VRS 2007 DPF Regens

[Obsolete01]

Hi all,

Looking for some advice here please. I was stuck in approx 2 hrs traffic last Friday and for the first time ever the dpf light came on the dash. Eventually I got out to the motorway and after 10 mins the light went off.

Today I was in the city and again while I was driving around it was again regenerating for about 25 mins (I made sure to keep the revs high in 2/3rd). I have 240kms on the car as well.

All feedback welcome please as I am sure ppl have experience with this before. I am wondering if I need to get this removed or cleaned or something else.

Cheers.

[SuperbTWM]

The PD engines do not work very well with particulate filters like the newer CR engines as the injection timing is pretty much fixed.

 

It sounds like previously the car has failed to regenerate due to you doing short runs or lots of stop/starting in traffic. Either that or it was just bad luck that the car needed a regen and you happened to be stuck in traffic at the time. I would see how it goes and if it keeps doing it it maybe that there is a fault developing.

 

That mileage is quite high also so it maybe a case of the DPF is getting less efficient depending on how its been driven throughout its life and could do with a replacement. Once they are full of ash you can try and limp them along by cleaning them with additives and special cleaners but I'm not sure how effective they are

Edited 1 August, 2016 by SuperbTWM

[Obsolete01]

Thanks, appreciate the reply.

So let me just get this right. When a regency is happening, you cannot be stuck in traffic?

[SuperbTWM]

Its hard for the DPF to get up to temperature when idling in traffic but usually if it fails to do a regen  it will keep trying until the soot level in the particulate filter drops to an acceptable level so it would normally never be an issue, but since you were in traffic for a long period of time the car attempted to do multiple regens and because it was unsuccessful it brought the warning light on to make you take action. If there was a problem and the soot level built up it would bring up further warnings and go into limp mode as once the DPF is nearly full its impossible to regenerate.

 

The newer common rail engines can inject extra diesel post combustion which then burns in the DPF, that helps a lot if the car needs to regenerate under low load conditions such as crawling in traffic.

Edited 1 August, 2016 by SuperbTWM

[silver1011]

I'm assuming this isn't the first time you've been stuck in traffic?

 

I am assuming however that this is the first time you've seen the DPF light?

 

It might just be a one off but on a 9 year old car it is highly likely the DPF is close to the end of it's life (DPF life is not just mileage dependent).

 

As mentioned the DPF is not perfectly suited to the PD170 engine in the original MkII vRS. I had one (on a 57 plate) and the DPF was troublesome, to the point I sold the car.

 

Sounds as though everything is currently working as expected though, the DPF light went out after a longer run. The problem I suspect you'll find now is that the DPF is filling with ash (the bi-product of the regeneration process that remains inside the DPF for life), the fuller it gets the more of the filter it covers and the less efficient the filter becomes and the more the light comes on (as it increasingly needs more regeneration's).

 

Ultimately if you intend keeping the car you'll be looking at a new DPF (£1,200 OEM, £800 aftermarket) or a DPF delete (removing the internals, coding out the sensors, and making MOT's more risky) for approx. £500.

 

For what it's worth, a PD170 vRS without it's DPF is like a new car. Don't be tempted for a map that offers increased performance, keep the map as a stage 0 (DPF coded out only) to ensure you get minimal smoke output. Without the DPF the exhaust flow is improved, fuel economy improves and the engine is generally much freer, no rough running during regens either, and as the DPF begins to fail (as mine did) it ruins the cars driving characteristics, it becomes less smooth, the clutch biting point constantly changes (different RPM's when trying to regen) etc. There are solid arguments for and against. Lot's of threads on here about DPF removal and the MOT test for you to read.

 

Out of curiosity has your car had the VOSA injector recall done? This has been known to have adverse affects on the performance of the DPF.

Edited 2 August, 2016 by silver1011

[Obsolete01]

Thanks for the reply, yep recall was done and yes first time I ever seen this light. I do a lot of motorway miles and country roads so that's probably saved me a lot but I just feel like the regens are way more frequent now.

I am seriously considering getting the internals of the dpf removed and just like you said a remap to only do whatever is needed to code the blanked dpf I'm not interested in increasing the bhp. Car testing is like you said something to be very careful of, so getting it removed needs to do done nice and tidy.

[Shadows Entity]

how do you know if your car has been recalled for injectors? as i have the same car and am dreading anything dpf related

[Obsolete01]

Marked in my service book and also a warranty sticker in the boot that the garage put there when they done it.

What yr and mileage have you?

[meaty101]

Silver hit the nail regarding DPF issues your having. Having read through his previous posts and seeing all the issues he had with his car he knows what he's on about! Basically a lovely car spoiled by a DPF. I also had a PD170 vrs and after owning the car for just a few months regens were becoming more and more frequent. I went down the wrong route with mine unfortunately. Early on i had a Shark remap done but left the DPF in place. It transformed the car performance wise but the original issue remained. It then meant having to have the dpf removed plus another map which was money i wasn't prepared to spend. Plus other things like the sills needing a spray convinced me the time was right to sell. That car without the dpf would have been excellent and i have no doubt at all would still be sitting on my drive. Removing the dpf would be my choice.

[Obsolete01]

Spoke to a guy that can do a nice tidy job for me so I'll be going down the removal route ????

[meaty101]

Spoke to a guy that can do a nice tidy job for me so I'll be going down the removal route ????

It is a bit of a can of worms here some are for some are against removal. As a diesel is subject to a smoke test as opposed to an emissions test they do pass an mot as long as the dpf looks like it's present. Talk a few years ago was vosa clamping down on it but as far as I know no one has said they're car has failed an mot because of a missing dpf. I'm ptetty sure it'll be a great car without it.

[Auric Goldfinger]

I am seriously considering getting the internals of the dpf removed and just like you said a remap to only do whatever is needed to code the blanked dpf

 

I did the same when I had a PD 170 Vrs. It transformed the car. The car pulled and breathed better. 

 

Didn't smoke much either...................

Edited 3 August, 2016 by Auric Goldfinger

[SuperbTWM]

Better for diagnosing faults without a DPF as well. If you have some sort of fuelling issue or an air leak and the car is producing more soot than normal your going to get a lot of regens which will lead you into thinking there is a problem with the DPF which will take you round the houses trying to find a fault with the DPF which isn't there or even replacing it.

 

Without it you can clearly identify that the car is smoking more than usual.

[meaty101]

The DPF was THE worst thing to do to the pd engine. Factor in all the regens and I'm not sure they're any better for the environment either.

[silver1011]

how do you know if your car has been recalled for injectors? as i have the same car and am dreading anything dpf related

 

Here is my injector recall sticker, in the boot / spare wheel well, it is the sticker on the right...

 

[sniper29a]

what do you expect? TDi cars were designed for long runs.

 

If you drive short trips, you kill your car in no time. There is no better way to kill your turbo than stop/star of cold engine.

 

It happened to me as well. Fortunately, I've got onboard diagnostic and I can see when regen is needed.

 

You can't really know without diagnostic when DPF regen happens.

 

I drive short trips around 2x4km every day...every weekend I go to burn DPF out.

 

Remapped car, especially badly remapped car needs regen in every 50km or so if you really push it hard. Flat out, full load fuelling with good remap still produces lots of unburnt fuel.

[Obsolete01]

what do you expect? TDi cars were designed for long runs.

What are you in about? When did I say I expected my TDI to do short runs but not have any problems with it?

[meaty101]

What are you in about? When did I say I expected my TDI to do short runs but not have any problems with it?

And just to add,the last few months of my ownership was blighted with regens during long motorway journeys so even that didn't work. A 100 mile journey up the M6 and pulled into a service station the car was regening!!

[Obsolete01]

And just to add,the last few months of my ownership was blighted with regens during long motorway journeys so even that didn't work. A 100 mile journey up the M6 and pulled into a service station the car was regening!!

Yep that's me currently ... I think its time to remove

[sniper29a]

so you write your light came off, yet you have no problems ;-)

 

it is very simple your DPF is so clogged beyond regeneration. All from short trips or remapped ECU.

 

 

Exactly same on my car...German guy did short trips...lots of diesel in engine oil and DPF regeneration 400km. ECU tried repeatedly regenerate DPF. Sadly no dashboard light...looks like someone was trying to override DPF so next owner doesn't know. If I didn't have Polar FIS box, I wouldn't know either :-D

 

It took me a half year of alpine fun at full load to burn DPF out. Try it, some times it help. But you need something like Glocknerstrasse 25km up and 25km down. At WOT and full load...EGT temps over 800deg C , exactly same as during DPF regeneration cycle. Since you have no mountains in UK, you will have to replace it. Or if you're pig take it off.

Edited 4 August, 2016 by sniper29a

[SuperbTWM]

And just to add,the last few months of my ownership was blighted with regens during long motorway journeys so even that didn't work. A 100 mile journey up the M6 and pulled into a service station the car was regening!!

 

I, and many others find motorway cruising does not passively regenerate the DPF so in fact long motorway runs do not help in that sense, only in the sense that if the car is doing an active regen it can complete it without you actually knowing.

 

You would have to be really tramming on to get the required DPF temperatures for a passive regen.

Edited 4 August, 2016 by SuperbTWM

[Jevpls]

I understand that for so called passive regeneration there is need for high speed motorways (like German autobahns). I guess that in UK the max. allowed speed could be something like 130 kph - am I right? Should be not enough.

[sniper29a]

it is not about speed but engine load/fuel.

 

Flat highway wit usual +/-100m

 

130km/h = 450deg C

160km/h = 500deg C

200km/h = 550deg C

 

regen = 800deg C + 650deg C in DPF. usually fuelled by diesel

 

As I have written, unless you live in mountain area you won't passively burn out DPF

 

 

If I go to mountains for some fun...such as Glocknerstrasse...850deg C in exhaust for at least 20 minutes

Edited 5 August, 2016 by sniper29a

[meaty101]

I think it's so many miles @ certain revs. So basically sitting on the motorway for example in 4th gear. Or live in a mountain region!!