AP Coil overs, some findings.

[Tech1e]

I have been running my AP coil overs as provided by the lovely Sarah at Awesome for sometime now and thought I would give a small review if you like and add some note worthy findings that might help some others.

The APs are very much like Weitec and the like, middle of the range no frills dump your car on the floor kinda thing, not as good as some, no where near as bad as others. Fit was excellent, everything as it should be and the kit went together very well. The fronts use a more traditional type spring that is progressive, this gives a more compliant ride than the regular tubular spring (usually about 60mm i/d all the way up.

In this lies a problem. The spring itself is quite short, so if you plan to run low (lets face it who doesnt with coil overs) with the spring sat on its platform the top of the spring is someway off the top bearing. The bearing design on the Fabia means it needs to be under tension or it can come apart or at least get dirt in it and get noisy. Now of course the spring cant go anywhere and with the weight of the vehicle on the suspension it is compressed. However they were very noisy from the outset. It was clear that running low meant the spring and top mount moved about. At low speeds and manouvering it was quite annoying having what sounded like a gaggle of geese under the bonnet. So how normally is this avoided? Helper springs are usually used, they have very little to no spring rate and a floating collar that sits under the main spring, these take up the slack when the spring isnt under compression and keep things in place.

I ordered a pair of 30mm Eibach helper springs and the matching collars and fitted them allong all the standard parts from AP.

The result? Silence, magic is what they are just as the kit should be originally (might sugest this to AP) the ride even feels a little better at low speed, this might be my imagination though. Well worth getting these IMHO, small outlay (around £50) and still makes the kits cheaper than some.

Sits quite well

Close enough for me..lol

[Oet]

that looks awesome mate!

[Wardy]

Nice one Ross - a great bit of tweaking as ever

Steve

[green beard]

Have exactly the same problem with mine, so changed the top mounts and bearings, guess what? Still does it!

Where can the helper springs and collars be got from, any Eibach stockist?

Nice one btw

[Tech1e]

I would have thought so, I have a friend who got my mine,

[ninja_alex]

This is the same setup as the V Maxx ones have as standard. Helper springs on the front, it is necessary too as a loose spring is an MOT failure. Any Eibach reseller can supply the helper springs and collars. If anyone does need any, PM me and I will see what I can do. Can't promise anything though!

Alex

[niceyellow vrs]

I've just fitted a set of APs to my Octavia and they came with helper springs already. Is there a reason why they don't come with the one for Fabias then?

[green beard]

Apparently it is to do with the top mounts (this is what I was told when I rang to complain there was no helper spring as described) but I dont know exactly what the problem is? Wider diameter at top of spring/3 bolt mount? Cant recall exactly what I was told but was enough to pacify me

[jamjar]

Kit Contents:

4 x AP Coilover Units

Adjuster Spanner

Bump Stops

Helper Springs

Grease

2 year Warranty

sounds like they should have been included

[ultra_joel88]

if this is the case surely I can go to Awesome GTI and claim they are not fit for purpose, if dirt can get into the bearing!?

i am getting extremely ****ed off with mine now

they make like a rubbery scraping sound at low speed and at all they speeds the N/S clunks over any bump in the road

knew i should have got ****ing v-maxx

I also have a feeling that mine dont have those black rubber stops above the yellow thing?!

Edited 1 August, 2009 by ultra_joel88

[ultra_joel88]

can somebody point me to where i can get some of these springs and holders please

[ultra_joel88]

Ross - any chance of some part numbers for the springs and perches?

They all seem to be quoted in inches.

[Babs]

Kit Contents:

4 x AP Coilover Units

Adjuster Spanner

Bump Stops

Helper Springs

Grease

2 year Warranty

sounds like they should have been included

I noticed that as well...

[ultra_joel88]

no grease with mine either

[green beard]

Yeah I know it says helper springs included but you dont get any for Fabia, I rang up and complained to my supplier and was basically told they are fine and given AP's number if I wanted to take it any further, which I didn't cos was pacified enough and I got them less than £300 on the introductory offer too, but less noise would be good.

They are great tho, car is well stable at speed and can chuck it into corners too + lowering = big grins!

Edited 4 August, 2009 by VeeKar

[Babs]

I was considering these... but if they don't come with the helper spring (as described..) then I won't.

VeeKar - did you not raise the issue of the Sale of Goods act to your supplier?

[ultra_joel88]

Well after moving my drivers side one turn lower to match the passenger side, driving to work this morning it sounded absolutely awful.

As Lummox quite rightly says it sounds like "there is a gaggle of geese" in your wheel arch at speeds below 30mph and it gets worse the slower you go and the more lock you apply. (video will be posted later). Spraying a load of silicon grease directly at the top and seat of the spring seems to dampen the noise but it always returns.

I work within a local authoritys Trading Standards department and as far as I am concerned these items are starting to look as though they are not fit for purpose - Yes they lower the car but its quite obvious they are not doing the same job as the OEM items in that dirt and crap is getting into the MOVING top mount and bearing causing a stupid and worrying noise.

They are also listed as said above as including helper springs and grease neither were included -

http://www.awesome-gti.co.uk/product.php?xProd=10466&xSec=918

misleading advertising (not really Awesome GTI's fault, but APs as I belief they rigidly enforce pricing and advertising on retailers)

This is a huge shame as Awesome GTI are an excellent company and their service to me was very good. I bought these accepting they are a new product but because Awesome had put their name to them, and because I was assured KW were a parent company, I chose them above the "V-maxx" kits (which I was offered for £200).

It's also a shame because aside from the noise issues the dampers and springs seem to be of good quality and the ride quality, considering its a lowering kit, is nothing short of remarkable.

It's not so much the noise that ****es me off but the fact that I paid £100 to have them fitted on top of £324 for the kit and whether I fit the helper springs or try to return them and set it back to standard I have already wasted money.

Sorry to moan but this whole affair has really put me off my car and I doubt I would ever buy coilovers again the future.

Joel

Edited 5 August, 2009 by ultra_joel88

[Babs]

Well after moving my drivers side one turn lower to match the passenger side, driving to work this morning it sounded absolutely awful.

As Lummox quite rightly says it sounds like "there is a gaggle of geese" in your wheel arch at speeds below 30mph and it gets worse the slower you go and the more lock you apply. (video will be posted later). Spraying a load of silicon grease directly at the top and seat of the spring seems to dampen the noise but it always returns.

I work within a local authoritys Trading Standards department and as far as I am concerned these items are starting to look as though they are not fit for purpose - Yes they lower the car but its quite obvious they are not doing the same job as the OEM items in that dirt and crap is getting into the MOVING top mount and bearing causing a stupid and worrying noise.

They are also listed as said above as including helper springs and grease neither were included -

Awesome > Fabia (6Y) Hatch, Estate Inc. VRS 3/00-

misleading advertising (not really Awesome GTI's fault, but APs as I belief they rigidly enforce pricing and advertising on retailers)

This is a huge shame as Awesome GTI are an excellent company and their service to me was very good. I bought these accepting they are a new product but because Awesome had put their name to them, and because I was assured KW were a parent company, I chose them above the "V-maxx" kits (which I was offered for £200).

It's also a shame because aside from the noise issues the dampers and springs seem to be of good quality and the ride quality, considering its a lowering kit, is nothing short of remarkable.

It's not so much the noise that ****es me off but the fact that I paid £100 to have them fitted on top of £324 for the kit and whether I fit the helper springs or try to return them and set it back to standard I have already wasted money.

Sorry to moan but this whole affair has really put me off my car and I doubt I would ever buy coilovers again the future.

Joel

Strictly speaking, the your problem is with the retailer... they have sold them to you... Awesome then have to speak to their supplier and so-on in this fashion until the manufacturer is reached.

If they have no helper springs, then get back to Awesome as they are not as described and certainly sound not fit for purpose, both under the Sale of Goods act.

[Babs]

Another supplier which also states the helper springs are included: Venom Motorsport Performance Car Parts - EBC Brakes, Black Diamond Brakes, FK Suspension, Eibach Suspension, Weitec Suspension, Supersport Suspension

[ultra_joel88]

And another

Select your vehicle, to buy AP coilover suspension - High quality, budget price suspension, coilovers and springs

[ninja_alex]

Been looking into this for you guys. Eibach indeed make helper springs and collars. They also make what is called atender spring, which is inbetween a helper spring and a min spring. Both the helper and tender springs come in differnt lengths and spring rates. In order to get some prices and availablilty, can someone tell me what spring diameters are required. On my V-Maxx ones they are 2.25" but need to check the AP ones as they come in 1.9", 2", 2.25" and 2.5"

There are other companies out there that do these, another good brand is Faulkner. They are a fiar bit cheaper than Eibach too. Let me know what is required and I will look into these for you. Faulkner make these in 4, 40, 60, 80, 100, 150, 200 etc lb spring rates. I would recommend one of the smaller rates. I think 4lb is too low, therefore an educated guess would be something in the range of 40-100lb depending on what you require. These will greatly imporve ride and should then compress right up and allow the main spring to do its job when being slung round a corner

Hope this helps

Alex

[Babs]

Cheers, Alex!

I think the main point is that they should have the helper springs already!

[ninja_alex]

Cheers, Alex!

I think the main point is that they should have the helper springs already!

I understand that but they don't! Should have bought V-Maxx!

Alex

[ultra_joel88]

Here is a link to a video I took.

You can only hear the noise from about 1.20 left so go from there.

At this point I was driving around an uneven car park at 5-10mph.

Listen for the rubbery sounds that sound like a farting goose, 0.40

Bear in mind this is from INSIDE the car with no windows open!

Hope you enjoy the commentary.

VID00003-20090805-0846.flv video by frenchboy88 - Photobucket

[ultra_joel88]

Hi there ross any chance of updating us with what size springs and poundage we need as I'd like to do this asap. Joel