I did say that the bubble was going to pop not that long ago, and I can see that the price is going to go even higher. I really do think that you have seen the best period for really cheap motoring costs based purely on the cost per mile, ignoring the cost of the car in the first place, etc., just purely looking at fuel costs alone.

Also it is looking like the proposed plug-in solar system that the government want to roll out to those who don't want or can't afford etc, proper solar system to be installed, the plug-in system could become vapourware.

It is highly dangerous to plug a generator into the wiring system without have some pretty extensive rewiring and expensive extra kit installed on the system to ensure that you don't pump out-of-spec power back into the grid, and also that you don't disable the existing circuit safety protection systems, which are designed for current to flow backwards into the consumer units. It also looks that they will legal challenges issued by landlords, etc., to prevent tenants making any alterations to the electrical systems within rented buildings. Also I'm getting vibes that they, and social landlords such as HA and councils are getting growing concerns about allowing storage batteries, as there have been some fires attributed to them.

Oh, and I have just had an email this evening from my supplier OVO an invitation to look at their offerings for a tariff to charge my electric car at a cheaper electric rate at nighttime. Wow, how long have others been offering this system, and only now have OVO thought about me charging my non-existent car at night at home? 😒

Edited 21 April21 Apr by Graham Butcher

I was kicking my self for not getting my deal fixed when 6.9 pence a kWh which would then have received the 3.1 pence off when the price came in. I did thankfully at least for for the 5.99 pence a kWh for 12 months. As far as the public charging possible increases time will tell but surely it must being going up. For now there is only one way i get free charging & that is at National Trust For Scotland chargers which is OK if there for a few hours and i can get a charger that is available and not blocked by a ICE vehicle. Only 7 kW charging but then i am paying £13.15 a month for my membership. I will be visiting Culzean Castle more often and staying for longer each visit. Just not buying their very very expensive food or drink when there.

Edited 22 April22 Apr by Evolution13

Yes, those irksome ICE drivers are a bleeding nuisance; I keep seeing the two newly installed public chargers at the local shops blocked by ICE cars, rendering the chargers useless.

38 minutes ago, Graham Butcher said:

Yes, those irksome ICE drivers are a bleeding nuisance; I keep seeing the two newly installed public chargers at the local shops blocked by ICE cars, rendering the chargers useless.

Should get a parking ticket IMO.

8 hours ago, Graham Butcher said:

I did say that the bubble was going to pop not that long ago, and I can see that the price is going to go even higher. I really do think that you have seen the best period for really cheap motoring costs based purely on the cost per mile, ignoring the cost of the car in the first place, etc., just purely looking at fuel costs alone.

Also it is looking like the proposed plug-in solar system that the government want to roll out to those who don't want or can't afford etc, proper solar system to be installed, the plug-in system could become vapourware.

It is highly dangerous to plug a generator into the wiring system without have some pretty extensive rewiring and expensive extra kit installed on the system to ensure that you don't pump out-of-spec power back into the grid, and also that you don't disable the existing circuit safety protection systems, which are designed for current to flow backwards into the consumer units. It also looks that they will legal challenges issued by landlords, etc., to prevent tenants making any alterations to the electrical systems within rented buildings. Also I'm getting vibes that they, and social landlords such as HA and councils are getting growing concerns about allowing storage batteries, as there have been some fires attributed to them.

Oh, and I have just had an email this evening from my supplier OVO an invitation to look at their offerings for a tariff to charge my electric car at a cheaper electric rate at nighttime. Wow, how long have others been offering this system, and only now have OVO thought about me charging my non-existent car at night at home? 😒

What / which bubble ?

Octopus, and the other energy suppliers, want to make some, Octopus, or lots as in others, profit and even dual and tri-rate tariffs may not do that if users charge at peak cost times.

Hence Agile and Tracker is the direction way Octopus users are being encouraged.

If one is adaptable one can have ones electricity almost for free, bar standing charge, if one is adaptable to charge the EVs, batteries when the electricity generation prices falls to near zero or below zero. Half hourly prices are released by Octopus for the next day at around 5 pm and as prices go negative today at 1130 I will pop out before lunch abd plug in a couple of the EVs and leave them plugged in, or programmed ro accept charge, might be PM nap time, to shut off at 1600 when price returns to a positive value.

Just a case of moving with the times !

39 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

Should get a parking ticket IMO.

Totally agree; to me its akin to parking in a disabled bay, totally selfish and oblivious to the fact that spot could be a virtual lifesaver to an EV driver.

REAL WORLD EVing. Who is it that is going to issue a Parking ticket at chargers that are not in areas covered by Parking Wardens. Parking camera companies can send notices where they have contracts. or there are Private contracted wardens. The are EV drivers just as bad for using charging bays to park yet not charge. There are people out their without the brains cells they were born with, or are just stupid and lazy. PS. Parking Attendants were posting Parking tickets in Angus at cars on chargers that were no longer charging, yet it was faulty chargers often cutting out and leaving the vehicle plugged in and no longer charging. Big clue, RED Light showing Charging Off. That could be someone pressing the emergency button. Quite common because the same Greedy Barsteward local business people would keep hogging chargers back in the days the charging was free. The thing was the Car Parking was free after Covid and the ticket machines were covered and the council had passed free parking. What really pees me off is PHEV,s abandoned for ages on a CCS charger when there are plenty AC,s they could be using. Too lazy to get their cable out and use it. Too stupid to not think they can use the AC Tethered lead.

Edited 22 April22 Apr by Evolution13

The new era has begun !

At 1130, BST, my Octopus charge rate dropped to minus 0.86 p per KWh.

Later today, 1330 to 1500 it will be minus 1.3P per KWh.

Currently got the 5 and the Scenic on wall-box chargers so drawing about 11 KWs which will be about a pound paid back to me for the 70 KWh I put in to the cars, portable home batteries and heating the water for bath time !

So not free but actually paid for taking electricity in these negative and virtual zero cost slots.

Octopus did the switch from GO tariff to Agile in an hour or so. See how it plays out, we seem to be in an unusual spell of both very sunny and windy weather but we are still couple of months away from summer solstice and then 2 months hopefully of plenty more of the same until the darker days of October to February are upon us but with the amount and size of wind farms being connected of the east coast hopefully lots more times when UK has too much electricity and suppliers will give it away for nothing or pay me to take it. Next puzzle is what extra battery to get to hold the cheap / free lecky and how to put from batteries to car although the 5 is effectively a home battery on wheels with its V2l capability ?

Lets hope there no haters that thinks throwing a brick at your EV is payback. PS. There is plunge pricing this afternoon of 15% at many of the Main Public Charging providers. I just received a email. 15% off some pretty expensive tariffs.

Edited 22 April22 Apr by Evolution13

@Evolution13 The world is full of self-rightous t!%ts who just don't give a fig about anybody else, when did it all start going downhill, in our childhood you could leave your house or car unlocked and it would be fine, parents would let their kids play out in the street, park etc, unsupervised without any worries. I used to cycle miles away from home and be gone all day long, and everything was OK. Compare that todays world, where will it end up?

Edited 22 April22 Apr by Graham Butcher

2 hours ago, Evolution13 said:

Lets hope there no haters that thinks throwing a brick at your EV is payback. PS. There is plunge pricing this afternoon of 15% at many of the Main Public Charging providers. I just received a email. 15% off some pretty expensive tariffs.

Yes saw the plunge pricing at public chargers.

Clearly lots of solar and wind at the moment.

In my quiet cul-de-sac most houses have EVs and many cases have roof solar that I can see, plus some have batteries talking to the home owners.

Edited 22 April22 Apr by lol-lol

18 hours ago, lol-lol said:

Yes saw the plunge pricing at public chargers.

Clearly lots of solar and wind at the moment.

In my quiet cul-de-sac most houses have EVs and many cases have roof solar that I can see, plus some have batteries talking to the home owners.

To keep a balanced view, I live in a cul-de-sac of just 20 houses: 2 with 1 car, 6 with 3 cars and 12 with 2 cars, so that's 44 vehicles. between just 20 houses, and not a single EV or a hybrid between them; none of them are old bangers either. The only house with any solar is mine, with 13 x 400 W panels on the roof, but no batteries.

Looking on Google Earth, there are very few houses in Chelmsford with any solar at all.

1 hour ago, Graham Butcher said:

To keep a balanced view, I live in a cul-de-sac of just 20 houses: 2 with 1 car, 6 with 3 cars and 12 with 2 cars, so that's 44 vehicles. between just 20 houses, and not a single EV or a hybrid between them; none of them are old bangers either. The only house with any solar is mine, with 13 x 400 W panels on the roof, but no batteries.

Looking on Google Earth, there are very few houses in Chelmsford with any solar at all.

The difference is a conundrum.

If there are some who have invested in solar and batteries but not seeing a financial advantage might be keeping quite out of embaressment. I gather some solar installs are reckoned to take 10 or 15 years to repay but that was before the price of fuel went nuts 8 weeks ago so the maths are different now.

Pace of change seems constant round these parts, one side they just got a BYD Atto 1 for one daughter and on the other they just got a model 3, side with the BYD theg are using a granny charger and a thick wired extension lead I made for them, wallbox installed to charge the 3.

Neither those houses have solar but many other houses do in the street.

With changes in fuel prices but also some of the incredibly cheap, even free electricity to charge cars and home many are catching on to vastly lowering their outgoings in some areas ie their transport and home running costs, meaning sone household can divert money to other aspects which are costing more, council tax etc.

We will see over the next year just how things all work out. Just how much fuel prices do rise for those that do not have their own oil wells or run on UVO or have their own solar, hydro or wind generated electricity. That is probably the majority of drivers in the UK.

Edited 23 April23 Apr by Evolution13

3 hours ago, Evolution13 said:

We will see over the next year just how things all work out. Just how much fuel prices do rise for those that do not have their own oil wells or run on UVO or have their own solar, hydro or wind generated electricity. That is probably the majority of drivers in the UK.

I thing Agile tariff is available to all, no conditions, no need to prove having an EV !

Edited 23 April23 Apr by lol-lol

Necessity is the mother of invention it is said.

Moving from what most EV operators do ie charge up overnight on cheapish lecky, but this is being undermined as even Octopus are now charging more for Night time charging than before the government's 3.51 p per KWh reduction ie over 8.6 p per KWh for Octopus GO Night time rate.

So I switched to Octopus Agile tariff which "tracks" costs, some ie up to 32 hours forward pricing given to consumers, predicting solar and wind production plus overlayed of nuclear base load of course. This price can be anywhere between minus 11 p per KWh on quite a few occasions, -19 p per KWh being the record I think, and is under 5 p per KWh about 12% of the time, weekend naturally being a likely time.

So I am transitioning from fixed night time charge and home using to when ever it is cheapest which looks like being usually PM, up to 4 pm and weekend, BHs the probably times for cheap / free / negative electricity for EVs and home.

Easier now I am retired.

It looks like electric refuse trucks have come to the end of the 'charge' as the trial in Wakefield fails. The new fleet will be diesel-powered after all, as electric trucks just cannot cut it in reality.

Council bin lorries to be replaced with new diesel fleet after electric trial failure

Strange as Dundee,s seem to be doing well. Not sure if Aberdeen's Hydrogen Refuse lorries are going to carry on doing the job.

Edited 26 April26 Apr by Evolution13

Glasgow Hydrogen trial with Refuse Vehicles.

4 hours ago, Graham Butcher said:

It looks like electric refuse trucks have come to the end of the 'charge' as the trial in Wakefield fails. The new fleet will be diesel-powered after all, as electric trucks just cannot cut it in reality.

Council bin lorries to be replaced with new diesel fleet after electric trial failure

Odd when my old firm and other firms in the logistics firms are finding electric trucks superior in both cost and performance.

At a guess I would say those efforts to make such specialist EV vehicles gave not had the technical development that cars, trucks and vans have had.

Tesla commencing production of 50k Seminper year, Articulated trucks as the test have gone so well.

BYD going ever bigger in all of their EV manufacturing classes.

I am looking at going EV on motorcycle as well but torn on the choice. Fancy the Royal Enfield Flying Flea but its a little small for me but there are ever increasing choices out there and prices getting more affordable and the acceleration is good.

Starting to think about what I could change the Scenic for as gave had that nearly 2 years and with the hew crop of EV cars the choice is even more difficult and great prices with more getting the full grant now.

Edited 26 April26 Apr by lol-lol

2 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

Odd when my old firm and other firms in the logistics firms are finding electric trucks superior in both cost and performance.

At a guess I would say those efforts to make such specialist EV vehicles gave not had the technical development that cars, trucks and vans have had.

Tesla commencing production of 50k Seminper year, Articulated trucks as the test have gone so well.

BYD going ever bigger in all of their EV manufacturing classes.

I am looking at going EV on motorcycle as well but torn on the choice. Fancy the Royal Enfield Flying Flea but its a little small for me but there are ever increasing choices out there and prices getting more affordable and the acceleration is good.

Starting to think about what I could change the Scenic for as gave had that nearly 2 years and with the hew crop of EV cars the choice is even more difficult and great prices with more getting the full grant now.

I'm guessing it has far more to with the extra loading that refuse trucks have with all hydraulics involved in the lifting of the bins into the truck; the compression rams that compact the refuse and the tipping of the body in order to empty it out were the bit that actually cause problems, as they all eat away at the HV battery charge level and then the lengthy recharging time worked against them. A normal truck only has to provide traction power.

I have read various articles / reports now on Wakefield & BEV refuse trucks. Charging points at depots seem to be an issue. Longer routes out and about seemingly. Short journeys stop start not suiting the vehicles???? It looks very odd that where the BEV,s are ideal as they are for other councils you would not use them, and have a mixed fleet of BEV and ICE. As it is there must be something more going on. Were the vehicles they bought or leased actually faulty, or was it user error?

2 hours ago, Evolution13 said:

I have read various articles / reports now on Wakefield & BEV refuse trucks. Charging points at depots seem to be an issue. Longer routes out and about seemingly. Short journeys stop start not suiting the vehicles???? It looks very odd that where the BEV,s are ideal as they are for other councils you would not use them, and have a mixed fleet of BEV and ICE. As it is there must be something more going on. Were the vehicles they bought or leased actually faulty, or was it user error?

Or could it be that other authorities are being less truthful and not wanting to be seen climbing down from their green image and admitting that they have spent masses of public money on something that is not ideal for the job? Remember these are trucks that are by their very nature going to be doing a massive amount of stop/start driving; depending on the road, it might be many such cycles per road. Then there is the extra muscle that needs to be addressed, all the compacting, etc. that these trucks have to do.

These trucks weigh far more than a BEV car does, and they have to get that weight moving again from a dead stop and move maybe 100 metres down the road and stop and repeat all that many times on some roads.

Well stop starting is where BEV,s are perfect. That really is why Last Mile deliveries which is really multi stop deliveries are being done with Electric Vans. Lets see who many others having invested many more millions than Wakefield in Electric Refuse vehicles give up on the trials and declare it a failure. As to starting and moving a heavy vehicle. Every road is not an uphill slope. Countries where there have been thousands of BEV refuse trucks are one thing, but what will matter is long term UK use in all regions. And after all there has to be reduced pollution and maybe Diesel Refuse trucks using Stop / start. Problem with what ever type of refuse truck in Scotland is getting Drivers with appropriate licenses because the Council or company pay is poor for drivers that can earn much more elsewhere. Locally to me they had to call back drivers that had retired.

Edited 27 April27 Apr by Evolution13

5 minutes ago, Evolution13 said:

Well stop starting is where BEV,s are perfect. That really is why Last Mile deliveries which is really multi stop deliveries are being done with Electric Vans. Lets see who many others having invested many more millions than Wakefield in Electric Refuse vehicles give up on the trials and declare it a failure. As to starting and moving a heavy vehicle. Every road is not an uphill slope.

Well last mile delivery vans don't get multiple stops in the same road after 100 metres, in all the roads on their route. Also not carrying the same weight, speaking of which, they get lighter as the day progress so need less energy towards the end. The reverse is true with the bin lorries which are very heavy at the end.