Hi guys,

I've got an issue with a load of iPads. I was asked by some people I worked with last year while on placement if I wanted to help them configure some iPads to be rolled out to their students. Being naive and in want of money, I said yes. :( Coming to regret that now!

In short, they wanted the iPads to have apps preinstalled, and a profile configured to add some URL shortcuts. We had a few ideas on how to approach it, but pretty much all were shot down due to the way Apple ties apps into Apple accounts.

In the end, I stumbled across the Apple Configurator, and found a Mac I could use to set it all up. This required me to 'authorise' the Mac/iTunes to my account, so I could get it all to work. It looked like they'd be no linking of my account to the iPads. Now, I managed to get the apps installed etc without linking it to an Apple account, so it acted like a brand new iPad when plugged into iTunes, except it copied the preinstalled apps into the user's iTunes library. All's going fantastically well so far.

Here comes the issue. Now they're been rolled out to students, and some of the apps have been updated by the developers. When the students go to update these apps, they're prompted to enter the password of the account used by me when setting them up, despite the iPads being linked to their iTunes accounts. Work around seems to be removing and reinstalling the app themselves.

Has anyone come across this before, or had the misfortune of deploying apps in an 'enterprise' environment? How did you manage it?

This seems like a completely mad way of doing things, and unless I'm missing something I have no idea how Apple think this is good way of doing it and if is typical of them, I can see why they're not big in industry. A lot of these students are abroad, so the iPads can't be managed by us (well, me) so they're going to have to live with it, but for the next cohort it would be good to know.

Thanks,

Joe

Hmmmmmmm, not sure there Joe, sorry. :(

Just a thought, have you tried posting your question here..................??

https://discussions.apple.com/community/ipad/ipad_in_the_enterprise

Good shout, thanks. I tried ringing for help and got told to come back when I'd paid for support.

https://discussions.apple.com/message/21013343#21013343 suggests that I'm not alone in this issue. I'll follow that thread instead, nothing more annoying than duplicate threads within a few hours of each other!

Yeah, my 3 year support has run out on my iMac and I don't fancy the call charges for paying for telephony support. :no:

Following the threads is the best way, as you're bound to fine a knowledgeable person who has an answer for you. :yes:

You could use a third party product like MobileIron to achieve what you want which is what we have done. We have an on premise solution but believe that they have a cloud solution as this may be more suitable for only for a few devices. Another provider is Good technology which we also looked at.

MobileIron and Good are not cheap.

Also DME Excitor would work (Plus man many others)

Otherwise you're stuck doing all this manually device my device. If they plan to use Apple kit they're going to have to invest in an MDM or more staff.

MDM is one of the big products being punted right now. Phone any large software supplier they'll be on you like flies on **** if they think they can sell an MDM.

MobileIron is probably the best I've seen so far but they is very little between them since they're all restricted by Apple's API.

Alternative is to not update them. Still running java 1.5 and IE7 in my school with exception of 3 rooms which have full java 1.7 SDK's and google chrome among other things. Some of the newest machines have IE8 preinstalled. Seems to be that it is very difficult to manage large numbers of devices.

My school is completing an iPad rollout for teaching and senior staff only but it seems it was very badly thought out. Wifi in the building is not too great, more access points are coming but no one checked beforehand. It was intended that we would be connecting them to class projectors. School insisted that the software suites the other school in our area used did not work (computer science teacher has proven otherwise) and now they are buying apple TVs at extra cost. No one thought about lack of printer compatibility, none of the printers in the entire building work with iOS which is great considering they were planned to be used. Some of the school letter templates (docx.....) don't load properly in any of the apps tried. I think senior staff just wanted new toys. Could have been better thought out before spending thousands of pounds on them, especially when there are far bigger issues in the school needing that money. Such as the sixth form study rooms still having 800MHz clocked computers with 256mb of RAM which crash loading past papers in PDF format, too much work. OpenArena stresses them, it shouldn't.

The Mac forums seem to have a few people with our issue, and no solutions from what I've seen.

Cheers for the suggestions guys - I've had a look at those suggestions, and they're all paid for. (The iPads are a cost saving exercise and that's not really any money to do it with - hence why I'm doing it on the side along with my final year of a BSc. This is also why I don't want/can't put too much time into this, my dissertation due date is looming! The students are mostly overseas (MBA), and the purchase of an iPad + eBooks is cheaper than printing and shipping all the hard copies.)

I'll have a scout around for free stuff along the same lines, but not sure how I'll fare (is anything except pain free in the Apple world?!).

Otherwise you're stuck doing all this manually device my device.

Is there a way to do this without signing into an Apple account first though? As that's the main issue we're facing otherwise I'd be fine with this for the remaining few.

Such as the sixth form study rooms still having 800MHz clocked computers with 256mb of RAM which crash loading past papers in PDF format, too much work. OpenArena stresses them, it shouldn't.

The not updating would be ideal, but they've got to be 'as they would be from Apple', just with a few apps bunged on, so while that would be easier, it's not what they want as it would alter the user experience too much.

Sounds like my uni! While some staff have a desktop, iPad and a MacBook we're stuck with, in some rooms, old P4s, or Core2Duos to do CAD/CAM/rendering on. Yay! -_-

Is there a way to do this without signing into an Apple account first though? As that's the main issue we're facing otherwise I'd be fine with this for the remaining few.

I think so. I think apple have a configuration tool they let you use. I'm not a screwdriver guy any more so I don't often know the detail.

I'll ask at work what we use.

And yes iPads with a few notable exceptions are shiny ****e that people who like spending other peoples money think are sexy. Along with anything with 'Cloud' or 'Facebook' in the description.

Just coz it works on your BT broadband at home doesn't mean it will 1)work and 2) be legal, on an enterprise class network.

Edited 24 January, 201313 yr by Aspman

Thanks, would be appreciated.

Agreed with you there! I really don't see the appeal over a proper netbook, or if it has to be a tablet, a surface or something.

The surface is just young and in the case of the RT many seem unable to tell the difference with the pro (same for all RT tablets). But to me it looks to be the more suitable device. Full size usb host. Support for many peripherals via that port such as mice, keyboards and some printers (not a huge amount so far but more than the iPad works with). Should integrate nicely with most companies existing infrastructures assuming they use windows. A proper version of MS office and a browser that works better than mobile ones tend to. Oh, and a keyboard although I prefer the keyboards on asus's models to those of the surface.

Edited 25 January, 201313 yr by 6677

Were yours supervised of unsupervised?

http://help.apple.com/configurator/mac/1.2/#cad96c7acd6

If they are supervised and I understand it correctly, you should be able to download the updates to the apps in iTunes and then use the configurator refresh to roll it out to the iPads remotely

http://help.apple.com/configurator/mac/1.2/#cad525c10b6

There are several issues here. However, if the ipads are owned and controlled by a business or corporate type entity then you can set up an Apple ID for the group or organisation. This allows volume license purchasing for apps. The agreement Apple has with software developers is that they will control the distribution of the apps and hence the need to download them and update from the app store. If you could just download the app and distribute it on yourself there would be no control. It is possible to register as a corporate developer and distribute in house apps via corporate servers.

As others have mentioned as well as the free Apple Configurator tool there are third party paid services such as MobileIron and AirWatch that allow much more control in terms of distributing profiles, apps and other configuration options.

Using a personal Apple ID for such a deployment was probably not the best route to go down. Any organisation trying to take shortcuts or save money should then accept there will be a consequence of this. The reason there are paid solutions is that it takes time to develop them and if you want a company to be around for years and years to support things they need some income.

I would suggest setting up a corporate Apple ID and using this to reconfigure all of the devices from scratch using the Apple Configurator. For a more robust solution I would look at the paid options. There are several white papers on the Apple website discussing deployment of mobile devices in business environments and it may be worth reading through these.

bloke who knows if off I'm afraid.

One point that I have to make often is that if you have a policy of IT managing your IT Estate. So IT does all installations, IT procures and IT manages then That should be the same for ALL devices.

Users do get it into their heads that for some reason tablets (and smartphones) are for some reason different and that THEY should be able to install and do what they like. Users then can get a bit upset when they get supplied with an iPad which is hobbled.

If your managers are not managing the expectations of their users then things could get unpleasant.

IPads also need wireless so if you don't have blanket wifi coverage again you might have ****ed of users when they don't understand that wifi has a limited range. If you're in a uni/college you're wifi coverage is probably pretty good.

We're having to do a pretty big project to get wifi round many old building to satisfy senior managers desire to play with iPads.

Were yours supervised of unsupervised?

If they are supervised and I understand it correctly, you should be able to download the updates to the apps in iTunes and then use the configurator refresh to roll it out to the iPads remotely

Unsupervised, but they can't be refreshed on the configurator as we'll never see them again once we've issued them to the students.

However, if the ipads are owned and controlled by a business or corporate type entity then you can set up an Apple ID for the group or organisation.

Using a personal Apple ID for such a deployment was probably not the best route to go down. Any organisation trying to take shortcuts or save money should then accept there will be a consequence of this.

They're not controlled by the organisation - just configured initially. Beyond that they have no input into how they're used.

I realise this now! :( Taking shortcuts is something the uni seems good at, although it's not my place to decide budgets etc sadly.

bloke who knows if off I'm afraid.

One point that I have to make often is that if you have a policy of IT managing your IT Estate. So IT does all installations, IT procures and IT manages then That should be the same for ALL devices.

IPads also need wireless so if you don't have blanket wifi coverage again you might have ****ed of users when they don't understand that wifi has a limited range. If you're in a uni/college you're wifi coverage is probably pretty good.

Thanks for checking, though.

That's a huuuuuuuge can of worms you've opened there!

Wi-Fi isn't a problem the campus has good coverage. The issue is further removed by these being remote students, so an internet connection is there problem.

Thanks all for the responses though. Having met with the staff on Friday, they've decided that for future cohorts they're just going to issue a list of recommended apps to avoid all of these issues. I showed them some of the management things, but they were deemed overkill considering that they don't want to manage the iPads, just 'image'/prepare them. Once the user has got the iPad they could reset it completely for all the uni cares.

While it means I don't get any more money, I think it's probably the most sensible way around it (and sort of a relief as I don't like doing things without a proper resolution/solution.

They're not controlled by the organisation - just configured initially. Beyond that they have no input into how they're used.

So they are not bothered about viruses, being introduced to their network or IT infra structure, inappropriate material (pornographic or otherwise) being disseminated by their routers or any other myriad ways they could be seen as negligent or complicit in allowing such things to happen.

Sounds like they are ripe for claims on their liability insurance then.

Student will be right back to you when they break 'em. They'll accuse you of not securing them properly should they get their card details, or naked party photos nicked from them by any means.

Unless you're getting the students to sign off loads of waivers your department is in for a world or hurt. Students are more litigious then pupils or employees.

So they are not bothered about viruses, being introduced to their network or IT infra structure, inappropriate material (pornographic or otherwise) being disseminated by their routers or any other myriad ways they could be seen as negligent or complicit in allowing such things to happen.

Sounds like they are ripe for claims on their liability insurance then.

They won't be being used on site, so won't have access to their network, except to the outside world website, which everyone can get onto. I do see your point though, and thinking about it, all the iPads given to staff 'officially' (i.e., by the main IT people) don't come with any protection, and they are used internally, but that really is nothing at all to do with me! Best practice isn't something that seems to be well followed here mostly, although as a student of theirs it does make it interesting to see the contrast between what we're taught, and what they do/implement.

Student will be right back to you when they break 'em. They'll accuse you of not securing them properly should they get their card details, or naked party photos nicked from them by any means.

Unless you're getting the students to sign off loads of waivers your department is in for a world or hurt. Students are more litigious then pupils or employees.

Each iPad has 3 years of Apple care, so I assume they will just tell them to ring Apple with any issues. Unless it's changed, when I started as a student I had to sign some forms about use of IT stuff, loss of data etc before I could enroll, so I assume these students will have had to agree to similar. I will raise that point with them though.

This side of things really isn't my domain though, I was given a load of iPads and told to make them conform to their wishes in a couple of days, although I do appreciate your inputs.

Unless it's changed, when I started as a student I had to sign some forms about use of IT stuff, loss of data etc before I could enroll, so I assume these students will have had to agree to similar. I will raise that point with them though.

This side of things really isn't my domain though, I was given a load of iPads and told to make them conform to their wishes in a couple of days, although I do appreciate your inputs.

Fair enough. I'm the opposite way round.

Better late than never we are apparently just using Apple's own IPhone Configuration utility - http://www.apple.com/uk/support/iphone/enterprise/

But we will be moving to an MDM in the future. Which one I don't know. I like MobileIron but it's expensive. Like;y it'll come from a vendor we already have a relationship with such as Vodafone (who resell Good) or Sophos.

Each iPad has 3 years of Apple care

Interesting an iPad AppleCare warranty is 2 years as standard and Apple have been taken to court over trying to sell the extra warranty when European consumer law already covers most things for 2 years.

Standard iPad AppleCare cover...

http://store.apple.c...n-plan-for-ipad

Apple's additional statement on warranty after EU court rulings...

http://www.apple.com...utory-warranty/

I like MobileIron but it's expensive

Have a look at the AirWatch solution, minimum 25 devices for an initial cost between 2-3K including full product training for the administrator.

Edited 29 January, 201313 yr by hertsnminds

Things are only covered for 3 years if it can be proven that it is a manufacturing fault present at the time of purchase. This is pretty damn impossible to do!

Things are only covered for 3 years if it can be proven that it is a manufacturing fault present at the time of purchase. This is pretty damn impossible to do!

That'll be the same Apple that puts moisture sensors on the outside of their phones then refuses warranty repairs.

And (I know these are kids Vs students)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2255546/School-spent-500-000-giving-pupils-iPads-admits-HALF-broken.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

Better late than never we are apparently just using Apple's own IPhone Configuration utility - http://www.apple.com...one/enterprise/

Thanks for asking though.

The warranty isn't where I'd have spent my money, it must be said. I was just walking along a corridor one day after a lecture and bumped into the guy and got talking, when he asked if I wanted to work on some iPads they'd already purchased. Sounds like it's a pretty rubbish warranty too if it is time of purchase problems only. Each one turned up in it's own jiffy bag too - we had boxes of the things. All it is is a rubbish handbook which says nothing of real use.