My 2016 Citigo is suffering from a seized rear brake (RHS only) after heavy overnight rain. Release the handbrake and try to pull off my driveway, and the tyre drags for a metre or 2 before there's a loud "pop", and the brake frees off.

It's only happened twice. The first time, the car hadn't been moved for a few days, and it had rained heavily. I tried to rock the car back and forth, slipping the clutch in first and reverse. This didn't work, so I just went for it in first gear, left a skid mark on the (by now dry) drive before the drum released.

Second time, the car had been used the previous day, and it released with less dragging.

Once freed off, everything works normally, although the brakes are a bit squeaky for the first few applications.

 

I've had cars do this before, but normally after they have stood for a long time. Seems odd that it'll seize overnight.

 

I don't drive the car hard (it's my local runabout), and the last couple of miles back to my house require very little braking, so the brakes are pretty cool when the handbrake is applied.

 

The car has half of a 12 month Skoda approved warranty, not sure if this kind of thing is covered though?

 

Is it just a case of pulling the drums off and cleaning them? Presumably this is a simple job - remove wheel, then one screw, pull off drum - or is it not as easy at it was on old cars with drums?

 

 

It is common.

As it is the brakes should be getting serviced anyway as Main Dealer Servicing says 'Remove wheels' which does not happen, and it did say Clean Brakes back when Drums were more common, and that does not happen without paying extra.

 

So Brake Drums need taken off, cleaned out, greased correctly on the back plate. some say not.

Brake Fluid due a change anyway at 3 years then each 2.  At least the H20 content tested.

 

Simply Clever to see that Wheels can come off anyway pre winter and salted roads. 

A little copper slip on the drum face to stop the wheels becoming 'welded' to the drums.  Not really welded, just dissimilar metals corroding together.

Brake shoes sticks to brake drum because of corrosion. So much metal in brake linings these days. I don't think that brake shoes would sticks to the back plate. 

 

How to prevent this then? Try to warm up brakes or do not use parking brake. 

I hadn't thought about the fact that modern brake linings are different to the old ones - probably doesn't help.

 

Sounds like it's still a simple job, so I'll probably DIY it.  Do the shoes need backing off before the drums come off?

 

Brake shoes are not sticking to back plates, but back plates have sliders / plastic-nylon or you lightly grease, or do not bother if you can not be bothered but there is a reason to do it.

 

It does not happen on many vehicles that have rear brake drums. It was and is common on Mk2 Fabia and Up!MiiCitigo.

 

Broken springs were common on Mk2 Fabia rear Drum Brakes as well.

 

Re warming up brakes, that is often what happens as someone drives, then they wash the dirty car, next time they drive it there might well be sticking rear drums.

People parking cars on roads or car parks might have no choice but to use the parking brake as someone might steal the wheel chocks / bricks. 

or maybe just the wheels and put the car on bricks.

Edited 30 August, 20196 yr by Roottootemoot

With drum brakes, including all the above, it is also good to make the brakes work hard every so often, which may include pulling up while applying the handbrake.

 

Why? If you just drive around town, and are a gentle braker, the inside radius of the brake drum cannot keep rust at bay. The sticking is a result of that rust and moisture. A few sharp stops every so often from speed and occasional use of the handbrake when you haven't quite stopped will help keep the surfaces cleaner. Sure - it generates dust that you'll have to clean out every so often, as the guys say, but it is better to have the rust as dust than remaining on the drum's friction surfaces.

1 hour ago, Clockworks said:

... the shoes need backing off before the drums come off?

 

I don't think so. At least mine didn't. If it isn't a lot driven. 

Edited 30 August, 20196 yr by Emil

1 hour ago, Roottootemoot said:

Brake shoes are not sticking to back plates, but back plates have sliders / plastic-nylon or you lightly grease, or do not bother if you can not be bothered but there is a reason to do it.

 

 

What sliders do you mean? I didn't find any. And never seen such a thing inside brake drum. 

@Emil

Maybe you have not seen them, not in a Citigo, that does not mean they are not there on some back plates.

 

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/444279-sticking-rear-drums

 

Edited 30 August, 20196 yr by Roottootemoot

I don't know what I should look at that topic. But I do know this is about Citigo. No sliders of any kind. Brake shoes slides against back plate. 

@Emil

Does the back plate have no nylon inserts or no pressed raised bits ?

Edited 30 August, 20196 yr by Roottootemoot

Indeed, some drum brakes do have teflon (usually) glides to better locate the shoes as they travel outwards to the drum. They are press-in circular flat disks, located on the back-plate.

 

Although they can wear, I can't see how they would cause hard binding as described in the OP, and neither can I see how lubricating teflon/nylon glides is useful.

 

If they are fitted on Citigo drums - and as mine is brand new,  I won't be checking any time soon - then if you disassemble the drums, and  if the glides are there and not smooth, I, for one, would buy new glides (for a few pence on the scale of things) and replace them. Like anyone might for anything worn, once you are arsed to disassemble something...

 

The question though, is about Citigos

 

Edited 30 August, 20196 yr by freemansteve

I'll give the brakes a bit of hard use next time I take the car out, see if that stops the problem

@freemansteve

I would not lube them either, but when looking i would see if there were any, and if just pressed raised areas grease them with the appropriate grease.

Look at see, and service. 

 

As to your new wheels. If not done already i would check the bolts tightness, which i would do after taking the wheels off and painting the drums now pre winter, 

then a little lube on the mating surface. 

There are so many wheels on new cars that stay put for a long time until someone finds they do not come off at the roadside.

34 minutes ago, Roottootemoot said:

@freemansteve

"I would not lube them" & "grease them with the appropriate grease"

 

This could be confusing! I assume you meant any painted metal protrusions not the teflon bits. Frankly I would never grease the surface of backing plates, but if you know it fixes a problem, then fine!

 

Edited 30 August, 20196 yr by freemansteve

@freemansteve  Certainly is as you edited what was posted after your post.

Maybe only if you are easily confused or do not know one grease from another. Or smearing lightly.

If in doubt leave well alone.

 

PS

If you are going to quote maybe  do not edit from what was posted as you have just done.

Edited 30 August, 20196 yr by Roottootemoot

I am not confused by simple stuff, but I personally see no need to to grease teflon!

 

And greasing the backplate is not a good idea - and I question whether it has anything to do with the OP's actual problem.

 

It is not beyond belief that the the back plates are used in different models with slightly different width shoes, and rather than make a new hard tool for backplates (£££), it would be cheaper to drill stock ones and use teflon inserts to fill the gap to stop shoe movement....  It's a typical expediency us engineers have done for years.

Edited 30 August, 20196 yr by freemansteve

Neither do i, and i said that after your post, but that i would the pressed bits.  That is where there are no inserts. 

 

It has nothing to do with the OPs problem.  Read how the thread goes. 

You seem to be missing the answers came early on.

Edited 30 August, 20196 yr by Roottootemoot

@freemansteve

From the link i posted from the Mk2 fabia thread regarding the Sticking brakes and then the discussion on servicing drums, as some of us were trained to while serving our apprenticeship. In Motor Engineering.

Is it hard to believe that it's the brake linings which sticks to brake drum? 

This very  common problem is down to a seizing handbrake actuator arm attatched to the trailing shoe that is used to apply the handbrake.

 

Its the long silver lever in this photo.

 

Corrosion between the lever and shoe support and the pivot builds up over time and with little movement to clean it because skoda and their techs insist that 2-3 clicks is the correct handbrake adjustment, so in time it gets stiffer and stiffer to move and will seize/stick when it gets wet and a little more corrosion. The return spring attached the handbrake cable at the bottom of the lever is too long, so is never straight and so too weak and flimsy to push a stiff lever back and release the shoes.

 

It needs cleaning/lubing/exercising, best if you can strip it and do it properly.

 

Loosening the handbrake cable to 4 - 6 clicks can help as the lever moves more and wipes itself clean(er).

Edited 30 August, 20196 yr by xman

@Emil

We know it is that, known it for years, Know that being sure the brakes are hot before stopping as you suggest makes no difference if you wash the car maybe. 

Or just park a while with the parking brake on.

 

It is like we know your front discs are more of an issue than others front discs that might need a set replaced but not as often as you do.

2 hours ago, Emil said:

I don't know what I should look at that topic. But I do know this is about Citigo. No sliders of any kind. Brake shoes slides against back plate. 

 

Glide pieces are shown as item 8 on this ETKA diagram for Citigo, so I think they will be there https://skoda.7zap.com/en/cz/citigo/cit/2013-727/6/609-609020/

They tend to get coated in rust and brake dust and blend in with the backplate, so most people don't realise they are there.

Their presence is given away without disassembly by the little four-segment retaining clippy bits sticking out on the visible side of the backplate as in roottoots photo a few posts earlier. 3 per shoe, 6 per side. 

 

They do get scuffed up and form 'valleys' where the shoes habitually sit, but I doubt they are causing this problem. More likely xman's suggestion above; very common problem on this design. Or simply a shoe or two sticking to the drum...

 

 

Edited 30 August, 20196 yr by Wino

Any other part would cause dragging rear brake but brake shoe rusted to brake drum. When rusted brake lining is released from brake lining there is no dragging brakes. That is the case with Citigo. End of story. 

Edited 30 August, 20196 yr by Emil

Your logic escapes me emil. Isn't the whole point about brake shoes that when they don't move relative to the drum, neither does the wheel?