My problem/history is:

Shark remap, original clutch lasted 4000 miles before it started slipping.

Thought ok will get a good quality clutch and wont have any more clutch issues, ended up fitting a new DMF with Sachs clutch: http://www.jabbaspor...SCK6SPDSACHSTDI

Two and half years and 38k miles after fitting the sachs clutch just got clutch slip 2 days ago (also had 2 slave cylinders blow), pretty disappointed as I expected it to be a lot longer lasting than this, I don't do any form of racing, the VRS is just a daily driver but I do use the torque for overtaking, never done a 0-60 flat out with it just hard in gear acceleration.

Doing research now on what clutch to go for next so interested to hear from anyone with an uprated clutch that has been in use for a long time, what clutch is it and how long have you had it fitted ?

Helix and SMF seem to be the choice for outright performance but not sure I could live with the chatter, Southbend seem to be a bit unknown in the long term (but popular in the USA), CG Motorsport seem to have reports on seatcupra.net of the paddle clutches being worn out after 30k 2 years easy use, Jabba SMF use Sachs which I am keen to avoid now.

So anyone had an uprated clutch fitted for 30,000 plus miles ? how is it holding up ?

Thanks

Without sounding horrible, have you considered the way your using the power is maybe wearing the clutch out? When mine was mapped it was on a 120,000 mile clutch, which was then used for another 20,000 miles before being uprated because I was running a big turbo.

A new clutch on a smoothly mapped car should do 100,000 miles easy.

It may well be your driving style! Mines been fine but I was really worried about it. Just make sure your above around 2,500 rpm before you floor it. The worst gear to boot it from low rpm is 5th and 6th!

I appreciate what you are saying but I don't ride the clutch, I don't do drag starts when pulling away, I do use full power when overtaking and accelerating onto dual carrigeways etc

Everyone says Shark are smooth and quiet Conservative maps so should not be any problems there.

They way I see it (could be wrong but I don't think so), if the sachs clutch is rated at 410lbft torque and a shark stage 1 remap is maybe producing 280lbft torque then no matter what rpm I accelerate from then the clutch should have no problems coping with it, if you have good power at 2000rpm why wait till 2500rpm before going to full throttle ?

I realise diesels produce power pulses and that the DMF is there to smooth them out but never using full throttle under 2500rpm seem a bit strange, if you are nursing a standard clutch then maybe but the sachs clutch should be more than capable of handling what a Shark stage one map can dish out !

This is why I am interested to hear of any uprated clutches that have been used in the longer term, are they good at handling power/torque but have a reduced life span ? is it normal to spend £1000 on a clutch and expect to replace it every couple of years ?

I appreciate what you are saying but I don't ride the clutch, I don't do drag starts when pulling away, I do use full power when overtaking and accelerating onto dual carrigeways etc

Everyone says Shark are smooth and quiet Conservative maps so should not be any problems there.

They way I see it (could be wrong but I don't think so), if the sachs clutch is rated at 410lbft torque and a shark stage 1 remap is maybe producing 280lbft torque then no matter what rpm I accelerate from then the clutch should have no problems coping with it, if you have good power at 2000rpm why wait till 2500rpm before going to full throttle ?

I realise diesels produce power pulses and that the DMF is there to smooth them out but never using full throttle under 2500rpm seem a bit strange, if you are nursing a standard clutch then maybe but the sachs clutch should be more than capable of handling what a Shark stage one map can dish out !

This is why I am interested to hear of any uprated clutches that have been used in the longer term, are they good at handling power/torque but have a reduced life span ? is it normal to spend £1000 on a clutch and expect to replace it every couple of years ?

the point is that under 2500 the torque spike is sharp which is why it harms the clutch as it cannot cope with the sharp rapid increase. and yeah you can spend silly amounts on a clutch but why ?? it would be cheaper for you all round to change how you drive ??you would use less fuel and prolong the life of your car.

If you do put this awesome clutch in and keep driving as you are other parts may start to deteriate. The standard diff on the fabia wont be amazing and there are a few reports of gear box's calling it a day.

either way its your car and drive it as you wish but it may end up hurting your wallet in the process

Ok, I don't agree but hey ho

Clutch rated at 410lbft but it cannot in the long term handle 280lbft even if it is from under 2500rpm, does not make sense to me, this is tounge in cheek but maybe the clutch should come with a warning "torque rating 410lbft if rpm over 2500, under 2500rpm only use half throttle", does sound silly when you say it like that but that is what you guys are suggesting, it is a clutch designed for the TDI so they must know what they are capable of when designing it surely ?

Still interested in hearing about anyone using an uprated clutch over long time use, 2+ years or 30,000 miles+

Im running the clutch in your link. I bought it second hand, had been run on a hybrid 200bhp fabia. Iv done another 35,000 miles since on my hybrid fabia. If I really abuse it then it is just starting to slip a tiny bit, but its only happened twice so far. Estimate its done over 70,000 miles in total.

My old hybrid fab had the Sachs organic clutch & DMF and coped perfectly well with 330lbs, though I did not floor it under 2500rpm either. Since selling it about 18 months ago I believe its still going strong. If driven with a little care, it ought to deal with a stage one map all day long.

Back to the original question, my current vehicle has the Helix clutch with Jabbasport lightened SMF and it is superb. I've driven just shy of 20k miles with it and have no problems at all. Gear changes when making progress are crisp and firm, violent in comparison with the Sachs & DMF.

Some folks might not like it in heavy (stop/start) traffic as the pedal IS heavy, but you get used to it. I've never stalled it because of the clutch as some people report. The other common complaint is the chatter, which doesn't bother me in the slightest.

Workmen have kindly informed me from their vans in traffic ques that my car sounds like its, erm, fornicated. Honestly, the looks you get at idle are sometimes comical, particularly in cold weather where the gases venting from the CCV give the illusion that the (clattering) car is on fire.

I suppose the moral of the story is any clutch can be destroyed if used incorrectly, I remember reading of someone destroying a Helix on here once; which must've taken some doing.

clarky666 - would be interested to hear if the chatter noise can be heard inside the car or is it just obvious from the outside ?

There are 2 possibilities still with mine, 1st is its only slipped once so with a bit of care it may still have some life left in it, the other is the fact I have had 2 slave cylinders blow, most of the brake fluid has gone to the bottom of the bell housing and escaped through the little channel onto the undertray (guess that's why it is there) but some may have contaminated the clutch plate but I won't be able to tell until it's all removed for replacement.

The chatter can be heard in the car both at idle and when driving slow in 1st and 2nd gear (car parks, traffic etc). Once the clutch is dipped the noise goes. It really doesn't bother me.

I think there is a video on YouTube of a black fab filmed from the outside with the engine running & clutch being dipped a few times so you can hear the difference of the SMF chatter, or clatter as I call it.

Failing that, you're welcome to hear mine. PM me if required :-)

Edited 1 April, 201313 yr by Clarkey666

Hmmmm ...

I ran a standard clutch, 85k clutch, on a stage 1 shark map - started to slip after 12 months .

I ran the uprated Sachs organic clutch & DMF on the same map, in 8 months no problems.

I then ran the uprated Sachs organic clutch & DMF on a hybrid set up, died within a month.

Judging from the above, do I have good or bad driving style ?

I have no idea on what sort of power im running as yet to put it on a dyno, was tweaked on how it drove rather then the numbers shown on the screen.

It depends on how you drive it I would think. I've always read/been advised that booting the car below 2k rpm is a bad idea, and generally found the fabs I've had respond best at or above 2.5k rpm anyway, so I tend to accelerate from that point if I'm overtaking etc.

Again referring to my old hybrid fab; that was Shark tuned and gave the clutch no problems at all (as mentioned, Sachs organic & DMF).

Even the strongest clutch could fail if abused enough. That principal could be applied to anything to be fair- turbos, brakes, clutches etc. If pushed hard enough I'm sure all those components would fail rather quickly. For instance, I recall a chap on here who never let his car warm up before "giving it hell", which is asking for turbo failure.

I'm not making assumptions here, but there is a lot to be said for driving style.

Another consideration could be a faulty component (clutch). Stranger things have happened, plus many standard cars have had clutch failiures.

Surely the Sachs units can't be that bad? Mine certainly wasn't.

Unless someone can give a detailed explanation of this under 2500rpm torque spike then I'm afraid I don't subscribe to it, just had a quick search for rolling road graphs for the fabia VRS with remap and they seem to have less than 200lbft at 2000rpm, were at 2500-3000rpm they have 270-280lbft, that would suggest going to full throttle at 2000rpm would be far less stressful than going to full throttle at 2500rpm.

So this torque spike at under 2500rpm, if the car was on a rolling road and was given full throttle at 2000rpm would the rolling road record a torque spike of over 410lbft (which the clutch is rated for) ?? in reality I suspect it would be under 200lbft.

I have quiet often seen people repeating on this forum "don't give it full throttle under 2500rpm" but I've never seen any kind of explanation of why or were this idea came from, maybe someone who remaps cars would be able to explain this theory and give some insight into if its a myth or true.

put it this way if you was on a motorbike with a reasonable amount of power and you slammed the throttle wide open you would get thrown off the back but if you change down so the bike is in its power band/ range before flooring it everything is fine.

you car is exactly the same its not necessarily how many torques you have its how quickly they increase from accelerating low down. if you abuse your car something will suffer.

It is you car and your bank account if you enjoy buying / fitting clutches then great no worries but if you change down a gear to 4th before overtaking then your next clutch will most probs last the life time of the car ....

I have quiet often seen people repeating on this forum "don't give it full throttle under 2500rpm" but I've never seen any kind of explanation of why or were this idea came from, maybe someone who remaps cars would be able to explain this theory and give some insight into if its a myth or true.

You tend to find most remaps give around 300lbsft which is more than the stock clutch is rated too. So the don't boot below 2.5k comes into play.

Some maps can give a sharp initial torque increase by this I mean instead of building up too 300 lbsft it's their straight away.

I'm not buying it either. To me if you have the power then use it.

Any dyo plots of a shark remap?

I'm not buying it either. To me if you have the power then use it.

great attitude there .... the US have the power to blow the world up with nuclear weapons so why dont they think **** it we have the power so lets just use it...

answer because it will **** something and some one and some ones wallet will get hurt

Edited 1 April, 201313 yr by Holmesie

Oh my clutch is still the original at 120k miles. I often use the power from as low as 2k when in 2nd or 3rd. Higher gears I do tend to drop it down a gear.

great attitude there .... the US have the power to blow the world up with nuclear weapons so why dont they think **** it we have the power so lets just use it...

answer because it will **** something and some one and some ones wallet will get hurt

But surly if I bought a brand new car and was told it has x power i'd expect I can use it without breaking something.

Obviously abusing something is different. Doing I paid a lot of money for a clutch that was rated to 410lbsft I'd expect I'd be able to use it. If not then why bother when you could stick with an oem clutch?

I agree with the sharp torque increase but if its smooth then I don't see an issue.

Oh my clutch is still the original at 120k miles. I often use the power from as low as 2k when in 2nd or 3rd. Higher gears I do tend to drop it down a gear.

well thats the thing 1 ,2 ,3 you can do whatever but in 5th and 6th the engine is using alot of torque to try and turn a very high gear and its the bit in the middle joining the 2 that suffers......

But surly if I bought a brand new car and was told it has x power i'd expect I can use it without breaking something.

Obviously abusing something is different. Doing I paid a lot of money for a clutch that was rated to 410lbsft I'd expect I'd be able to use it. If not then why bother when you could stick with an oem clutch?

clutches are like penis's every one claims to have the biggest and the best but when it come to in they quite often fall very short of the mark and generally leave you with your pants down

As the owner of a 2009 CBR1000rr Fireblade and having had a few bikes over the last 30 years (for example rgv250, cbr600, FZR1000 EXUP, Yamaha R1) I don't think comparing it to the power delivery of a bike is very good, cracking it open when in the max power band you are more likely to wheelie and flip it (in 1st or 2nd gear), never heard of anyone being thrown off the back of a bike by wacking open the throttle, don't know if you have experienced a 1000cc bike at full throttle but its not that hard to hold on but it is easy to wheelie if you are not alert.

Anyway I'm with faboka vrs, the power is there to be used, you should not have to force yourself to avoid full throttle below 2500rpm, if there is a fundamental problem at lower revs it should be mapped out by the mapping people.

I spent £1000 on a clutch and new DMF thinking a clutch rated at 410lbft would be bullet roof for me with a stage 1 remap, this is why I am interested to hear from anyone with high milage use from an uprated clutch to hear how they are getting on, so far no one with over 30k miles continuous use on an uprated clutch has replied to this thread, so I have nothing to compare my clutch problem to.

Shark maps are renowned for being smooth maps so I don't think it would have a massive initial torque increase.

All I am looking for from this post is facts on uprated clutches over the longer term.

I spent £1000 on a clutch and new DMF thinking a clutch rated at 410lbft would be bullet roof for me with a stage 1 remap, this is why I am interested to hear from anyone with high milage use from an uprated clutch to hear how they are getting on, so far no one with over 30k miles continuous use on an uprated clutch has replied to this thread, so I have nothing to compare my clutch problem to.

Oh really?

Im running the clutch in your link. I bought it second hand, had been run on a hybrid 200bhp fabia. Iv done another 35,000 miles since on my hybrid fabia. If I really abuse it then it is just starting to slip a tiny bit, but its only happened twice so far. Estimate its done over 70,000 miles in total.

In my first reply, I thought you were running a stock clutch. However, I looked at the link after and saw you actually have the uprated clutch (same as mine). Therefore, I agree with you, a clutch uprated and listed as being able to cope with 400+ torque should easy cope with any remap and anyway you decide to drive it. The DMF on the other hand it still a stock item and will suffer from the booting it at high gear/low rpm situations but that isnt really relevant as the DMF isnt the issue. I gave you the age of my clutch to compare, it has had a far harder life than yours and it's still going fairly strong. One thing I was told to try when mine slipped was to do a few hard launches to "de glaze" the plate. It hasnt done it since, and I still give it some stick. Sachs are a pretty well rated company, not some cheap knock off make so I would expect them to hold up.

Hi mate,

Perhaps a few facts on my previous Fab might help, as I didn't point them all out on my previous posts in this thread.

I bought it at 39k miles, with the clutch upgrade (Sachs organic & DMF) already installed. It was already (badly, as it transpired) remapped & ran something like 162.5bhp & 290lbs/ft (dyno'd @RS Tuning) prior to the turbo going.

Bearing supporting mods in mind (clutch, PD160 intake, 312s, suspension etc) I had an Allard VT2 (Hybrid PD150) & Forge FMIC fitted @ Shark Performance along with a custom remap which put out the figures I alluded to earlier.

I drove that car properly (warmed up/hard/cooled down) & sold it @ 86k miles and never had any issues.

Edited 1 April, 201313 yr by Clarkey666

I did 45k on a helix in one car

10k on a helix in another

And 20k on another helix!

All were perfect without issue!

Cracking clutches

I also had a sachs and dmf!

After 20k miles the dmf was gubbed although the clutch was still fine! And that was only at 195bhp and 300lb/ft