Cage Mod Result and Alternative Engine

[Mr Wobblytickle]

I tried the Cage Mod on my standard 04-plate vRS last night and, after letting the ECU get used to it, there was… no appreciable difference.

To be honest, I wasn’t expecting any improvement, as the car runs so well anyway (starts immediately, engine almost silent at speeds over 20mph if not giving it The Beans, tailpipe needs de-sooting, what little there is, only once a week).

That and the facts it’s done only 9000 miles and the MAF plug is clean as a whistle and features golden connectors.

However, I had a go anyway, as many others have had their seemingly fine-running motors enhanced by the mod and it’s well worth trying, especially given the meagre outlay, electrical insulation and protection given to the connectors.

But how can you tell if your motor is underperforming in the absence of diagnostic equipment and/or a rolling road, even when all seems ok?

Well, might I suggest simply noting where in the rev range the needle begins to slow, and in what gear, when giving it The Beans?

With my car, for example, the needle cleanly sweeps all the way to 4500rpm without slowing in the first three gears (in 1st and 2nd it will wing past 4500rpm if I’m not careful).

If yours does not, the car is likely running less well than mine.

If it does, then it’s running the same as mine.

And if it manages this feat in 4th, it is certainly running much better than mine/has had the power upped.

I know many change up before this, but I often don’t due to the no-slow.

Presently, I have nothing to compare my results to, so my car is running either rubbish, normal, or above average.

I know this is a real ready reckoner of engine performance, but you can’t argue with physics.

Well, not with Acceleration = Force/Mass, anyway.

I also fully realise that for any results to be truly meaningful, my car would need to have been dynoed and shown to be running optimally.

But that said, I’m sure it is and it will be interesting to see how other cars do.

Edited 8 August, 2008 by Mr Wobblytickle

[skudmissile]

I am either very drunk/tired or stupid but your post has no point? theres no ending just waffle :confused:

[sporta]

must have something you read it all.

[Mr Wobblytickle]

I am either very drunk/tired or stupid but your post has no point? theres no ending just waffle :confused:

You know, it's entirely possible you could be all three.

Anyhoo, the 'point' of the post was to suggest a quick and free way of telling if your vRS is running optimally.

Surely that's got to be a good thing?

As I pointed out, many have thought their cars have been running just fine... but then have tried the Cage Mod and subsequently found them running even better.

But how can you tell?

Cue the Alternative Engine Diagnoserizer, which gives a benchmark of optimal performance to compare your car to.

Get it now?

[skudmissile]

Sort of, I am still a little drunk from last night

Edited 26 September, 2008 by DGW
Quote of previous post deleted.

[glanzav_mr2]

just get it on a rolling rod its cheap enough

you will be able to see everything from that

[glanzav_mr2]

road that is i think im drunk too

[micmason123]

I think I get it...

But there is alot to read around to get to the point...

So basically...

If your car can pull steadliy in 1st, 2nd and 3rd gear its running well.

If it doesnt... then its not running well.

And if it pulls well in 4th gear as well... then its running better than well.

And so pulling well in 5th and 6th gear would surely be a bonus.!

....I think thats what he meant.?

....Correct me if im wrong.?

Michael

[Mr Wobblytickle]

I think I get it...

But there is alot to read around to get to the point...

So basically...

If your car can pull steadliy in 1st, 2nd and 3rd gear its running well.

If it doesnt... then its not running well.

And if it pulls well in 4th gear as well... then its running better than well.

And so pulling well in 5th and 6th gear would surely be a bonus.!

....I think thats what he meant.?

....Correct me if im wrong.?

Michael

By jove, I think somebody's got it!

And thanks for taking the time and effort to try to assimilate the post.

However, it's not just about 'pulling well'.

It's about the the rev needle not slowing until after it passes 4500rpm.

From hearing others say that they change up at 4000rpm (or below) I conclude that they have a good reason for this.

One good reason would be a drop off in acceleration.

If this is happening in the first three gears, then I would suggest their engine is not performing optimally.

For the record, although my car has not been on a dyno (yet), I believe it to be running at a near-optimal level, as I know for a fact it can do in excess of an indicated 130mph (on a track, naturally), it returns good MPGs, produces little soot, pulls strongly in 4th, 5th and 6th, didn't benefit from the Cage Mod and is a good bit quicker than my old 150BHP Alfa 145 1.8TS.

PS - Please pardon any prior and potentially superfluous verbosity if it seemed to serve to only obfuscate the concept I was trying to elucidate. In future, I will endeavour to be exponentially more precise and concise.

PPS - How does your car compare?

[cjb]

As I pointed out, many have thought their cars have been running just fine... but then have tried the Cage Mod and subsequently found them running even better.

There's some speculation that the cage mod seems effective becase unplugging then reconnectiong the MAF cleans the contacts, rather than the dieleectric grease itself.

[Mr Wobblytickle]

just get it on a rolling rod its cheap enough

you will be able to see everything from that

Indeed.

And if I drive 50 miles and hand over 50 Green Queens, I'll know for sure.

I will be doing this at the next available opportunity (other things first though, like a trip to Seat Surgeons next week), but in the meantime, the Alternative Engine Diagnoserizer is fun, free and should give a fairly accurate indication of relative performance.

Of course, if anyone can see any glaring errors in my logic/method, then I would welcome their input.

[Mr Wobblytickle]

There's some speculation that the cage mod seems effective becase unplugging then reconnectiong the MAF cleans the contacts, rather than the dieleectric grease itself.

Quite.

And I can see the logic.

Of course, it all depends on the underlying problem.

But, cleaned-up contacts aside, there's little doubt ECUs love a 'clean' electrical signal.

According to the great sage, Cage himself, there appears to be more to the story than clean contacts alone: TDIClub Forums - View Single Post - Stumbling mystery solved. MAF!

Further, Cage found that "one damp rainy day it ran like hell".

This perhaps suggests that, even where there is good contact in the MAF plug, a 'dirty' electrical signal can result from increased humidity.

The dielectric grease could negate this, making every day a 'dry' day, with smooth running.

Edited 9 August, 2008 by Mr Wobblytickle

[Disco_Mikey]

http://www.awesome-gti.co.uk/rollingroad/graph/rr.briskoda_20.10.07/01.jpg

http://www.awesome-gti.co.uk/rollingroad/graph/rr.briskoda_20.10.07/02.jpg

http://www.awesome-gti.co.uk/rollingroad/graph/rr.briskoda_20.10.07/05.jpg

http://www.awesome-gti.co.uk/rollingroad/graph/rr.briskoda_20.10.07/19.jpg

You change up at 4k revs because thats when the power starts dropping off

[Mr Wobblytickle]

You change up at 4k revs because thats when the power starts dropping off

I know.

But try telling that to my car!

Or to the rev needle at least.

I suppose, worst case, the needle is not actually indicating actual RPM, and on the swing past 4000RPM, is only doing so at an apparent constant velocity due to momentum, although I would have thought this to be negligible.

Anyhoo, even though the power does drop off after 4000RPM, if your needle doesn't swing like mine, then then your car is not performing like mine, so the comparison stands.

So, how does yours stack up?

[Disco_Mikey]

Its quick enough to keep me happy(ish), but i havnt had a chance to try this yet, so cant comment...

[Mr Wobblytickle]

Its quick enough to keep me happy(ish), but i havnt had a chance to try this yet, so cant comment...

Will be interesting to hear how you get on then.

[normanmatthew]

This whole thread is a joke.

[Disco_Mikey]

Need to get me some grease first. Thats on the to-do list to!

[Mr Wobblytickle]

This whole thread is a joke.

Your considered and illuminating contribution is appreciated.

[Spanner]

You kind of putting your car up as a perfect 'golden sample' car and getting people to compare against yours?

Howver it isnt just how the rev needle moves but how the speedo moves as well. In theory as max torque is at 2k then as the revs rise your are not acclerating as quick which is why people change gear 'early' to keep it around max torque to maximise acceleration.

[Mr Wobblytickle]

You kind of putting your car up as a perfect 'golden sample' car and getting people to compare against yours?

Yeah, that's about the size of it.

However, I do, of course, realise that this may well not be the case at all.

That said, I have no reason to believe my car is not running optimally.

I'll only know when a few comparisons are posted, or I finally get it on a dyno.

In theory as max torque is at 2k then as the revs rise your are not acclerating as quick which is why people change gear 'early' to keep it around max torque to maximise acceleration.

Are you saying that after 2000RPM acceleration actually falls off?

And what, if any, effect does the rising BHP output have on acceleration after 2000RPM?

All I know is that with my car at least, in the first three gears, the needle swings without slowing until 4500RPM.

Edited 10 August, 2008 by Mr Wobblytickle
clarity, less verbosity,

[flands]

Somebody stop this! we all know its pointless going past 4k revs on a standard fabia vrs,

1. the power drops

2.your ragging the crap out of your poor little car

I've had it rolling roaded, I have my own little graph/plott, So I know when to change for my car. It does happily rev past 4 its just I know if I change gear at around 4 then it has plenty of umph I also believe my car is going aswell as what it should be. Its been serviced on time and looked after. Also I don't usually find my self reving past 2.5/3k revs any more theres enough power there to overtake and i'd prefer to save on the MPG. I must just be getting old :S

[Decron]

Somebody stop this! we all know its pointless going past 4k revs on a standard fabia vrs,

1. the power drops

2.your ragging the crap out of your poor little car

I've had it rolling roaded, I have my own little graph/plott, So I know when to change for my car. It does happily rev past 4 its just I know if I change gear at around 4 then it has plenty of umph I also believe my car is going aswell as what it should be. Its been serviced on time and looked after. Also I don't usually find my self reving past 2.5/3k revs any more theres enough power there to overtake and i'd prefer to save on the MPG. I must just be getting old :S

Hmmm. Either you are getting old or you need to invest in a custom map

[flands]

Hmmm. Either you are getting old or you need to invest in a custom map

I guess the girlfriend is right then, I am an old man but i did just put 50 litres in the tank and im under the false illusion this is to last me the month. cant see it happening myself.

[Decron]

I guess the girlfriend is right then, I am an old man but i did just put 50 litres in the tank and im under the false illusion this is to last me the month. cant see it happening myself.

I go through at least one of those a week!