You as a seller of a car are still held fully accountable for whatever happens in relationship to that vehicle until the DVLA has received the V5 informing them of change of ownership.

Bits of hand written paper signed by both parties as 'proof of sale' only have a legal value of about as much use as bog paper.

Seller be very aware then I suppose, but just how the hell do you get 'round this problem, when the car has accrued 6 parking tickets and several scamera fines, not to mention involved in an accident with possibly no insurance or tax?

Edited 18 August, 201213 yr by Mr Ree

The V5 isn't proof of ownership. It says that very clearly on the front/back of it, and the fact it's processed by post means it can't really be used as an authoritative resource for ownership which can be transferred immediately IMO. As far as I'm concerned, proof of ownership goes with a receipt in whatever form that may take. My ex is driving around in a car that I have a loan out for, I have a receipt saying I've bought that car from the trader, she can produce no such receipt to say she's bought the car from me. If push came to shove, I would make that the proof that it's my car and not hers.

How long ago did you sell the car, I'm sure the speeding tickets will be fine as there's a clause of some sort accounting for "reasonable delay in finding the owner due to change of ownership", which is one of the things that can make tickets valid past the "14 day rule". So for those, simply give the new owners name and address (you did keep them, right?) and that's your obligation finished for those. When you receive a NIP for speeding your duty is to "provide details of the owner" or something like that, as long as you've done that you should be fine. I've never had a parking ticket but I would assume the wording on them is similar, and you are merely requested to provide details, then action will be taken against that person. The accident/no insurance/no tax, I have no idea about but given the way the DVLA works, I don't think it would be reasonable to use that data (which they specifically say doesn't prove ownership) over anything which states transfer of ownership has occurred (even a hand-written and signed receipt).

edit - that's a bit rambly, but meh

Similar thing happened to a friend, she argued that the tickets were issued at a carpark in Gravesend when both her and hubby were at work so how could it be them. Took about three months to sort out but eventually the operator relented, it was a private car park so not sure if a council do things differently

V5 states 'Registered Keeper' and is not proof of ownership. Also you will have supplementary evidence from where you cancelled the insurance and bought insurance for a new vehicle.

No, this is not a situation that I'm in, merely relaying a concerned readers letter from last weeks Honest John column in the Torygraph motoring supplement that I found quite disturbing

The reply was quite straightforward.....YOU will remain the registered keeper until the DVLA formally record the transfer.

I realise that in the event of legal trouble, it would probably be proven that you weren't actually in charge of the car anymore, but it's just all the possible mither and harrasment that concerns me

Bits of hand written paper signed by both parties as 'proof of sale' only have a legal value of about as much use as bog paper.

Not true - they form part of a body of evidence. If you have the person's signature, even on a hand-written piece of paper, it has weight.

I realise that in the event of legal trouble, it would probably be proven that you weren't actually in charge of the car anymore, but it's just all the possible mither and harrasment that concerns me

And that's why you record the date and particulars of the transaction, the buyer's details, with signature etc. etc. For minimum 'mither' you could always just pay the fines

Doesn't matter if it's hand written, it's a contract. Ownership has passed on, date, time, two signatures, job done.

Of course you'll be the registered keeper of the vehicle until the DVLA amend their records. In the event of a parking ticket or speeding fine the keeper gets the chance to notify the authorities as to who was driving, so you can do that as you will have a record of exactly when the car was collected.

So what would HJ say about leased vehicles?, same scenario - registered keeper is different to the driver, by his logic the leasing compamy would be responsible.

When I recently sold my MX5 I made the new buyer sign date and address

a declaration saying that any fines/penalties accrued after time and date of sale

were his responsibility. I just prepared 2 copies of the same form which also asked him to

sign that he understood it was sold as seen. (one for me and one for him)

He filled them out while I counted 8 and a half grand in £20 notes which took a while.

(50s would have been more convenient ) I signed the forms too after checking they

were the same. I then filled out the V5 in front of him using the address he'd put

on my forms. (Sort of an added check of it being genuine information)

It took 2 minutes to knock up on word and if a bus lane or speeding fine

ever came through my door I had enough proof to send them to get them off

my case and onto his.

Someone genuine and honest would be happy to do this IMO.

If not then 'No Sale' in my book.

I have sold a car in the past (many years ago) that was used for crime, and never "registered" with the new keeper/criminal...

police knocked on my door and woke me up at 3am, I think with the intention of arresting me... I simply showed them my "bill of sale" (I traded it in at a dodgy second hand car place) and they made notes, asked me where I was that night ect ect, and never came back

Always do bill of sale with whatever car you sell even to mates. Another rule I now live by is never buy or sell cars with mates. I've done both and both aren't mates anymore

Similar situation if you use a lease vehicle at work. Endorse log book with date & time you took it over, and returned it. Saves a lot of problems if office ever get a NIP and have to check to find driver.

I still have the new keeper suppliment for a golf i bought recently, i forgot to send it off, about a week ago the log book arrived in my name

You don't send the new keeper supplement off, you keep it until the logbook arrives don't you?

That is correct, as the new owner you retain the new keepers supplement. When selling a car, it is the sellers responsibility to notify the DVLA of the new owners name and address and until they have done so are liable for any fines etc. that may occur.

There is an offence of failing to notify keeper changes which carries a fine, so always take copies of documents you are going to send to the DVLA just in case they get lost in the post.

So soon as the new Owner has taken the car away and have signed for it then you have responsibility for the car from then on. Simples! Just make sure you get all the new keepers details and see their ID.

On this one, I've always had two "receipts" I've made in Word for my records and for the new owner, which we both date and sign along with the V5c, which has always kept both parties happy, as well as the DVLA.

I recently rejected a second hand car and handed it back to the supplying dealer, who took ALL the paperwork back, including all parts of the v5 I'd just received back from the DVLA.

I'd gone prepared with a typed up receipt as above, with the date on, specifying what I was handing back, rejecting ownership and what they were taking back (specifically all the V5 including the yellow part) and got them to sign, which they did.

I also then immediately wrote to the DVLA, notifying them of what the dealer had in terms of the V5, that I had signed proof of this and that i was no longer owner of the vehicle. The date of the DVLA acknowledgement is two weeks later, so I'll be keeping the rejection/transfer receipt I made for a while longer yet in case of funny business by the trader/sucker who buys the shed.

Always go the extra mile to cover yourself - small time investment with big savings later down the line.

I think the law has either changed or is about to change so that the registered keeper will be responsible for parking fines regardless of who was driving.

Can DVLA be informed of change of ownership immediately by email whilst documents are waiting to arrive by post?

Whenever I have sold a car either privately or via a dealer, I have always included the time of sale as well as the date. This way if whoever is tanking around in it later in the day I have some comeback of exactly when it left my possession.