Hello Boys and Girls, Long time no see but work has been manic as has home life. Anyway I think the DMF maybe on its way out in my 2.0TDI Octy and wondered if anyone could give a breakdown of the expected symptoms of a DMF failure? Thanks

Come kick me at work and i'll go through it with you.

I've been through 6 so am very familiar with it now :(

Cheers Mark,

I'll do that

Whats the symptoms for the rest of us ? as mine has a flat spot in first gear ! cheers - Stuart.

You'll be hearing alot of clattering at idle, and I'd imagine a juddering feeling whilst using the clutch.

Edited 26 November, 200916 yr by Browny_37

Most obvious ones are a rough/noisy idle, gear changes become a bit jumpy like you've lost your ability to do clutch control, but only slightly.

Phew I have none of that, just a flat spot in first gear when setting off. cheers - Stuart.

Most obvious ones are a rough/noisy idle, gear changes become a bit jumpy like you've lost your ability to do clutch control, but only slightly.

Sounds about right :(

Most obvious ones are a rough/noisy idle, gear changes become a bit jumpy like you've lost your ability to do clutch control, but only slightly.

In a DSG??? !!!!!! My clutch control is amazing. My left leg doesn't move......

Mine was juddering and unbalanced with poor gearchange like it wanted to jump out of gear.Also if i tried to pull away in 2nd at low speed it felt like the clutch was going to explode.Got worse with more people in the car.

Torque kills a DMF, so setting off in 2nd gear isn't going to do any favours im afraid. Particulaly if you've got alot of weight in on a worn DMF.

Allowing a engine to rev a little, is way better that letting it labour. Which is what would be happening to the DMF by using too high of a gear at too low of a speed. They are a wear and tear item, and will eventually "go sloppy" and mileage will depend widely on your style of driving. My car is a ex rep mobile, and it managed 108k on the original, where id expect a taxi with a dmf would last less than that. I'm not entirely sure on mileage, but most taxi's have a single mass flywheel now.

Torque kills a DMF, so setting off in 2nd gear isn't going to do any favours im afraid. Particulaly if you've got alot of weight in on a worn DMF.

Allowing a engine to rev a little, is way better that letting it labour. Which is what would be happening to the DMF by using too high of a gear at too low of a speed. They are a wear and tear item, and will eventually "go sloppy" and mileage will depend widely on your style of driving. My car is a ex rep mobile, and it managed 108k on the original, where id expect a taxi with a dmf would last less than that. I'm not entirely sure on mileage, but most taxi's have a single mass flywheel now.

I disagree, they shouldn't be a wear and time item as a flywheel should last the age of the vehicle. A SMF lasts for that time period so why shouldn't a DMF (if it was designed correctly). You wouldn't expect to replace a gearbox at 50k as it is a wear and tear item.

I disagree, they shouldn't be a wear and time item as a flywheel should last the age of the vehicle. A SMF lasts for that time period so why shouldn't a DMF (if it was designed correctly). You wouldn't expect to replace a gearbox at 50k as it is a wear and tear item.

SMF is a big lump of metal and if damage occurs it can be resurfaced or replaced cheaply.

A DMF is a complicated arrangement of two lumps of metal, geared rings, springs and dampers. The wear components are also in the direction of force applied to it.

IMHO they are a stupid invention and external damping would have done the trick just as well and could have been replaced with the clutch.

I have to say that I almost get the impression that the DMF was a way for clutch manufacturers to make more money on a car by introducing another complex part, with a lifetime.

SMF is a big lump of metal and if damage occurs it can be resurfaced or replaced cheaply.

A DMF is a complicated arrangement of two lumps of metal, geared rings, springs and dampers. The wear components are also in the direction of force applied to it.

IMHO they are a stupid invention and external damping would have done the trick just as well and could have been replaced with the clutch.

I have to say that I almost get the impression that the DMF was a way for clutch manufacturers to make more money on a car by introducing another complex part, with a lifetime.

True; but if it was designed properly then it should last the same time as the life of the vehicle. If it was a wear and tear item then Skoda (and the other car makers) wouldn't be replacing them as much as they seem to be! Now the fun of getting it through RAC warranty

SMF is a big lump of metal and if damage occurs it can be resurfaced or replaced cheaply.

A DMF is a complicated arrangement of two lumps of metal, geared rings, springs and dampers. The wear components are also in the direction of force applied to it.

IMHO they are a stupid invention and external damping would have done the trick just as well and could have been replaced with the clutch.

I have to say that I almost get the impression that the DMF was a way for clutch manufacturers to make more money on a car by introducing another complex part, with a lifetime.

Yep spot on there Cheezemonkhai.My SMF conversion is what should have been from the start.A perfect drive under all conditions.

I agree with Cheezemonkhai, with the forces these clutches are exerted to and the sort of driving styles where people leave them in higher gears at low speeds and end up doing more damage than good.

I'm affraid i'll have to disagree Nathanio, a SMF would have to be replaced eventually anyway. Granted they will last alot longer than a DMF, but the build of each component differs substantialy.

Metals fatigue over time, i'd imagine most springs over time would start to deteriorate. Especially if there moving something as heavy as a car.

For example i had a 1.3 Mk2 Astra Belmont, and the only reason i replaced the clutch on that was down to the fact i was getting a bouncing feeling setting off and a clunking as i engaged the clutch. Which turned out to be the springs on the friction plate.

A new 2 piece clutch and i was away again.

I'm sure that if better materials were used, then they would last longer.....but dont you think a DMF is expensive enough already?

Maybe they could use larger components, but i would imagine that the designers are at a push to keep the size of components down. As for the gearbox, mine was reconditioned at 117k The dmf was replaced by the previous owner at 108k.

Then I guess we're gonna have to agree to disagree. I think the part if engineered properly should last the length of the vehicle.The clutch is slightly different as are things such as spark plugs but a flywheel (particularly solid piece such as an SMF) should last.

It is down to the way we buy things these days; everything is a throw away item from white goods to cars. Nothing is built to last these days

Agree there nothing does last these days,very sad considering the old days where everything could be made to work again at so little cost.A DMF is a complex piece of junk which fails very quick and should never have been fitted to these cars as some drivers(not saying all) do abuse the clutch therefore premature DMF failure where as a SMF can take this kind of "Abuse" so to speak and last for a long period of time and as Cheezemonkhai said they can be refaced and fit for use again.

Then I guess we're gonna have to agree to disagree. I think the part if engineered properly should last the length of the vehicle.The clutch is slightly different as are things such as spark plugs but a flywheel (particularly solid piece such as an SMF) should last.

It is down to the way we buy things these days; everything is a throw away item from white goods to cars. Nothing is built to last these days

I have to agree having had a fair few dervs in the family all with over 150k and a couple with over 250k on them and none ever needed a new flywheel.

Bring on the cars with the DMF and they have all needed at least one before 80k miles. Doesn't sound good for the things.

Sure clutch and clutch springs wear, but I've never replaced an SMF.

Even if you damaged the SMF with oil and wear, you can resurface it and should something happen that did require replacement (entirely possible) the it's a big heavy piece of metal which is a lot cheaper than the £700 a DMF cost last i looked.

I didn't mention how long though lol EDIT: I've just realised the emoctions still dont work lol!

I didn't mention how long though lol EDIT: I've just realised the emoctions still dont work lol!

Indeed you didn't but zero or one replacement in the life of the car is a lot better than for a DMF on current form.

Agree'd I could understand people becoming concerned if they're suffering with multiple DMF failures. Mainly if there not under any warrenty (if they would fix? Or class as wear and tear i dont know), although its an inconvienience i wouldn't mind waiting a couple of days for it to be fixed.

Now if i was to suffer a DMF failure, i think I would be thinking of switching to a SMF for piece of mind.

Now if i was to suffer a DMF failure, i think I would be thinking of switching to a SMF for piece of mind.

And they're cheaper.

And they're cheaper.

Quite true Sir! Albeit a little noiser at idle, but i think i could cope with this considering the amounts of rattles my interior seems to make.

Agree'd I could understand people becoming concerned if they're suffering with multiple DMF failures. Mainly if there not under any warrenty (if they would fix? Or class as wear and tear i dont know), although its an inconvienience i wouldn't mind waiting a couple of days for it to be fixed.

Now if i was to suffer a DMF failure, i think I would be thinking of switching to a SMF for piece of mind.

Skoda replace DMFs under warranty. I haven't heard of a case on here on SCN where a claim has been rejected for a DMF by the car maker