I sometimes read reviews of new cars in motoring magazines and there are a lot of new cars that get high marks coming from brands that are usually not considered as great as one could deduct from that.

For example, on Auto Express, I see a lot of Citroens and Peugeots getting 4 and 5 stars, and yet those brands are not highly regarded, and so you can read elsewhere criticisms at the lack of reliability and other things.

Why even bother to give high marks to a car like that, then? I understand that new cars are an unknown quantity, and they could turn out incredibly good, but how is it that not really good brands get so many high marks for cars that, in a few years, are going to be considered just as mediocre as the rest of their production?

New car reviews are I suppose based on price and design - the instant impression that the car gives. French cars are often very well/cleverly designed, but build quality issues and reliability can only be judged further down the line which is why things like the JDPower survey are useful.

Also lots of the motoring press now run long-term tests where the journo lives with the car for a year or so.

You can't mark a car down because you think it might break down in future

New car reviews are I suppose based on price and design - the instant impression that the car gives.

Comes down to the context in which it's reviewed...a new car is going to be judged on "new car merits", so things like design, innovation, immediate build quality, driveability, price, quality of complimentary buffet, etc.

Plus I don't think French build quality is especially bad compared to any other manufacturer these days - certainly people I know who own 406s of a comparable vintage to my Octavia don't report any more problems than I have...

Rob.

Well, you make a good point, but on the other side I see other reviews where they bring up reliability as a concern and as a cause for lower scores. Consider Alfa Romeo. Great looking, fast, and with a bad reputation. And it does come up in many reviews. Yet Alfa Romeo is a a bit better than the French brands, according for example to surveys by JD Power and Top Gear.

Or it can be because humans are humans and make mistakes, but it so often happens that "mistakes" like that involve Peugeot and Citroen and Mercedes that it makes me wonder.

Well, you make a good point, but on the other side I see other reviews where they bring up reliability as a concern and as a cause for lower scores. Consider Alfa Romeo. Great looking, fast, and with a bad reputation. And it does come up in many reviews. Yet Alfa Romeo is a a bit better than the French brands, according for example to surveys by JD Power and Top Gear.

But how does the "initial" build quality of the Alfas feel? If a new car delivered to the journalist rattles or feels poorly finished or falls apart during the test drive then this may be what's causing the poor reliability reviews.

JD Power, etc. take into account a number of factors, so the reliability of the Alfa may be worse than the French brands, but this may be balanced by the Alfa being a nicer car when it works or the dealers being better.

Plus it works both ways, how often do you read reviews saying things like "It's a VW so reliability shouldn't be an issue"...

Rob.

To use Alfa as an example - their unreliability is legendary (i.e. may well be a legend these days) however I doubt they'd be 'marked down' on reputation...however their depreciation is awful and a fact which might well earn them a lower score.

Plus people are quite likely to love their Alfa, despite its flaws, whereas perhaps a Pug might not ellicit the same emotions.

i honestly dont beleive there is a bad car manufacturer left now. the market is too competetative now for bad cars to exist.

i think the problems are now that so many cars are moving forward and breaking new barriers that sometimes its hard to fault the car until its been tested for a year. most of the citroens ive used and sold over the last few months have been excellent! full of inovation, comfort, fun and the usual french querkiness.

how would have thought that skoda would do as well as it has done all those eyars ago when skip jokes were everywhere? put that along side the fact that most cars are co-developed and therefore get twice the amount of attention that the old cars got. it think it is very hard to find fault in your average car these days. until that is youve owned it for a while.

look at clarkson, hes famous for slating cars, but recently hes always got something good to say about them too

I suspect that like most people, journo's have prejudices, preconceptions and expectations of a car they will be driving. If you've just stepped out of a Ferrari, it's going to be quite difficult to give a glowing review of a 12k car. On the other hand, if you've stepped out of a City Rover, pretty much any car you drive will get a glowing review.

You also have to remember that the review is only based on their time with the car which may be as short as a 15 minute stint. That's not a long time to give an accurate assessment of what the car is like to live with. Compare it to you taking a test drive of a car you're considering buying.

As with anything, personal experience counts for a lot and I tend to take most of the reviews with a pinch of salt as my (ownership) experience of cars can differ from theirs, and so their views are of no real use to me.

Chris

look at clarkson, hes famous for slating cars, but recently hes always got something good to say about them too

the problem with JC is that he is very biased towards Ford products

What exactly is up with Citroens? My advice would be buy one, however make sure you get a good deal and don't spend too much money. The French are great at making small affordable sylish motors the turbo diesels are particularly good.

I own a Citroen Dispatch (Van) which I use for work, It is basic but has 3 seats and 6 doors and it was cheap! Look at an old Transit and an old Dispatch side by side, see which has the most rust!!

Agreed , my cousin has driven Citroen vans for work for a good few years , all well into 6 figures , the only problem I can remember him telling me about is that one of the vans eat a turbo at about 130000 miles.

Just what is with all the co-development going on these days? There's all the usual GM/Ford style cross-pollination (Focus ST with Volvo engine, Saab is just a funky Vectra) but then there's stuff like the Jag with a Peogeot engine? Toyota, Citroen and Pug making the Aigo/C1/thing? I suppose VAG group is no different?

I own a Citroen Dispatch (Van) which I use for work, It is basic but has 3 seats and 6 doors and it was cheap! Look at an old Transit and an old Dispatch side by side, see which has the most rust!!

I join you in the dispair/boxer/scudo thing and have to say what a pile of.... The engine's crud, noisy, has no power and it's very uncomfortable. How I miss my Tranny Connect and Caddies from the last firm.....

And why the f*** is the handbrake next to the bloody door? Which moron thought of that?

The Mk2's are mean to be more like a Vito. Sadly I'll never get to drive one as I'm leaving the Tw*ts I moved to after only 2 months.

There's onl;y so much hostility, cold shoulder and "you'll not last" one can take before you become more depressed than the last firm - and that was the reason I left them for this shower of....!

I join you in the dispair/boxer/scudo thing and have to say what a pile of.... The engine's crud, noisy, has no power and it's very uncomfortable. How I miss my Tranny Connect and Caddies from the last firm.....

And why the f*** is the handbrake next to the bloody door? Which moron thought of that?

The Mk2's are mean to be more like a Vito. Sadly I'll never get to drive one as I'm leaving the Tw*ts I moved to after only 2 months.

There's onl;y so much hostility, cold shoulder and "you'll not last" one can take before you become more depressed than the last firm - and that was the reason I left them for this shower of....!

mmmm. It sounds like your issues run a little deeper than not being happy with your van. Have you seen your Psyciatrist lately?

mmmm. It sounds like your issues run a little deeper than not being happy with your van. Have you seen your Psyciatrist lately?

LOL, coupled with giving up smoking and moving house I must be clinically insane - well just about

*sticks pens up nose, starts rocking and talking teletubby*

That makes two of us then!