Is the Mk III Superb 1.6 TDI underpowered?

[TheSledge]

I’m considering buying a used Mk 3 and the only ones in my budget appear to be the 1.6TDI - having read lots of reviews from the motoring press, the consensus seems to be that the 2.0 TDI 150 is the best engine.

 Can owners of 1.6 TDIs please share their thoughts on long-term ownership of the 118bhp 1.6 TDI engine to help me decide whether I’d be better off saving up a bit more for a 2.0 TDI 150?

Most of my journeys will be just me in the car, with one passenger and the pooch occasionally - I’ll rarely, if ever, have 5 adults on board and the only time the car will be fully loaded is on twice yearly trips to holiday cottages with the wife, her shoe collection and the family pooch.

One option is to go for the 1.6 and have it remapped to 145bhp.

Any thoughts or advice appreciated folks! 

[skidpan]

Simple solution, buy a 1.4 TSi 150 PS.

[beardyweirdy]

I had a 1.6 mk ii for a a few years and changed it for a 1.6 mk iii earlier this year. Mine is a well specced out SE L Exec and I find it great. Acceleration's not super quick, but nor is it remotely a problem. I'm not a slowcoach, but nor am I a boy racer (if I wanted something sporty I'd probably have bought a different car altogether).

 

For normal use it's been excellent. We drove from the UK to Denmark over the summer for a family holiday - it was loaded up with four of us (inc two teenage kids), all of our luggage and my bike (dismantled and packed in the boot). We drove all day at 80-90 mph, with the aircon on full blast and managed to get to the Danish border on a single tank of fuel, which worked out at over 60mpg.

 

I was concerned at first, 1.6 sounds far too little for such a big car, but in reality I've never had a problem. I'd happily have yet another.

[TheSledge]

28 minutes ago, skidpan said:

Simple solution, buy a 1.4 TSi 150 PS.

Unfortunately I do between 15,000 and 18,000 miles per year so petrol isn't really viable.

Spec is also an issue: I'd like all the toys that come with an SE L or SE business but there aren't petrol versions in this trim around. 

[TheSledge]

24 minutes ago, beardyweirdy said:

I had a 1.6 mk ii for a a few years and changed it for a 1.6 mk iii earlier this year. Mine is a well specced out SE L Exec and I find it great. Acceleration's not super quick, but nor is it remotely a problem. I'm not a slowcoach, but nor am I a boy racer (if I wanted something sporty I'd probably have bought a different car altogether).

 

For normal use it's been excellent. We drove from the UK to Denmark over the summer for a family holiday - it was loaded up with four of us (inc two teenage kids), all of our luggage and my bike (dismantled and packed in the boot). We drove all day at 80-90 mph, with the aircon on full blast and managed to get to the Danish border on a single tank of fuel, which worked out at over 60mpg.

 

I was concerned at first, 1.6 sounds far too little for such a big car, but in reality I've never had a problem. I'd happily have yet another.

Thanks for this. 

I button-holed a driver in Subway this morning who had a 67-reg Superb estate parked outside. His was a 1.6 and he said he regularly towed a caravan with it without any problems, although he did admit it was a company car and he changed it every two years.

 

[skidpan]

7 minutes ago, TheSledge said:

Unfortunately I do between 15,000 and 18,000 miles per year so petrol isn't really viable.

Spec is also an issue: I'd like all the toys that come with an SE L or SE business but there aren't petrol versions in this trim around. 

 

I used to buy diesels and saved loads of money on fuel but that was when petrols did much less mpg than modern TSi's. The Seat and now the Skoda with the 1.4 TSi have averaged a real 45 mpg approx. The best mpg we had form a diesel in exactly the same use was a 1.6 CRDi Ceed 115 PS, it did approx 51 mpg. Over 15,000 miles at current pump prices the diesel would save you about £139, £417 if you keep the car 3 years. But you will be buying AdBlue for the diesel and there is always a chance it could have an expensive DPF failure that is not covered by any warranty. A new diesel 1.6 SE costs £305 more than a 1.4 TSi SE so that is most of the potential saving gone. Diesels used to be worth more second hand, not sure with the current anti diesel feeling if that is still the case.

 

As for the 1.6 diesels we owned, they were a Focus with the 110 PS engine and it was not quick, never again. The Kia Ceed with the 115 PS was much better but both 1.4 TSi's have been in a different league. We did try a Seat Altea with the 110 PS engine when we were swapping the Focus and it was truly dreadful. We also had a 90 PS 1.9 Golf TSI for 7 years which we used for towing and that was fine.

 

As for trim our SE has everything (and more) than we could ever want.

 

Not anti diesel but most people who have tried the TSi have been more than surprised.

[Flipfly]

Picked up my SportLine estate last week with pan roof, canton stereo, keyless, tow bar (factory fit). More than enough toys for any man. They are out there, just have to jump on one when you see them. 

 

I do 45k a year and petrol makes perfect sense, so not sure how you figure that at your mileage it won’t. Petrol is becoming significantly cheaper and would expect the difference to continue to grow with current anti diesel sentiment.

 

Even if it does cost a bit more, the petrol is so quiet it’d be worth the small extra cost.

[MCG1975]

I've had my Mk3 1.6 TDi since 1st February 2016, it's a company car and I cover about 30,000 a year in it (today saw 86,000 pop up).  I can't say I've really driven any cars more powerful so my frame of reference is a bit different, but with it being usually just me in the car I've never really found a significant lack of power if I really need it, but then I'm not a boy racer.  My previous cars have been a 1.2TDi Ibiza (70PS), 1.4TDi Polo (80PS) and a handful of Peugeot diesels (307, 406 estates) none of which had as many horses as the Superb. 

 

I commute around 50 miles each way on dual carriageways, plus other trips to site and customers as needed and on all roads I've found it comfortable and perfectly adequate - in fact that's probably what I'd say, it's 'adequate', nothing that's going to get your pulse racing but it does the job.  As you can (hopefully if it's working) see from my Fuelly thing in my signature I'm getting a reasonable mpg from the car, helped by the reasonably long trips.  This probably also helped the front tyres to last 46,000 (they're apparently getting low again) and the rears to go for 72,000 - I've got 16" wheels with clown tyres but it makes for a comfortable ride.  As you might have seen from my profile thingy the car is a basic 'S' as my company car budget only just squeaked me into Superb territory but I'm so happy with the car that I've arranged for my 3 year use of the car to be extended to 4 since with price rises I now can't afford the same thing.  I don't have lots of toys but I figure it's less to go wrong!

 

Haven't towed, but have had half a ton of gravel in the car a couple of times, plus about 300kg of ceramic tiles once - the rear suspension was a bit low but I drove from Bishop's Stortford back to Norfolk like that and the car was happy (I just took it very gently!). Even with all four of the family in the car it happily cruises along - my kids love it as they're tall and they appreciate the space (and complain when they have to get in my wife's little Polo!).

 

Interesting comments about petrol working out as cheap even with high annual mileage - I've partially delayed changing my car so all this shenanigans around diesel gets a chance to calm down a bit so I can work out the difference.  Will definitely be considering all options in 2020...

[Gerrycan]

You have not said what your current vehicle is because obviously that will influence your view on whether the 1.6d performance is adequate or not.

It is always interesting to hear other's views but ultimately you are best arranging some sort of test drive and determining your own view.

My own test drives and ownership experiences have often been at odds with others here, or even professional reviewers.

 

Either the 1.6d or, if you can get one,  the 1.4tsi are good choices providing adequate performance for UK public roads. As stated by others there is not likely to be as much consumption variance as you think other than when towing. If you can find a 2.0D you can afford then that would be the better option and real life consumption would be similar to the 1.6D.

The official consumption claims for the 1.6D are probably more optimistic than any other VW engine based on real life returns posted in Briskoda. 

 

Since you are buying second hand what is your budget and mileage on the vehicles you are looking at?

Any preferences regarding  manual or auto? If auto then the 1.4tsi auto is the 7 speed 'dry' clutch. Others will confirm but I believe the auto box on the diesels is the 6 speed 'wet' clutch (I know it is on the 2.0D) which is considered more much more durable.

 

Edited 23 November, 2018 by Gerrycan

[skidpan]

13 hours ago, Gerrycan said:

The official consumption claims for the 1.6D are probably more optimistic than any other VW engine based on real life returns posted in Briskoda. 

 

Honest John Real mpg gives the 1.6 TDi  120 PS 53.9 mpg, it gives the 1.4 TSi 150 PS 46.4 mpg. In my calc above I suggested 45 for the TSi and 51 for the TDi thus the figures I produced will be pretty close, close enough to make the TDi poitless unless you are doing galactic miles mostly on the motorway.

 

13 hours ago, Gerrycan said:

Any preferences regarding  manual or auto? If auto then the 1.4tsi auto is the 7 speed 'dry' clutch. Others will confirm but I believe the auto box on the diesels is the 6 speed 'wet' clutch (I know it is on the 2.0D) which is considered more much more durable.

 

The 1.6 TDi's use the 7 speed dry clutch just like the TSi's do. It probably OK providing its serviced regularly and you swap the car before the warranty expires. Since the OP is buying used he has no idea how its been treated and could well be buying a money pit.

 

We had a 6 speed wet clutch version in a Golf 2 litre TDi at work. Abused by several drivers before becoming a pool car and getting abused by more. Sold at 150,000 with no issues.

[TheSledge]

On 21/11/2018 at 16:47, skidpan said:

 

I used to buy diesels and saved loads of money on fuel but that was when petrols did much less mpg than modern TSi's. The Seat and now the Skoda with the 1.4 TSi have averaged a real 45 mpg approx. The best mpg we had form a diesel in exactly the same use was a 1.6 CRDi Ceed 115 PS, it did approx 51 mpg. Over 15,000 miles at current pump prices the diesel would save you about £139, £417 if you keep the car 3 years. But you will be buying AdBlue for the diesel and there is always a chance it could have an expensive DPF failure that is not covered by any warranty. A new diesel 1.6 SE costs £305 more than a 1.4 TSi SE so that is most of the potential saving gone. Diesels used to be worth more second hand, not sure with the current anti diesel feeling if that is still the case.

 

As for the 1.6 diesels we owned, they were a Focus with the 110 PS engine and it was not quick, never again. The Kia Ceed with the 115 PS was much better but both 1.4 TSi's have been in a different league. We did try a Seat Altea with the 110 PS engine when we were swapping the Focus and it was truly dreadful. We also had a 90 PS 1.9 Golf TSI for 7 years which we used for towing and that was fine.

 

As for trim our SE has everything (and more) than we could ever want.

 

Not anti diesel but most people who have tried the TSi have been more than surprised.

 

Thanks for all the feedback folks, really useful.

I get all the reservations about the future of diesel but simply can't afford a used 1.4 150bhp TSi in SE L spec at the mo, so a dirty old oil burner it has to be...

Having driven a 1.6Tdi, I have now - with some sadness - discounted it from my wish list. The car itself (a 65-reg with 21,000 miles up) was outstanding but I found the engine lacked the guts that suit my driving style. I've just offloaded a 140bhp Mondeo 2.0 Tdci and the 1.6 engine in the Superb seemed a little wheezy.

I'm now considering a 65-reg 2.0 150bhp diesel with 50,000 miles up and test driving it in the morning. It's an SE L Exec and has all the toys I want (if more than I really need) so hopefully the condition of the car is good. Will report back after the test drive.

 

 

 

 

 

[skidpan]

1 hour ago, TheSledge said:

 

The car itself (a 65-reg with 21,000 miles up) was outstanding but I found the engine lacked the guts that suit my driving style. I've just offloaded a 140bhp Mondeo 2.0 Tdci and the 1.6 engine in the Superb seemed a little wheezy.

 

At least you have seen sense before spending your money.

 

We had a 130 PS TDCi Mondeo before the 110 PS 1.6 TDCi Focus. The Focus was obviously slower on the test drive but I convinced myself it would be fine since I rarely needed to use all the Mondeo's grunt, instead I could just rev it more, wrong, very wrong. We kept it for 5 years simply because although it lacked performance the car suited us perfectly and it did a decent 50 mpg instead of the Mondeo's poor 40 mpg.

 

We did look at changing it after 3 years but all the cars of the correct age (less than 6 months - preferably pre-reg like the Mondeo and Focus) were all 1.6 diesels or 1.8 petrols and all those we tried were just as underwhelming as the Focus with the exception of the Seat Altea TDi which was even worse (it did have nicer seats though).

 

Better to spend a bit more than spend the next 3 years regretting your purchase,

[RGKTSi]

I test drove a 1,6TDi Octavia mark 111, because it was there, no other reason.  I thought it was gutless if I am being brutally honest.  Father in law had a 1.6TDi Fabia mark 3 estate, it was a good engine in that but the Octavia estate needed allot of stirring with the stick.  maybe better with a DSG box!

 

I also tried a 1.4TSI 150, peach of an engine.  Without doubt the one I would go for.  Coming from a 170 Superb TDi i think if funds permit the 2,0TDi 150 is the way to go for you.  Hope the test drive is good for you tomorrow.

 

 

 

 

[TheSledge]

Test drive went well and have placed the order - I collect the car on Friday lunchtime. Whoop whoop! 

 

Only surprise was the absence of front parking sensors on the car - I'm guessing these were an option on the first SE L Executives.  

 

I just need to source a new front O/S fabric floor mat: the other three are there but the driver's side is missing and the (non-franchise) dealer has no idea what's happened to it. 

 

If anyone can point me in the right direction  (for a replacement not the original!) you'd make a (tight) old Yorkshireman very happy!!

[Sagalout]

http://www.superskoda.com/Skoda/SUPERB-III/Floor-mats-Carpets/