seeking help - oil pump failure issue on 2.0TDi

[jimbof]

Ah, it was a CTRL+C CTRL+V design... :-p

[rwbaldwin]

...A coupling is required between the slave balance shaft and the oil pump rotor in order to take out concentricity errors. It would be impractical to machine the design to be fully concentric - and needless...

And yet that's how it was designed :(

I would expect better design from any apprentice. I'm assuming the 'designer' had no practical experience at all. When I was playing around with a stepper motor, it took me less the 5 minutes to realise I couldn't just bolt it to something without a oldham coupler (or something similar).

Off the record, I've been told that the NC machines would 'randomly' miss out the reaming step before the broach was used to create the grooves. The broaching tool was aligned to the unreamed hole. When the step was omitted, no alarm was raised. After looking at loads of balancer units and their replacements, this explanation seems to ring true.

[ronatholl]

And yet that's how it was designed :(

I would expect better design from any apprentice. I'm assuming the 'designer' had no practical experience at all. When I was playing around with a stepper motor, it took me less the 5 minutes to realise I couldn't just bolt it to something without a oldham coupler (or something similar).

Off the record, I've been told that the NC machines would 'randomly' miss out the reaming step before the broach was used to create the grooves. The broaching tool was aligned to the unreamed hole. When the step was omitted, no alarm was raised. After looking at loads of balancer units and their replacements, this explanation seems to ring true.

if only id bought an Octavia instead

[ronatholl]

Just out of curiosity...does anyone know how many 2.0tdi superbs skoda have sold? i would imagine in the hundreds in the uk alone....the reason i asked , is that if skoda know of an impending problem regarding these suspect poor designed oil pumps, then why the ****ens dont they do a recall?

After all their slogan is THE MANUFACTURER OF HAPPY DRIVERS.

Well just on this thread alone there are two owners with problems with countless others driving around unaware of the issues lurking inside their engines.

Surely there must be some kind of leverage one can use to get skoda to hold their hands up and admit yes we have a problem......and get these issues sorted.

i contacted SUK but got nowhere they dont seem to care about customer relations at all there not interested , i have the same superb oil pump problem , the problem to me seems the very small shaft driving a larger shaft which is considerably larger it seems to me fairly obvious the hex key is going to round off , try turning a shaft with an allen key there is hardly any contact its obviously going to fail after a few thousand miles

[ronatholl]

well having a good read on these threads, i'd like to add my 10pence worth...i have one of those so called dreaded 2.0ltr tdi 140 bhp superbs as some members prefer to call them and basically write certain issues that give my car and other owners a worrying time over engine problems and what have you. As you can imagine, it all seems doom and gloom and certain owners getting the wind up over wether they have purchased a bad car from the dealers.

Well in my case i have bought my car from new, and probably being one of the last of the mk1 facelift superbs that were around at the time, and in all honestly having read these threads, my car in certain minds of some people on here, should be suffering from alsorts of problems from dpf issues to oil pump failures and water ingress problems to name a few. Now this car does a lot of very short journeys and is never driven above 30mph in that time, and occasionally we take the car out for a nice long drive and to be honest i dont have any of the issues that are mentioned on here. I pride myself on good old fashioned servicing, and having read the service schedule booklet that came with the car, straight away i had a feeling some points of servicing was way too long, especially on the variable servicing.

I mean i know its nice to drive the car for high mileages before a service becomes due, but thats asking for trouble and coupled with high dealer service charges and consumables, which is why i service my superb every 6-8,000 miles with fresh oil and new filters...ok for some that might sound extreme, but i firmly believe that its the manufacturers schedules...ie long service intervals between oil changes that is actually causing these problems.After all the element in the oil filter for example is perishable over time, and to think of that slowly breaking down with hot oil flowing through it day after day week after week and one begins to wonder why the oil pick up pipe becomes clogged with sediment other than oil and the chain of events starts with oil pump failure due to lack of oil being filtered through the pick up pipe and then spreading through the engine right upto the turbo and then major engine problems and expense !!

When one considers the actual cost of a small oil filter which is under a tenner in some good motor factors, and then the cost of the oil, which can be had for around 30 quid and then the cabin and air filter, the actual basic service consumables are quite cheap compared to leaving it in the engine for say 15-20k miles and then paying around 250 quid minimum for the service, and by then the damage has already begun and wont be noticed till later on when the problems start to arise. I know rotodiesel is very knowledgeable in the work that he does, but everything stems from the oil in the sump...if the gauze on pick up pipe is blocked , even partially, then engine wear will be taking place, and hence the oil pump failures and turbo failures and emission problems and warning lights flashing up on instrument panel alarming drivers. So my message is there is nothing wrong with any superb wether it be the AWX engine or BSS or any other lettered vw based engine used in superbs, just service the cars twice as much and it will pay dividends in the long term mechanically...as the superb really is a nice motor, which is why i bought it.

i changed the oil and filter on my 07 superb every 4,000 miles but i still had the oil pump failure top quality oil and genuine skoda filter all to no avail im sorry but    i am seriously  

fed up with Skoda

[ronatholl]

well having a good read on these threads, i'd like to add my 10pence worth...i have one of those so called dreaded 2.0ltr tdi 140 bhp superbs as some members prefer to call them and basically write certain issues that give my car and other owners a worrying time over engine problems and what have you. As you can imagine, it all seems doom and gloom and certain owners getting the wind up over wether they have purchased a bad car from the dealers.

Well in my case i have bought my car from new, and probably being one of the last of the mk1 facelift superbs that were around at the time, and in all honestly having read these threads, my car in certain minds of some people on here, should be suffering from alsorts of problems from dpf issues to oil pump failures and water ingress problems to name a few. Now this car does a lot of very short journeys and is never driven above 30mph in that time, and occasionally we take the car out for a nice long drive and to be honest i dont have any of the issues that are mentioned on here. I pride myself on good old fashioned servicing, and having read the service schedule booklet that came with the car, straight away i had a feeling some points of servicing was way too long, especially on the variable servicing.

I mean i know its nice to drive the car for high mileages before a service becomes due, but thats asking for trouble and coupled with high dealer service charges and consumables, which is why i service my superb every 6-8,000 miles with fresh oil and new filters...ok for some that might sound extreme, but i firmly believe that its the manufacturers schedules...ie long service intervals between oil changes that is actually causing these problems.After all the element in the oil filter for example is perishable over time, and to think of that slowly breaking down with hot oil flowing through it day after day week after week and one begins to wonder why the oil pick up pipe becomes clogged with sediment other than oil and the chain of events starts with oil pump failure due to lack of oil being filtered through the pick up pipe and then spreading through the engine right upto the turbo and then major engine problems and expense !!

When one considers the actual cost of a small oil filter which is under a tenner in some good motor factors, and then the cost of the oil, which can be had for around 30 quid and then the cabin and air filter, the actual basic service consumables are quite cheap compared to leaving it in the engine for say 15-20k miles and then paying around 250 quid minimum for the service, and by then the damage has already begun and wont be noticed till later on when the problems start to arise. I know rotodiesel is very knowledgeable in the work that he does, but everything stems from the oil in the sump...if the gauze on pick up pipe is blocked , even partially, then engine wear will be taking place, and hence the oil pump failures and turbo failures and emission problems and warning lights flashing up on instrument panel alarming drivers. So my message is there is nothing wrong with any superb wether it be the AWX engine or BSS or any other lettered vw based engine used in superbs, just service the cars twice as much and it will pay dividends in the long term mechanically...as the superb really is a nice motor, which is why i bought it.

thats exactly what i did replacing the oil and filter at 4,000 mile intervals but my oil pump still failed

[ronatholl]

My suspicion is that due to the inability of the PD principle to meet Euro V > the engineers were busy developing the CR diesels. A PD cannot inject (useless) fuel into the combustion chamber when the exhaust valve is open to burn off the soot filter, because the injector is not and cannot be pressurised at this point. A CR engine has rail pressure available at all times.

 

So, with the engineers busy on a very important job (VAG sell a lot of diesel engines), the final tweaks to the PD were left to the apprentice. He messed it up big time. They also compounded the felony on the 16 valve heads by fitting Seimens peizo injectors which caused engine shut-down due to oil ingress. These had to be recalled. Luckily, the Superb kept the old 8 valve head to minimise changes to a run-out model.

 

I don't think our apprentice "spent hours" designing the 2.0PD oil pump drive. I suspect he was an inexperienced engineer who just clicked on a coupling design which was on his database. I suspect he knew nothing of the effects of torsional oscillation in engines.

 

rotodiesel.

hi Roto  got 78,000 miles so far out of my      superb till the pump went last week  is it feasible to think if i replaced the hex drive and cleaned the sump filter i could get another few thousand miles out of it ?

[ronatholl]

i wonder is it possible to rplace the faulty 2.0 tdi engine for the 1.9 engine  ?

[rotodiesel]

Possibly - if you kept the 2.0 head and put it on a 1.9 block. You would need to do a lot of careful research as the bore diameters are slightly different. 

 

rotodiesel.

[ronatholl]

ok thanks for that .i think Skoda have a nerve charging £1200 for an inherent engine pil pump problem that obviously they knew about ,put me right off skodas  wish id never bought one

[nick74]

...or put the head on something like a 2.0 BKD block. That would allow you to keep it as 'standard' at 8v and 2 litres, but ditch the troublesome balance shaft driven oil pump in the process.

 

Apparently a common swap on A4 2.0 PDs is to scrap the original BLB (or whatever) engine and use a complete 2.0 BKD or similar non-balance shaft engine out of a Golf/A3 etc.

[rotodiesel]

There can be problems fitting transverse engines in longitudinal cars. Some of the pick up points are different and the transverse cranks don't always have a machined bore for the needle roller spigot bearing as the transverse transmissions don't have one. Better to swap like for like.

 

rotodiesel.

[GordonClifton]

Maybe mine will be the last input to this thread!

 

I have the 07 Superb wih a 2.0 diesel engine. I bought it with 26,000 miles in Feb 2010 and just before Xmas 2012 with 55,000 miles done the oil pump spontaneously disassembled. The cost was partly covered by a warranty insurance policy. After a week or so I went to collect it after the pump had been replaced and I inspected the old pump on the workbench. Sure enough, a small drive shaft like an Allen key had rounded and failed. I commented that a first year year design student would not have created such a vulnerable configuration in a hugely critical unit. The dealer thought I should try the car over Xmas to see if the turbo was working properly. Less than half a mile down the road there was a huge cloud of smoke behind me. After recovering the car back to the dealer I just left it with them. Later I was advised that the turbo had let go. I wondered just how much of a road test they had given the car! I complained to Skoda UK but as everyone else has experienced there was no help forthcoming - in other words, VAG do not own and accept responsibility for their designs. Their attitude and response was utterly irresponsible. Since then I have had all sorts of problems with the DPF system which finally turned out to be the pressure switch. The warranty on the fuel pump and turbo ran out a month ago. Now there is a problem around the DMF which a Skoda dealer agreed was faulty. It was replaced by my local indy with a genuine LUK unit but the noise persists - I have posted elsewhere on the Briskoda site about this issue. Maybe the DMF replacement was duff, maybe it's the input shaft to the gearbox or possibly a big end problem. Unfortunatly, it's becoming a tad academic because this weekend I'm off to find a replacement car. The brands in the frame are Honda ( makers of the two trouble-free Blackbirds I've had over the past 13 years), Mazda and Toyota. No VAG - never, ever again! It's a great shame because I really like the way the car rides on our rubbish roads and the engine is more than capable when it works properly. But VAG engineering and their attitude has made the family of brands untrustworthy.