Since been caught (top end of the 90's ) and given 3 points and fined £60 I must admit I have slowed down. I travel to north wales quite often from Harrogate and use the M62/M6/M56/A55 and used to tram it all the way and it took me roughly 2 hours and 10 minute's...ish. I now drive the same route at 70/80 mph and it takes me 2 hours and twenty minutes...ish and I'm less stressed. For the sake of 10/15/ minutes and more mph " Is it worth tramming about getting stressed "

p.s over 96mph you are summond to court so likely ban.

Not always, I pleaded guilty on the spot, 3 points and £60 for me. I have since slowed down

A lot depends on your attitude when caught, saying things like

" Are you qualified to use that speed gun and has it been calibrated today " ain't going to get anywhere

Since been caught (top end of the 90's ) and given 3 points and fined £60 I must admit I have slowed down. I travel to north wales quite often from Harrogate and use the M62/M6/M56/A55 and used to tram it all the way and it took me roughly 2 hours and 10 minute's...ish. I now drive the same route at 70/80 mph and it takes me 2 hours and twenty minutes...ish and I'm less stressed. For the sake of 10/15/ minutes and more mph " Is it worth tramming about getting stressed "

Try not driving in the inside lane on the uphill stretches then! (subject to usual notes about not getting in the way of other traffic)

Try not driving in the inside lane on the uphill stretches then! (subject to usual notes about not getting in the way of other traffic)

Well spotted Ken, didn't mean the " Tram Lines ". I's worse when they fill up with water....

Well spotted Ken, didn't mean the " Tram Lines ". I's worse when they fill up with water....

Seriously; I'd never heard "tramming it" as a synonym for "driving at high straight line speed" before. OTOH I certainly have heard "tramlining" as a synonym for getting stuck going straight on when you want to turn" (worse than understeer because it means "going straight on", not just "not turning as much as you meant")

Seriously; I'd never heard "tramming it" as a synonym for "driving at high straight line speed" before. OTOH I certainly have heard "tramlining" as a synonym for getting stuck going straight on when you want to turn" (worse than understeer because it means "going straight on", not just "not turning as much as you meant")

Must be a " Yorkshire " thing. No doubt someone will be along shortly to prove me wrong

Is it worth tramming about getting stressed "

I guess that's a very subjective question, although I wonder if the stress is directly related to the tramming or to the heightened level of concentration demanded?

As an example, I've driven with people who have believed that going slower (eg 56mph) on a motorway is safer as it's less stressful. Looking at their driving, it becomes apparent that the reason it's less stressful for them is that they signifcantly reduce their concentration levels which can in turn result in a less safe drive. I'm not sure driving fast is intrisically stressful, although it will depend on the environment and interactions with other people in it. Also, chances are the endorphines will be flowing too which may cloud judgement....

Of course, there is much debate about whether we should drive at maximum concentration at all times and indeed whether it is unsafe to not be at maximum at all times, but that's probably a discussion for another thread

Chris

I guess that's a very subjective question, although I wonder if the stress is directly related to the tramming or to the heightened level of concentration demanded?

As an example, I've driven with people who have believed that going slower (eg 56mph) on a motorway is safer as it's less stressful. Looking at their driving, it becomes apparent that the reason it's less stressful for them is that they signifcantly reduce their concentration levels which can in turn result in a less safe drive. I'm not sure driving fast is intrisically stressful, although it will depend on the environment and interactions with other people in it. Also, chances are the endorphines will be flowing too which may cloud judgement....

Of course, there is much debate about whether we should drive at maximum concentration at all times and indeed whether it is unsafe to not be at maximum at all times, but that's probably a discussion for another thread

Chris

Certainly that's why my motorway cruise is 70[cough] mph; it's fast enough to make progress and keep my concentration high, but not so fast as to make me stressed (justification being that I don't regularly do drives like London or Weymouth to Dumbarton, but I've done both at these sorts of speeds and felt fresh enough to go out with friends about an hour (and a quick shower) after arriving.

I guess that's a very subjective question, although I wonder if the stress is directly related to the tramming or to the heightened level of concentration demanded?

As an example, I've driven with people who have believed that going slower (eg 56mph) on a motorway is safer as it's less stressful. Looking at their driving, it becomes apparent that the reason it's less stressful for them is that they signifcantly reduce their concentration levels which can in turn result in a less safe drive. I'm not sure driving fast is intrisically stressful, although it will depend on the environment and interactions with other people in it. Also, chances are the endorphines will be flowing too which may cloud judgement....

Of course, there is much debate about whether we should drive at maximum concentration at all times and indeed whether it is unsafe to not be at maximum at all times, but that's probably a discussion for another thread

Chris

Good points there Chris

I think the problem with me was that when I was tramming along in the outside lane i " HAD " to over take the car in front and If I couldn't I used to get stressed out, I had to be by, the car in front could have pulled over to let me past as there was no car directly in front of them but they would just sit there.

I have now decided to let things be and just tootle along at a comfortable speed, don't get me wrong I still stretch the Vrs's legs now and again to clear the soot out.

ScoobyChris, Thank you, everything you've said is perfectly valid. Please read my last post (just above yours).

Sorry - didn't see this post yesterday. What I said was meant to be more thought provoking than saying "you're stupid" If you're ever over Hants/Wilts way, give me a shout and we can arrange a drive if you like

Chris

I think the problem with me was that when I was tramming along in the outside lane i " HAD " to over take the car in front and If I couldn't I used to get stressed out, I had to be by, the car in front could have pulled over to let me past as there was no car directly in front of them but they would just sit there.

Interactions with other drivers is always an interesting area and it's very easy for things to turn nasty if you get a bad reaction, for example people generally don't seem to like being overtaken. Some of the time it's down to the other driver not even knowing you're behind them so a few quick flashes of the main beam can wake them up (and you can thank them as they pull over). Other times it may be that there is traffic some way further down the road in a left hand lane and they are holding position because of this - in these cases I may consider using a left lane to overtake them, although this is usually a last resort and I have to be happy they're steady enough not to change speed or position. Sometimes nothing works and you just have to wait and be patient - the opportunity will arrive eventually

Chris

Sorry - didn't see this post yesterday. What I said was meant to be more thought provoking than saying "you're stupid" If you're ever over Hants/Wilts way, give me a shout and we can arrange a drive if you like

Chris

Thank you Chris, I understood the post and did not see it as offensive, however I must admit that my actions were. I just might take you up on that drive offer some time. What's the town?

Interactions with other drivers is always an interesting area and it's very easy for things to turn nasty if you get a bad reaction, for example people generally don't seem to like being overtaken. Some of the time it's down to the other driver not even knowing you're behind them so a few quick flashes of the main beam can wake them up (and you can thank them as they pull over). Other times it may be that there is traffic some way further down the road in a left hand lane and they are holding position because of this - in these cases I may consider using a left lane to overtake them, although this is usually a last resort and I have to be happy they're steady enough not to change speed or position. Sometimes nothing works and you just have to wait and be patient - the opportunity will arrive eventually

Chris

I think you're giving the MLOCer way too much credit with "Other times...or position". IME they're usually taking the RH side of a split 2 miles down the road (or if actually MiddleLOC) I can overtake them, return to the LH lane, and eventually overtake a truck about a mile after I overtook them!

Only time I've found myself doing this is in 50mph roadworks where lane 1 is chugging along at 40ish. Saying that, I've yet to see an HGV driver who has slowed down to 50mph through roadworks so maybe they should be allowed to use lane 3 in this instance

Chris

My commute currently has a 50 mph limit on parts of the motorway, and as you say, many of the trucks just drive against the limiter, which seems a bit touch and go to me. Do they know something we don't?

In answer to the original question, I'll generally drive at [cough] mph if the conditions are good and traffic not too heavy, I'm a stickler for returning to L1 as I hate lane hoggers, but sometimes if traffic is very heavy I'll join the trucks in L1 on cruise.

I'd agree fast driving isn't neccesarily stressful- but *rushed* driving is, and yes. motorway driving is all about observation and planning- I must say though, I don't know how you guys using cruise in congestion do it- on an average commute I'll hardly brake, but it takes a lot of anticipation and backing off the throttle early to avoid closing on the people around you that are pulling in and out randomly- not helped by several advisory 50 limits that some drivers see as a mandatory thing (I think they're set for pouring rain on crossplies!).

As to undertaking- yep. I'll do it, but carefully. As far as I'm concerned, if it is possible to overtake someone, they are in the wrong lane. problem is it takes a lot of care, as most lane hoggers have poor observation...

On my drive or ride to work i leave plenty of time to get there, no rush.

But the ride home is a different matter, I like to make good progress but

with road works and 50 mph average speed cameras, i just have to look ahead

and see what the idiots are up to.

I can sit there at 50, and have idiots trying to take up residence in my boot but I

let them get on with it....

Then I have to contend with idiots driving at 30 in a 40, one of my pet hates :(

But we all get home eventually, and can chill out

I'd like to see any driver that uses the outer lanes (2 &3) when the inner lanes (1 or 2) are free , prosecuted ( regardless of speed). "Middle laners" reduce a 3 lane motorway to a 2 lane motorway and 3rd lane "hogs" cause traffic queues for no good reason . We drive on the left in this country ! Unless overtaking drive on the left ! When driving in Germany it's a revelation to see good lane discipline and how well the traffic flows. I'd also like to see drivers who travel too close to the vehicle in front prosecuted for dangerous driving. We need more sophisicated cameras / sensors to police these aspects of !motorway driving . Imagine the difference in traffic flow and safety !

Sorry for the rant I feel much better now .

Edited 10 February, 201016 yr by vwcabriolet1971

Thank you Chris, I understood the post and did not see it as offensive, however I must admit that my actions were. I just might take you up on that drive offer some time. What's the town?

I'm based around Andover in Hampshire and I have plenty of interesting routes as I'm sure others will testify

Chris

Technically speaking (advanced driver coming out now!) you are meant to be in lane 1 unless you are overtaking. So if you over take two vehicles in lanes 1 and 2 using lane 3, then you are meant to return to lane 1.

You'll notice though, that depending how old that particular bit of tarmac is, then you'll get in the "tramlines" which are worn ruts where HGVs have sunk the road surface. As HGV's tend to be wider than us, you will feel "wander" as your front wheels are pulled left and right in these ruts.

There would be no officer (except some that we all know who leave their personalitly at home!) who would have any issue with you being in lane 2 on a quiet motorway and moving to lane 1 if some one approaches at a higher speed to allow them past. It's all about common sense and forward thinking. If more of us had that, the road system would be so much more efficient.

The way people exit also irritates me!! " Ooh, look, our junction is a mile and a bit away... let's get into lane 1 NOW, even if this requires me slowing to 55 in lane 2 to slot in behind a lorry!!"

There are (and I may be repeating what you all know here) standard signing for motorway junctions, A mile marker, half mile and exit board. The best and most efficient way on an averagely busy motorway is to keep your cruising speed up, get to lane 3 and look for gaps in lane 1 and 2. You'll see the exit board which is at the start of the slip-road. Pick 2 or maybe 3 gaps, (plan A, B and maybe C). Adjust your speed to get gradually in one of those gaps without causing any one else to alter their driving at all, and either accelerate to them or drift off a bit. Then re-check your gaps again, and move. there is nothing wrong and, infact the best exit is lane 3,2,1, slip- in one go. Obviously this needs to be reasonably quiet to maintain gaps.

Miracle!! You've got off, keeping at your cruising speed until the last moment. Try it and count how many vehicles you pass in that mile who are sat in lane one at 60 or less.

(PS, sorry for the rant!!)

Technically speaking (advanced driver coming out now!) you are meant to be in lane 1 unless you are overtaking. So if you over take two vehicles in lanes 1 and 2 using lane 3, then you are meant to return to lane 1.

Exactly. So use lane 1. I've had enough of you IAM-types making up excuses for bad driving. And I've heard this particular one many, many times.

The way people exit also irritates me!! " Ooh, look, our junction is a mile and a bit away... let's get into lane 1 NOW, even if this requires me slowing to 55 in lane 2 to slot in behind a lorry!!"

There are (and I may be repeating what you all know here) standard signing for motorway junctions, A mile marker, half mile and exit board. The best and most efficient way on an averagely busy motorway is to keep your cruising speed up, get to lane 3 and look for gaps in lane 1 and 2. You'll see the exit board which is at the start of the slip-road. Pick 2 or maybe 3 gaps, (plan A, B and maybe C). Adjust your speed to get gradually in one of those gaps without causing any one else to alter their driving at all, and either accelerate to them or drift off a bit. Then re-check your gaps again, and move. there is nothing wrong and, infact the best exit is lane 3,2,1, slip- in one go. Obviously this needs to be reasonably quiet to maintain gaps.

Miracle!! You've got off, keeping at your cruising speed until the last moment. Try it and count how many vehicles you pass in that mile who are sat in lane one at 60 or less.

(PS, sorry for the rant!!)

So, you're saying wait till the last minute and do a dive across 3 lanes, rather than get in the correct lane in good time? Brilliant IAM advice there

Exactly. So use lane 1. I've had enough of you IAM-types making up excuses for bad driving. And I've heard this particular one many, many times.

So, you're saying wait till the last minute and do a dive across 3 lanes, rather than get in the correct lane in good time? Brilliant IAM advice there

I aren't IAM, far from it, and I agree with you that some people hide behind that badge. Some of course, are very good. My qualifications come from elswhere.

You've obviously misinterpreted the speed and smoothness that will be used to execute such a manouver. It isn't a snatch at the wheel, but a gentle change in the driving angle to float, unobtrusivley across the motorway, causing no one to change their course at all. Ideally, driving at an advanced level, no one should even notice what you're doing. Doing it properly you will maintain everyone's gap between vehicles and eliminate braking at the 100yard marker to force your way in.

Trust me, the secret of advanced driving is smoothness, balance and observation. Combine these, think about how I explained it and you'll see what I meant.

Exactly. So use lane 1. I've had enough of you IAM-types making up excuses for bad driving. And I've heard this particular one many, many times.

So, you're saying wait till the last minute and do a dive across 3 lanes, rather than get in the correct lane in good time? Brilliant IAM advice there

Strongly seconded, and I did NOT mean to delete either of the quoted paragraphs.

In particular, in para (2), I've seen way too many cases where attempting to follow that advice would leave you with insufficient emergency reaction time, and steal that of the driver behind you as well!

I didn't realise standard procedure here was to read a posting and then make up your own version!!!

I never mantioned the word DIVE. I said move. Please try and understand the difference.

I also said Advanced Driving, not IAM driving. Two totally different methods.

You mentioned the phrase "good time". That is what advanced driving is about. Doing things in good time.

Sighting the mile marker board and arriving at the slip in most circumstances gives you a minute to a minute-and-a-half to make your decisions. When driving otherwise than on a motorway, give me an example of when you get 90 seconds to make a manouevering desicion? Exactly, you don't, so it is in good time. More time infact than you give to pulling out of a junction, changing lanes on a roundabout etc etc.

Don't jump down my neck when you haven't read my post properly please. Driving is about getting yourself equipped with as many different skills as possible, then using the right one at the right time.

This technique isn't appropriate all the time, maybe only 1 in three; but going out to lane 3 and having a look doesn't hurt. I've come to Briskoda to learn things too, that was the only point to my post.

Thanks.

If you're not IAM, then you must be filth then?

Is it not safer to take each lane as a separate manoeuvre to move between them, than to move straight across?

If you're not IAM, then you must be filth then?

Is it not safer to take each lane as a separate manoeuvre to move between them, than to move straight across?

Like I said mate, each scenario needs to be taken differently. If it's slightly busier, then pick your lane 2 gap, move, then look for one in lane 1. But if you can look far enough ahead, try and pick one that will dealt with both. I see your point though, for example on the M62, M1 junction area at teatime, it's not gonna work, nor should it even be attempted, but the same motorway, over Scammonden way, at 9pm at night, or 1300, then it's propbably on.

It wasn't meant ot be a "right, here's how to exit a motorway regardless if situation" post!

By the way, it's a good job I'm difficult to offend!!!!!

But if it's quiet enough to do this manoeuvre, then surely there's no need to be lane 3?