Deteriorating drive in 1.8tsi

[helix]

Hi

I'd welcome any advice you might be ableto give.

My 1.8tsi dsg has done about 19K. I've started to notice some subtle but unwelcome changes in the quality of the car's drive and can be summed up as less progressive acceleration in gear and a jerkier DSG. At the moment they're probably only really noticeable to the car's regular driver (me) so would value some ideas before I take it in for investigation.

In summary, the changes are:

1. loss of ‘momentum’ felt almost as soon as pressure is taken off accelerator(almost as if slight braking applied)

2. harder to get smooth starts from standing and amount of throttle needed is harder to predict accurately at low speed

3. sometimes no response to small pressure, and then an increase in throttle can lead to sudden down changes in dsg (as if in kickdown) instead of previous progressive in gear acceleration and imperceptible up-changing as previous

4. going up incline at urban speeds can cause sudden down changes

5. dsg changes more frequent and noticeable especially 1st – 4th

6. slightly noisier gearbox at low speeds

7. braking also seems less progressive; most braking seems to occur in top couple of cm of pedal movement

It may be worth mentioning I've also experienced loss of grip/juddering scrambling for grip from rear wheels but have attributed this to the cold weather and I realise it may be unrelated.

I haven't particularly changed my driving style by the way.

As i say, these are fairly subtle changes from the car's previous characteristics, and I fear a driver testing it would feel things might be within normal parameters, so any thoughts on possible causes would be much appreciated.

Thanks very much

[Evening Star]

Get it checked out by someone with VCDS or at your dealer, they could be symptoms of something more serious & more expensive,

[Mute]

Because it's not developed enough to give a clear indication of what the problem is, as Evening Star says, a VCDS scan might be worthwhile in case it has more info.

There's an outside chance it could be engine related - engine somehow not producing enough torque at lower revs, but with that description it's more likely to be drive train i'd think, although im no expert. Plus you'd expect some other symptoms if it was engine - e.g. erratic idle.

Could be the DMF at fault for some of those faults, but that doesn't match up to all of them.

Doubt it would be the clutches.

Mechatronic unit would be where i'd put my money, early stages of failure.

The gearbox itself is likely to be ok, you've not described any roadspeed related whining or graunching noises.

Same for the differential.

It could be any of these, could be something else entirely i guess, but out of those candidates, plus given the experiences of other owners on here, i'd be leaning towards mechatronic failure. Look that up on this site and compare symptoms with yours.

Hope you get it fixed with minimal stress.

[helix]

Thanks for your helpful replies. I'll get it invesigated by the dealer. It's in warranty so given the posts I've now read about the mechatronic unit (if that's the problem) I'd be sensible to act sooner rather than later!

Thanks again

[mdk1]

Is it due a service? Some fresh fliuds, might help.

[EGC]

Erratic changes points and rough changes are invariably due to problems with the MU. We see quite a number of these as the age/mileage builds up. 19k is quite early for MU problems, but hardly unheard of. Low speed judder on take-off is usually down to problems with the clutch packs.

Probles with the DSG should not affect the brake pedal feel, not the grip at the rear. These are likely to be unrelated problems (if they are real problems).

[mannyo]

could be the mechatronic, but it could also be an issue totally unrelated to the DSG. The symptoms are also similar to what you would get on any auto if the brakes are binding, the sudden slowdown, the unexpected gear changes and the need for more power than usual are all typical of this. Your issue with the brake pedal also suggests something is up with the brakes rather than the DSG.

[Mute]

I like Mannys suggestion, I'm taking my bet off the mechatronic and I'm sticking it on brakes :-)

[countryboy]

Have you noticed the fuel consumption rising? That will be another indication of binding brakes. If you are feeling brave, then after a run where you haven't used the brakes much, feel the individual discs to see if one is a lot hotter than the others.

Ian

[EGC]

I like Mannys suggestion, I'm taking my bet off the mechatronic and I'm sticking it on brakes :-)

If the brakes were binding enough to cause the problems that described then the smell of brake linings would be very noticable after a few miles, and there would be smoke from the brakes on longer runs.

We see quite a few sticking rear brakes on Otavia II, usually one side only sticks. Golf V etc and after a few miles there is a very strong smell and the wheel almost too hot to touch. It could be that engine power is down for some reason. We had a DSG Audi with similar symptoms and that turned out to be a problem with exhaust blockage. Vast majority of problems we see with rough shifts and wrong shifts on DSGs are down to the MU though.

Obviously there is no substitute for actually seeing the car since a lot of owners misdescribe symptoms or dont tell you vital information.

[helix]

Thanks again

A couple of useful lines of enquiry, perhaps for the dealer as well as me. I'm aware these are subtle rather than dramatic changes (at least at the moment) and I might be noticing some things I hadn't noticed before, just because I'm now consciously on the look out, but I think it's helpful to see more rather than less if it helps a diagnosis. At the moment it's more that I'm aware of the change, rather than that things are really bad, but I feel the changes must be evidence of something. I didn't mention that the car has recently had it's first variable service (essentially an oil change) but the changes didn't start straight after so haven't attached much significance to this, and the perceived slight loss of momentum and scrambling/juddering on take off from the rear wheels pre-dates this.

I'm grateful for the advice and suggestions.

[EGC]

Thanks again

A couple of useful lines of enquiry, perhaps for the dealer as well as me. I'm aware these are subtle rather than dramatic changes (at least at the moment) and I might be noticing some things I hadn't noticed before, just because I'm now consciously on the look out, but I think it's helpful to see more rather than less if it helps a diagnosis. At the moment it's more that I'm aware of the change, rather than that things are really bad, but I feel the changes must be evidence of something. I didn't mention that the car has recently had it's first variable service (essentially an oil change) but the changes didn't start straight after so haven't attached much significance to this, and the perceived slight loss of momentum and scrambling/juddering on take off from the rear wheels pre-dates this.

I'm grateful for the advice and suggestions.

This car is FWD, so if you are sure rear wheels are scrabbling on pull-off then it could be a sticking rear brake. Put you hand (gently) on the centre of each rear wheel after a run and see if they feel hot. Should be no hotter than front ones. If it is a sticking rear brake doing this then one wheel will be very hot since it must be well sticky.

[themacster]

This car is FWD, so if you are sure rear wheels are scrabbling on pull-off then it could be a sticking rear brake. Put you hand (gently) on the centre of each rear wheel after a run and see if they feel hot. Should be no hotter than front ones. If it is a sticking rear brake doing this then one wheel will be very hot since it must be well sticky.

If you've got a sticking brake on just one side, you would probably also feel the car pulling towards this side.

[EGC]

If you've got a sticking brake on just one side, you would probably also feel the car pulling towards this side.

We routinely get VAG cars in with sticking rear calipers. Its common on Golfs and Polos. Normally there is no pulling noticed. Owners invariably bring the car in because they've noticed a burning smell when getting out of the car at the end of a trip.

[macsacel]

I've got a 4x4 Octavia and having problems with rear brakes heating up. Drivers side seems to be worse, sometimes both are heating up. Had new caliper and hose fitted, no change. Garage disconnected handbrake, no change. It seems to be a mystery.

Anyone have any suggestions?

[EGC]

I've got a 4x4 Octavia and having problems with rear brakes heating up. Drivers side seems to be worse, sometimes both are heating up. Had new caliper and hose fitted, no change. Garage disconnected handbrake, no change. It seems to be a mystery.

Anyone have any suggestions?

I have been servicing/repairing VAG cars for many years. Sticking rear brake calipers are unfortunately a common problem and often difficult to cure. Generally they free up after a while with regular use, although the small calipers on the Polo/Fabia etc can go very sticky and need replacement.

Note that the handbrake MUST be correctly adjusted (lever NOT on the stops, but just clear of it by the specified amount on both sides) - even VAG dealers get this wrong and the result is an 'overadjusted' handbrake that binds a bit.

Strip the pads out of the calipers and thoroughly clean the slides, make sure the pads float free.

Then put the rear wheels on a rolling road (MoT test station) and check for significant drag. Most times there will be enough drag to heat the discs slightly, but not enough to cause any real problem or show up on the RR.

[Mute]

Note that the handbrake MUST be correctly adjusted (lever NOT on the stops, but just clear of it by the specified amount on both sides)

EGC, you know when you're adjusting the handbrake as you describe above, just clear of the stops, is there any adjustment possible at the caliper end of the handbrake cable? My wee golf needed the handbrake sorting out for it's MOT and i set the handbrake as per Haynes but it wasn't clear to me if i was supposed to be adjusting something at the caliper end -- i ended up just tightening the equaliser bar in the cabin under the arm rest where the 2 brake cables from the calipers join with the handbrake cable proper until i got the small gap at each stop.

p.s. the return springs as fitted to the Sharan's etc. can be fitted to Golfs etc. where its the same calipers. Lots of problems with handbrakes binding on in the cold etc. the £3 return springs are ace and the holes are already there in the calipers for them. Not sure why only some models have these.

[macsacel]

Cheers EGC, I'll mention it to the garage. I think one of the issues they've had is the cars permanent 4wd and testing the car on the RR.

Its getting to be a serious pain now, the cars drinking diesel like a twenty tonnet.

[EGC]

EGC, you know when you're adjusting the handbrake as you describe above, just clear of the stops, is there any adjustment possible at the caliper end of the handbrake cable? My wee golf needed the handbrake sorting out for it's MOT and i set the handbrake as per Haynes but it wasn't clear to me if i was supposed to be adjusting something at the caliper end -- i ended up just tightening the equaliser bar in the cabin under the arm rest where the 2 brake cables from the calipers join with the handbrake cable proper until i got the small gap at each stop.

p.s. the return springs as fitted to the Sharan's etc. can be fitted to Golfs etc. where its the same calipers. Lots of problems with handbrakes binding on in the cold etc. the £3 return springs are ace and the holes are already there in the calipers for them. Not sure why only some models have these.

The adjustment is at the handbrake lever end (nut on the equaliser bar). The return springs should not really be necessary. After some years of attending to these problems on various VAG cars I have come to the conclusion that the pistons are a bit tighter than they should be. We have had cars, year after year, that wear out their rear pads before the fronts...

[mbush]

Dear Fellow owners, My first post - so please be gentle with me!

My Octavia (1.8 TSI with DSG) is just coming up to 1 year old - 16K miles.

I have all the symptoms described in this thread.

The car has been back to the dealer who diagnosed the Mechatronic unit.

Ordered and replaced 6 weeks later - when they also told me they had found metal particles in the gearbox.

They took photos to send off to somewhere for further analysis - the recommendation came back to flush the gearbox twice - which was done.

I got the car back and almost immediately I could tell the original problem had not been fixed.

Booked it back in again and was told that they could find nothing wrong, either on the diagnostics or on a road test.

Now, I *know* there is a fault - and it's getting worse - juddering in 2nd is quite noticeable.

I told them to let me have the car bak and I would escalate the issue.

Q: Does anyone have any recommendations for how I can escalate this issue - and to whom?

I love the car but I'm very unhappy that this seems to be a common problem but no sign of a recall.

Many thanks, Michael.

[Evening Star]

Try ringing them directly or use the email form here: http://www.skoda.co.uk/gbr/contactus/customer-services/Pages/default.aspx