Graham Butcher

I think you will discover that many of us ICE drivers are already well aware of that and that is why we say that they are ideal as city cars if you don't need the extra space that many ICE cars provide at a far lower unit cost. EDIT. By unit cost, I mean the cost of the car as compared to the fuel costs.

There is a few things wrong here, the picture of the Vivaro was indeed the one from Cornwall, last year, so was only used as an example of burnt car. At no point in the video did he make any claims as to the type / make of car. The Corsa he talks about is the same one that you posted about in another thread, and in that thread it was claimed that the cause was a fag end setting fire to fuel in cans with no top on them. I even mentioned that using my knowledge of fires, that the flames were indeed consistent with something like fuel leaking as the flames were just going straight up and not like the flamethrower jets normally associated with Lithium-ion batteries. In the video he does make out that it was a battery fire and that the car had been parked for some time. Something between the two reports is not correct, I’m not sure if your version or his version is the correct one, but photo does not show a melted battery, it appears to be the invertor unit that has suffered from the flames. The Vivaro is an electric car, just like yours, and it is shown as Untaxed on DVLA database and the taxed and VED was due 1st August 2024 as the car was registered August 2022 and as the fire was last year, I would say that is why it is shown as untaxed as it currently is maybe awaiting decisions on the cars fate. Like all electric cars, while they currently have zero VED, they still have to go through the same VED procedure each year, as your car is shown as taxed because you have done the required application each year. In that video, which was not mentioned in your post was the report from The Korean Times that shows that EVs have a higher ratio of fires than ICE cars, which is completely the opposite to what people over here claim by the likes of The Fully Charged Show and other entities with a vested interest, like I have mentioned before, I think that we are not being told the full truth. That report states that EVs have 0.93 chance of fire against 0.9 for ICE and these ratios are per 10,000 cars. Well seeing as there many times more ICE cars that there are EVs and also the average of an ICE is considerably greater than that of an EVs, it stands to reason that we all have a far greater chance of seeing an ICE fire as opposed to an EV fire. I could go on further, but somehow I think I think have done enough to completely debunk the false claims that have been made. Incidentally, I was going to post that video along with others but decided against doing so because I knew that the usual suspects would attempt to rubbish them because they contain things that they don’t to hear, see or admit that maybe that EVs are not all they are being cracked to be and that there could be a dieselgate moment coming along in the future when we are told the truth and we have to find other solutions.

Of course, there is tax on tax, maybe more if we let them get away with it. You pay tax when you earn it, pay tax when you spend it and pay tax again when you save it.

Yes that is it, take a detailed look at London, cross reference the readings with Google Earth Street View and the measuring stations can be seen and you will see the ones that are in the yellow at times are very close to underground stations or underground vents, or even next to extraction fans from commercial kitchens. Most of the others, and there plenty are in the green, safe zones.

£15 here for a pressure wash and soap suds, rinse and chamios dry, inside door jams, mirrors, windows get special treatments, wheels detailed and tyres get blacked. I do the inside myself when I get back home, if it's dry.

Like all figures, if you don't, apply the rules correctly, then you make the results reflect the outcome you wanted in the first place. You only need to refer to the world air quality Web site I gave the link to on many occasions and you can see just which countries and regions and even which cities are the worst right down to street level. But yet people are more prepared to listen to people who want to take yet more money away from poorest people. We going back towards the victorian era in terms of wealth distribution.

Hand washes are what we have around here these days.

Ice cars do not need to have PPM charge levied against them as it they already are paying per mile in fuel duty at the pump and as you once said, it is the easiest form of tax to collect as the retailer does it all for the government.

In the winter, I take mine to a car wash centre and let them do it, once a month at least.

It is plain for anybody who knows a thing or two about fires that although this is an electric car, that the fire was 100% nothing to do with its traction battery, despite the flames appearing from underneath the car, flames are slowly rising upwards and not under any pressure, which a battery fire would be like a flamethrower sending jets of fire out sideways and downwards.

I think it is highly likely that the BIK rates will be changing, so EV drivers will be paying more, and is rumoured to be greater than the touted 1% and I'm hearing, but waiting for more clarifying supportive evidence that the salary sacrifice scheme is to be scrapped on EVs as well.

Not a victim at all, you really do need to calm down, and think a bit more yourself, perhaps maybe look in the mirror? If it is covered on a national radio news broadcast then you would normally expect there to be some substance, and as it turns out there was and it is all over online news. DVLA says drivers could face £600 extra car tax bill in 2024 - Essex Live There was also a major fire in Stadtallendorf, German, at a state of the art fire station which destroyed the stations and all the 9 fire engines and was caused by ...a fire truck’s lithium-ion batteries. Yes this is also a confirmed incident and is again well covered. There was an incident in Niort, France with Tesla bursting into thermal runaway with 4 trapped inside, all lost their lives, confirmed. Ukiah, California police dept have some Tesla cruisers which are already being withdrawn from service as they are running into problems, poor charging infrastructure, and generally not up to the task of being police cruisers, in a fire fight, officers are told to hide behind the engine block as shield, EVs don't have that protection, and a bullet would smash the battery, causing a deadly short circuit and a fire ball with deadly toxic clouds to engulf the officers. A bullet into a cars gas/petrol tank does not cause an explosion, Mythbusters proved this to be true. A deadly explosion in a Poznań Poland, a tenement house claimed the lives of two heroic firefighters and injured 11 others, including civilians. The basement housed a lithium-ion battery refurshment company operated in the basement and it was a lithium-ion battery that started the fire. It also turns out according to Amnesty International, the materials being mined for EV batteries are not being mined in the safe fashion as has been claimed and is being hushed up. New human rights ranking of electric vehicle industry exposes laggards Lenitas cykelbatteri exploderade i köket – 10 familjer blev utan hem: ”Det är tufft” | SVT Nyheter Biden-Harris admin recalls hundreds of electric school buses that could burn * WorldNetDaily * by Ireland Owens, Daily Caller News Foundation Tesla’s self-driving cars investigated over safety in fog and bright sunlight Florida fire marshal calls electric vehicles "ticking time bombs" amid Hurricane Milton flooding - CBS News

I'm glad that others have put some meat on the bones, I heard it on the radio but there was no depth to it, just mentioned £600 and EVs VED in April. I just thought I'd post it in the hope that someone would know more about and clarify it, as I'm very busy today and unable to do more.

Currently not seeing any sign of that myself but as always with politicians, anything is possible😅. On the other hand it does rather look highly likely that from April next year all EV owners could be getting a £600 VED bill to bring you all into line with ICE owners, not before time either as you use the roads just the same. With all the money we motorists pay, if it was spent on the roads we'd have the best roads in the world, fuel duty, Vat, car tax, VED etc.

But that information was not conveyed in the video was it? Once again, as in so many videos, the truth is often hidden. How many time have we all read here that there are no queues at charging sites etc and that the infrastructure is fit for purpose, despite many other YouTubers saying the complete opposite and indeed even in the video that started whole chain off (Autoalex cars) when they talk about it at 13:00 in the video, oh I get it, they set up the scene I expect some will say 🙄. (1039) £1000 CHEAP ELECTRIC CAR VS 500,000 MILE TESLA! - YouTube So it seems that even the good and positive YT videos and Vloggers are just as guilty as the ones that so many are only too ready to call out as being biased and EV haters and spreading FUD are, using their fair share of "Clickbait" and yet nobody is calling it out on channels which are pro EV, how ODD, talk about double standards.

Does the same not also apply to ICE when some of the horses have escaped, the fact that have escaped does not make one iota of difference for most drivers as they not bothered if a car take a second or 2 longer to get upto speed, unless of course you are racing. What people want to know is that X amount of fuel should be roughly enough to Y miles before needing another top up.

I doubt that they will be able to say that when you remember that the battery has been around since 1839 (History of the battery - Wikipedia) and has gone through many changes in performance and size, style etc since then and in 1794, Robert Street patented an internal-combustion engine, which was also the first to use liquid fuel (petroleum) and built an engine around that time. That liquid fuel would have been in a container of some sort, and simply filling that container with the same type of liquid fuel would give that engine a good chance of still be able to work. History of the internal combustion engine - Wikipedia

How can they claim 300 ultra rapid stations when he says that they have 10 bays and 4 long wheelbase bays and only at 150kW? What am I missing here?

There is again so much wrong with the above claims but I'm not even going to attempt to address them and prolong this frankly stupid exchange of words except to say the inlet does not do anything to douse the flames as the batteries will still burn under water and if the battery is already on fire (notice the word IF) then the fire brigades will not be able to get water into the inlet as fire and or a deadly mix gases will be emitted through the said inlet preventing access. If the battery is not on fire, then sending hundreds of gallons of water coursing around the battery will rapidly cool the battery and hopefully prevent them from being part of the fire, but would also write the battery off because corrosion will set in which will ultimatly cause a battery fire later on. As to ICE owners needing to let go of the past and getting on board to the new cleaner future, as I said in an earlier post , lets park that that claim for now because I fully expect that will be fully debunked in the fullness of time. I 100% accept that the future will be cleaner at the point of where the car is being used, but far from it at the point of mining, shipping, and end of life as we are not being told the whole truth here. I'll also say that I'm extremelly surprised to see you responding in the massive defence of EV's to extent of trying to rubbish what was a factual claim and statement about ICE v EV, I've always thought of you and @Ootohere as the more sane EV owners / drivers.

Assuming car is maintained and no binding brakes then the only thing to affect mpg is your right foot in the main assuming same terrain.

OK guys, let's cool it down a bit can we, we all know that ICE is not as efficent as electric in converting an energy source into movement, we also, or at least we are told that the overall pollution of of EV is way less than it's ICE equivelent. All that is being claimed here is that, which started this heated discussion is that a 12 year old EV which had a new range of approx 140 miles, now only can do approx 30+ miles, whereas you can take a ICE car of similar age or even older, brim it and it will still do the same miles that it did when it was new. There is no need for the EV guys to attempt to demonised ICE cars on the amount of BHP lost or the amount of pollution they create. Just because someone has pointed out a fact that you don't like, you don't have to go into full on attack and defend your EVs. I have to say that it is no wonder that you are called evangelists 🙄. Fact that what has been claimed ICE is a fact. What some of you are claiming about in the future has yet to be proven, which I say that I have seen all kinds of claims by experts and politicians alike before about the filthy dirty diesels, and history may well be repeating in the not so distant future. So please can we all remember that we need to keep it in perspective here? 👍

Also of course, the actual range never decreases, if anything it will increase as the car gets run in. My car will do on motorways around 900miles to a tank and the car has already done 160,000 miles.

Not the world's best for build quality are they.

Also kind of suggests that troubles are just over the horizon, IMO.

Agreed, if that is all that you need the car to do.