Some quite clear questions:

-is there same flywheel, clutch plate and clutch axle bore in Felicia and 8 valve Fabia?

-if not, will Felicia flywheel fit in Fabia crank?

-is Felicia original clutch 180 mm dia and how it is in Fabia?

I have one little project in my mind and I´d need Fabia "downstears": crank, pistons, cylinder tubes and rods. So, if someone have these for sale, I´m really interested!

No they're different - Fabia is 6-bolt, Felicia is 4-bolt, and I believe they are different dimensions as well (i.e. the flywheel's 'offset' in terms of ring gear position to the mounting face).

Fel flywheel can be made to fit on a Fabia crank; I believe that James (fruitbat) has done this.

i seem to remember old fruity saying that you need to modify the water pump? if you want to fit a fabia 1400 engine into a felicia too?

Well, yeah, James made a new mount that used the Fabia water pump (similar to your 1.4 16v thing, as in it used existing mounting points), but if it's going in a Fav/Fel then he's the man to speak to as he's been there and got the T-shirt. There were pics on the other Skoda forum, but I can't find them...

Yes, project is to fit Fabia crank into Felicia block. It will need some machining inside the block to make bearings fit but it is possible. Well, have to ask James about this, especially that flywheel issue is still a bit unclear.

Oh, well, if you're doing that, then it's definitely possible - Engitec used to do it, and modify the Felicia flywheel to fit on the Fabia crank.

Oh, well, if you're doing that, then it's definitely possible - Engitec used to do it, and modify the Felicia flywheel to fit on the Fabia crank.

I should have better clarify my plans earlier .

This modification is aimed to build Felicia 1400 KitCar for GrA in rally. Fabia block is not allowed but long-stroke crank is. Mr DJ, you mentioned that this is common modification and Engitec has made these. Do you know more about this project?

I don't think that will be Grp A legal by the book; the Group A engine was homologated at 1298cc with the standard bore and stroke, while the Kit Car engine was larger (I think 1411cc, I've not got the homologation papers here) - BUT the only kit cars that are allowed by FIA rules are the original ones made by Skoda, and you can only apply the VK (Kit Car) parts including the engine as a whole; you're not allowed to use a Kit engine in Group A.

However, that aside, I'm sure it'll be a nice car; how are you going to get round the front track issue? Will you just use wheels with a bigger offset?

As for the engine, Engitec advertised it on their engineering page before their website became "parts only" - they offered a number of engines, including a 'long stroke' conversion that used a Fabia crank, apparently; the block needed to be modified to clear the crank; I'm not sure what other changes were needed (shorter con rods would be needed, or pistons with a different deck height); I had a 1400cc Fabia engine for a while, but eventually gave up on the idea, as I'm currently doing Group A international rallies in the Felicia and it wouldn't have been legal.

Yes indeed, as Darren says, the Fabia Flywheel has a six-bolt mounting to the crank, and it's worth noting that the bolt holes aren't equally spaced at 60 degrees either - there's one which is slightly out, so be carefully if you're re-drilling a Felicia flywheel to fit a Fabia crank.

The reason I changed to the Felicia flywheel on the fabia crank is that the Fabia flywheel has a much shallower dish than the felicia one - I had a felicia paddle clutch I wanted to fit, and it wouldn't fit onto the fabia flywheel.

I've just checked again, and it appears that the two flywheels are almost exactly the same thickness, so the starter ring looks like it ends up in the same place. If you were using the Fabia clutch assembly, my gut feel is that you could use a Fabia flyweel OK with a felicia gearbox. It would be worth checking though.

The other good thing about the Fabia flywheel is that it has a decent crank trigger sensor pattern machined onto it - 60-2 if I'm not mistaken, which saves the hassle of fitting a trigger wheel to the crank pulley.

They do appear to be different at the other end of the crank as well. A felicia flywheel pulley doesn't fit onto the Fabia crank, and the Fabia pulley sits further away from the block. This is the reason that I had to use a fabia water pump and fabricate an engine mount to fit the Fabia engine to my felicia (otherwise the crank pulley wasn't in line with the alternator and water pump pulleys). I've since heard that using a power steering Felicia water pump fixes this, but I haven't checked that in person yet.

By the way, if anyone *wants* a 1.4 8v Fabia flywheel that has been lightened from 7.2 to 4.9 KG, do let me know. I paid to have the machining done before I noticed it didn't fit the clutch... Doh!

James

The other good thing about the Fabia flywheel is that it has a decent crank trigger sensor pattern machined onto it - 60-2 if I'm not mistaken, which saves the hassle of fitting a trigger wheel to the crank pulley.

yes, and the timing reference on it is 85 degrees btdc for those of you who are using emerald/dta/motec ecu's

I´m quite sure that Fabia crank is legal in class A5 Felicia, but your points related to fiiting work in practice makes me wonder if that is meaningful operation. Let´s see, thanks for your many advices anyway.

One more measaurement question related to this, is Felicia original clutch disc 180 mm dia? If not, what is it and does 1800 mm keramic paddle disc fit with original assembly?

I've just checked the homologation papers - the only 78mm stroke engine is the 1500cc kit car one (1490cc), which is 78x78. And as that's under VK, you can't fit it to a Group A car.

Page 1 of the homologation papers for the Felicia show the CC, which is 1289.4; altering the engine from this would be breaking the rules anyway, but in addition:

Looking under the Group A regs (App J 255), under 5.1.5 it says:

Apart from the modifications permitted by the above paragraph "General Conditions", additional mechanical treatments, different from those carried out on the series production part, are not allowed.

and similar is said for the flywheel, which would need to be modified to suit the Fabia crank (even if it was allowed).

While, under section 5, it says:

Any addition of material or parts is forbidden unless it is specifically allowed by an article in these regulations.

i.e. you can't put a different part in.

I'm sure it'd be a good idea, but it's not going to be Group A legal, for sure.

As for the clutch, I've just measured one, it's 190mm diameter. You need to be careful with ceramic paddle clutches that the springs in the plate will clear the flywheel bolts on the Felicia engine (as many seem to be centred on the middle-line of the plate, rather than set outwards as the original one is)

quick sort of related question... can you put the 4 hole flywheel on in any position on the crank if the car has an ecu (distribuless)? if so how does the ecu know when to fire number 1?

No, you can't, you need to retain the relationship between crank and flywheel. The ECU takes its timing reference from the flywheel timing marks, so that's why.