is plastic (so be careful not to break it), and is a different key size than brakes (9mm on 6-speed, not sure about 5 spd). For me the easiest way to attach wrench on that nipple was to push my arm from underneath between driveshaft and the subframe right up to the bleed nipple (blind exercise),remove the cover, attach the hose, then slide the 9mm wrench along the bleed hose and undo the nipple. Prior to that I also had to remove left driveshaft cover and sound/mud cover - trivial but you need a long extension bar. Remember to replace all covers afterwards.

On 1.9TDI it could be much simpler, because the engine occupies much less of the engine bay and possibly there could be access from the top.

By comparison, on the 6-spd gearbox in Octavia, the bleed nipple is on top of the gearbox and can be accessed without removing a single part using a long extension bar. But Golf platform is much younger than the Passat one....

Hope this helps

thanks for all your help. I have spoken to the garage and they are going to bleed the clutch system for me and change the gearbox oil. I have not had chance to speak to a Skoda dealer yet but does anyone know what grade of oil is in the gearbox and how many litres does it hold ? Where would the cheapest place be to buy gearbox oil ?

thanks again in advance

Warm up the transmission (drive it at least 10 miles) just before oil change - this particular oil is tough to get out cold.

Get the oil from Skoda dealer (or VW for a 2002 Passat). 6-spd capacity is 2.5l, 5spd would be similar. Oil comes in 0.5l and used to also in 1l bottles with a long snout to fill easily through that inaccessible fill hole. G 052911A1(0.5l) and G 052911A2 (1l) but there might be a newer number, just get the latest for old Passat or for Superb. Do not trust SAE75W/90 as it's meaningless - different oils with that spec result in completely different gear changes.

Don't buy non-VW oil unless you want to repeat the change soon because of poor gearshifting. Get the Skoda/VW one. It is at least 100k mile fill so hopefully you can justify the expense. Also it is good to slightly overfill for better 5th gear lubrication and future checks if the oil is still there (you just need to loosen the fill hole plug and if the oil leaks out the box is full). I overfill by having only the front jacked up so fill hole is a little bit higher, but the oil is thick enough that you can squeeze in extra 100ml and quickly plug the hole before it flows out. For me the overfill is essential as I drive 6th gear 80% of the time.

Finally, I'd ask again if the workshop who did clutch actually did change gearbox oil, if not, best to check level, top it up a little and leave it in until 100k - it's the clutch that is the problem.

Do not, under any circumstances overfill the gearbox. Synthetic and semi-synth lubricants operate very near their "foaming point" in transmissions and the level is critical. Use only the correct oil from VAG as has been stated.

You paid the VAG development engineers to put the level plug in the right place. Oil level is critically determined during transmission development using temperature measurement probes inside the box and other factors. To overfill the box just because it makes you feel better (a bit like over feeding a baby) and because it makes the level easier to check (use a bit of bent wire as a dipstick) is a nonsense.

rotodiesel.

thanks everyone for your replies. I found that GSF Car parts sell 75/90 transmission oil but it sounds like i should buy it from VW or skoda ? It is quite a bit more expensive from Skoda than GSF and correct me if i am wrong but isn't oil just oil when they are all the same numbers ?

thanks

Do not, under any circumstances overfill the gearbox. Synthetic and semi-synth lubricants operate very near their "foaming point" in transmissions and the level is critical. Use only the correct oil from VAG as has been stated.

You paid the VAG development engineers to put the level plug in the right place. Oil level is critically determined during transmission development using temperature measurement probes inside the box and other factors. To overfill the box just because it makes you feel better (a bit like over feeding a baby) and because it makes the level easier to check (use a bit of bent wire as a dipstick) is a nonsense.

rotodiesel.

Nice theory rotodiesel, but sadly not supported by practice. VAG development engineers also developed the infamous suspension pinch bolts and specified splitting CV boots (probably should've been oversized or of stronger built), would you say do nothing about these either?

Why don't you drive your Superb for 5 years in the 5th/6th at high speeds (100mph+ )and see how your gearbox sounds in these gears afterwards. You might be surprised about this, and also about loss of not-so-small quantity of oil over the years from a seemingly liquid-tight case. Radically different from e.g. taxi life.

Oil level is a compromise between minimum lubrication for high gears, environmental regulations (more oil means more eco-trouble for car manufacturers), and lastly indeed gearbox capacity.

Regarding foaming, it is controlled by additives, so once again buy VW/Skoda oil and not the alternative. Answering the other question, SAE75W90 specification can mean a wide range of viscosities, foaming properties and lubricity. Some oils work well, some don't work at all. Check American forums-they like trying out alternatives.

Overfilling by 100ml (or 4%) is nothing - it is about 2mm above bottom of the plug. In fact, I daresay that if you refill the gearbox in a rush in cold weather, you can accidentally pump in 200ml+ due to high viscosity.

It is not there to make you feel better, it has been documented many times that VW Golf and Passat gearboxes (and probably other ones), when used gently, first have the high gears go from wear. Do not take my word for it, have a look at other, non-Skoda forums, vwaudi, tdiclub etc.

The 5 speed transmissions have no problems whatever when operated as specified. The 6 speed unit is not looking so good, but its problems are not oil level related (it has an oil pump).

The gearbox on my car is oil tight. If yours leaks, it needs attention.

There are lots of people on Forums (especially American) who think they are engine or gearbox development engineers. They're not.

rotodiesel.

Edited 12 September, 200817 yr by rotodiesel

no skoda dealer has it in stock locally but a local VW dealer has the G052911A2 in stock £14.84 per litre!!! :eek:

Do you happen to know for sure how many litres i need ?

Thanks again

no skoda dealer has it in stock locally but a local VW dealer has the G052911A2 in stock £14.84 per litre!!! :eek:

Do you happen to know for sure how many litres i need ?

Thanks again

2.5l, so get 3x 1l bottles or 5x 0.5l.

The 5 speed transmissions have no problems whatever when operated as specified. The 6 speed unit is not looking so good, but its problems are not oil level related (it has an oil pump).

The gearbox on my car is oil tight. If yours leaks, it needs attention.

There are lots of people on Forums (especially American) who think they are engine or gearbox development engineers. They're not.

rotodiesel.

Rotodiesel, would you care to explain where your "engine or gearbox development engineer" knowledge comes from? Because certainly any person operating any oil-filled gearbox under heavy load for many years can tell you that there is slow oil loss and that, specifically in case of VW gearboxes, higher gears are lubricated less than the lower ones.

You need less engineer's knowledge and more end user reports for this one, I'd say.

Also, I have studied vagcat 6-speed FRF gearbox diagrams (this is gearbox present in my Superb) for a good while, and no matter how hard I try I cannot find evidence of any oil pump there. At best, if it does exist, it is just another gear lifting up the oil, and therefore relying on sufficiently high oil level to pump. Care to enlighten me? At least I don't claim excellent knowledge of gearbox technology, merely using the information available and making my choices.

Finally I'd rather overfill by 100ml, be sure that top gears are covered in sufficient oil film at all times, and as a bonus have no need to remove drain plug but merely to loosen it for the next 4-5years when checking gearbox oil level. If you would rather not do that, it is your choice.

Edited 12 September, 200817 yr by dieselV6

Rubbish.

The oil pump in the 6 speed transmission has part number 01E 315 105 C according to EKTA. Look it up.

"Higher gears lubricated less"? Higher up or higher in ratio? They all run on the same pair of shafts in this box. The meshing point for a high ratio gear will in fact be lower down in the gearcase on this design - in a high gear you have a large wheel on the input shaft driving a smaller wheel on the output shaft. Tosh.

I repeat, VAG do not make gearboxes which leak oil. (Why don't you ask them?)

I have nothing further to contribute, other than to suggest to others that VAG's recommendations as to oil and oil level are strictly adhered to - there is no sense in doing anything else.

rotodiesel.

Edited 12 September, 200817 yr by rotodiesel

I didnt mean to start an arguement

Rubbish.

The oil pump in the 6 speed transmission has part number 01E 315 105 C according to EKTA. Look it up.

"Higher gears lubricated less"? Higher up or higher in ratio? They all run on the same pair of shafts in this box. The meshing point for a high ratio gear will in fact be lower down in the gearcase on this design - in a high gear you have a large wheel on the input shaft driving a smaller wheel on the output shaft. Tosh.

I repeat, VAG do not make gearboxes which leak oil. (Why don't you ask them?)

I have nothing further to contribute, other than to suggest to others than VAG's recommendations as to oil and oil level are strictly adhered to - there is no sense in doing anything else.

rotodiesel.

Rotodiesel

Higher gears as in 5th and 6th. They work harder and longer than any other gears and that's why more oil is better for them, does not matter what position of input/output shaft.

I am glad that you have perfect oil seals, keep your car at a constant low temperature and in very dry environment - departure from any of these causes oil loss through migration, vaporisation and breakdown into lighter fractions, respectively.

When I say significant quantities I mean 100-200ml over 5-6years, not 1l/drive e.g. when the oil seals are gone. The only way to make a gearbox that does not lose (lose, not leak ) oil would be to keep the transmission case sealed. It is not sealed, there is a breather on the transmission case.

So VW may not make gearboxes which visibly leak oil, but it disappears through other means. It is ultimately a very small oil loss (OK not strictly speaking leak) through the lifetime of the oil fill, so no need to panic.

Finally, 01E 315 105 C? According to ETKA on vagcat, that's an oil pump on old Audi A100 gearbox from 1994-ish. Superb's FRF gearbox does not list such part. It is a different gearbox, centre section is different. Try www.vagcat.com, you've got ETKA's from lots of cars and years there.

I do not know for sure that the pump is not there (and I cannot look at the actual gearbox at the moment), but it certainly is not listed in the catalogue, while it is listed for Audi A100 from 1994 with radically different transmission case. That's why I wanted clarification. I still am not sure that pump exists on FRF.

Edit: I think it is only present for Quattro gearboxes, sadly no 4x4 on the Superb... :(

In summary, let's not flame but stick to the facts. And perhaps to the fact that what I recommended is around +100ml which frankly is likely to be less than a surplus that "happens" during a hasty refill on cold gearbox.

Following the instructions to the letter is not always the best way to service your car. Especially when the instructions are written by someone interested in reducing the lifetime of your car so that you go and buy another one and pay again. If repairs happen 2 years from purchase you blame the manufacturer, if they happen 8-10 years from purchase you say the car served me well let's go and buy another one like this.

Edited 12 September, 200817 yr by dieselV6

I didnt mean to start an arguement

I'm quite enjoying it tbh - two of the most technically minded people on this section of the forum arguing about a complex subject.

Shall we start on the Higgs Boson next?

Sorry gents - only poking fun, but on a serious note the information which is coming out above is really useful, thank you

A garage gave me this part number for oil for my car but think it is incorrect, can anyone tell me what these part numbers are ?

G052171A2

G052912A2

Thanks

A garage gave me this part number for oil for my car but think it is incorrect, can anyone tell me what these part numbers are ?

G052171A2

G052912A2

Thanks

G052171A2 is Golf/Octavia gearbox oil - do not use

G052912A2 is probably a replacement (newer spec) oil for your gearbox. Use this one. Anyone else to confirm?

thanks for that info, have bought the original part number oil: G 052911A2