Hello,

I have a Skoda Octavia TDI and at 60000 miles I asked my mechanic to change the cambelt (as indicated in the manual). The car was in perfectly working order and never had any problems with it, so only had the camblet changed because the manual recommends this to be done at 60000 miles. In November 2010 the mechanic changed the camblet and the car worked fine until last week (so three months later) when it just stopped in traffic. I called the AA and their guy said the camblet jumped timing; the mechanic who changed the cambelt confirmed this today after failing to start the car.

He will come back on Monday and try to reposition the belt but there is a very high chance that the belt has already damaged the engine valves, which means that the engine (and therefore the car) is unusable. Given that the camblet was supposed to last at least another 60000 miles and it broke after only a few hundred I wander what are my rights and what can I ask the mechanic to do about this.

Many thanks for your help.

It will I would have though be just a new cylinder head.

As for comeback, depends on why it's slipped a tooth. If it's a faulty part or faulty workmanship. Genuine parts will carry a 12month warranty and should cover for engine damage should that component fail.

How good is your mechanic?

Ask him if he used genuine parts and was it the full kit he fitted or just the belt?

Also I would be concerned by the comment 'he is going to reposition the belt' to do this he will have to de-tension and then re-tension the belt when it is in the correct position. A cambelt should only be tensioned once.

I often read posts on Briskoda regarding cambelts, where people asking why do I need to change the belt and can I find a cheaper option, I think this post might have answered their questions. It is cheaper in the long run to get the belt changed by a either a dealer or VW specialist using genuine parts as if something goes wrong you have a better chance of getting it sorted.

Edited 4 February, 201115 yr by moley

He is supposed to be a good mechanic and had him recommended by several people. I also work with his father, so I don't think he did a sloppy job on purpose. He changed the whole kit, but I don't think he used Skoda parts. I may have misunderstood his comment about repositioning the belt. I think he wants to have a look in there and see exactly what went wrong and if the engine was affected.

Is it possible that he'll be able to cover up potential mistakes in workmanship while he's checking the belt?

How good is your mechanic?

Ask him if he used genuine parts and was it the full kit he fitted or just the belt?

Also I would be concerned by the comment 'he is going to reposition the belt' to do this he will have to de-tension and then re-tension the belt when it is in the correct position. A cambelt should only be tensioned once.

I often read posts on Briskoda regarding cambelts, where people asking why do I need to change the belt and can I find a cheaper option, I think this post might have asnwered there questions. It is cheaper in the long run to get the belt changed by a either a dealer or VW specialist using genuine parts as if something goes wrong you have a better chance of getting it sorted.

There's a chance you can get away with skimming the head and going for exhaust valves as they're the ones that usually get the worst of it when the timing is out, the car will need further inspection to see the magnitude of damage. As for the timing jumping teeth that's pretty strange, did the tensioner fail?

He is supposed to be a good mechanic and had him recommended by several people. I also work with his father, so I don't think he did a sloppy job on purpose. He changed the whole kit, but I don't think he used Skoda parts. I may have misunderstood his comment about repositioning the belt. I think he wants to have a look in there and see exactly what went wrong and if the engine was affected.Is it possible that he'll be able to cover up potential mistakes in workmanship while he's checking the belt?

There must have been a failure in the tensioning system of the belt to enable the belt to jump on the sprockets or some teeth have been sheared off. Does the motor turn over when you try to start it or is the starter motor not turning? If the starter motor doesn't turn then pistons and valves are most likely to be in contact, which is not good. If the motor is turning you could be lucky.

I had a cam belt tensioner break on a Mondeo some years back, which resulted in bent valves and a two piece camshaft.

I often read posts on Briskoda regarding cambelts, where people asking why do I need to change the belt and can I find a cheaper option, I think this post might have answered their questions. It is cheaper in the long run to get the belt changed by a either a dealer or VW specialist using genuine parts as if something goes wrong you have a better chance of getting it sorted.

I should mention that it was not the cost that deterred me from going to the dealer, but rather the poor reviews of the dealership from other briskoda users.

So this is what caused the problem (see picture). A part of the tensioner system snapped and the ball bearings were loose (as far as I could understand from what the mechanic was saying...I'm essentially technically challanged). I don't know what can cause this kind of thing but the mechanic says it is a manufacturing issue.

The bearing has broken up and a piece has broken off. It is difficult to know what caused this to happen and what the sequence of events were. The manufacture will probably say that it wasn't fitted correctly or something else caused the failure. The bearing is an SKF part so the quality should be good.

What was the damage to the engine?

which manufacturer is that tensioner/idler from? it is possible it some cases to claim against the part manufacturer so long as a reputable garage was used with invoices etc.. i'm the dim and distant past i claimed for a rare cosworth enging block which got ruined because a cylinder head bolt sheered off inside, the part manufacturer took the remains of the bolt back and did a suctural anaylsis of it and it was proved to be a manufacturiing fault

but i see you've mentioned it was a mate's rates job which sadly means you won't have much of a chance with them

The bearing is an SKF part so the quality should be good.

If it is a genuine part and not a counterfeit knock-off from Russia or China.

Before you say a counterfeit is unlikely; the US recently intercepted a shipment of counterfeit WASHING POWDER coming in from China (Brand marked as "Tide")

We are looking at two components here - an idler roller which has come apart and a tensioner roller with a broken spring anchorage tang.

I strongly suspect that the failure of the roller has been caused by the tensioner failure.

Many tensioner failures of this nature are caused by incorrect fitting. It's essential that these are installed with free movement to accommodate engine expansion otherwise the anchorage will be torn off when the engine gets hot. Once this happens, belt tension is lost completely and all manner of other things break - in this case the roller. Engine damage is always the final result. If the tensioner is correctly fitted, there is always a reserve of travel in the tensioner eccentric to allow for this expansion and also for a measure of drive oscillation.

In my experience, the Litens tensioners are reliable when correctly fitted. They are supplied with the best quality Japanese bearings.

rotodiesel.

So this is what caused the problem (see picture). A part of the tensioner system snapped and the ball bearings were loose (as far as I could understand from what the mechanic was saying...I'm essentially technically challanged). I don't know what can cause this kind of thing but the mechanic says it is a manufacturing issue.

Sorry but them parts don't look a few months old buddy!Not trying to cause a row or argument! But I change alot of cambelts!

Cheers!

cossie-nutter

It is very rarely a manufacturing issue when it comes to timing belts chap as they are so simple and made in batches of 1000's, if it's a manufacturing issue there would be 1000's of failures due to these tensioners, the tensioner bracket (circled) that says made in Canada on it will be made by Litens who make the original

did he replace the whole kit or just the belt, like cossie nutter says it looks old but it defo has a non genuine SKF roller (nothing wrong with that as they are OE quality)so maybe he did. It looks like it was incorrectly tensioned, especially as it has destroyed the bearings in the roller too

it's 99.99% of the time a fitting issue

if it is an SKF belt kit then he needs to get onto his parts supplier/factor and they will get SKF to send someone to inspect it. If it is a manufacturing issue then the head/engine will be replaced free of charge under the warranty. You may not need a new head/engine if it just died without making any clattering noise, you may be lucky. Don't be surprised if they say it was a fitting issue though.