So, problem come back again. I have measured voltage after 4 days of no run of the car. It has 11,4 V, cars bearly starts. So I need to change battery. It is interesting becouse car is 3 years old. It runs with start stop at previous user so it might kill the battery. What do you think about this battery:

 

BOSCH Akumulator 60Ah 640A P+ (efb/rozruchowy)
Indeks: 0 092 S4E 051 

 

?

You do have to fully recharge and best to use a lower amperage, 4-amp is good, 2-amp is better but obviously take almost twice as long to fully charge, you could go up to 6-amps but not so good.

CU

Given you do not know the fully history of the use of the car and battery previously and some people use, abuse, neglect items more than others you might be better to get a new battery and start from fresh and then you know for sure.

 

Bosch I believe is just the label, I am told they are probably Varta so goo d to go with if correct specification for your model.  As you are looking at what we call a type 027 then in Tayna battery supplier as for petrol engines.  Bosch in their catalogue list the S4 E05 as 60 Ah, 640 CCA (EN), you put.  I put a Tosch sorry Bosch (Varta) battery in my wife's 2015 Fabia and other owners have and Varta and find them to be good. - https://cdn.tayna.com/datasheets/Bosch Car Battery Range.pdf

 

I suggest fully charging the new replacement battery before fitting it to the car but most would not bother with that, I prefer to know I started at full rather than close to it.

 

Do read the car's Owner's Manual before disconnecting the old battery and connecting the new battery, best to have all electrics switched off and windows and sunroof fully shut then there will be less to reset.  You should get the new battery coded in.  The only things that matter really are that the Ah is correct and you change or advance the "serial number" often ten ones from factory (1111111111) easiest is just to change the end digit to 2 (1111111112).

 

Other than use, abuse, neglect wearing the battery prematurely if the charging system is OK there was a VWŠkoda balls-up with "battery maintenance" so a Recall on my wife's 2015 (CU97(?) IIRC) so you could check if VWŠkoda have admitted to he same for your call. - Škoda Recall Campaigns - https://www.skoda-auto.com/services/recall-campaigns

 

Otherwise there could be a drain from the car dashcam, your start/stop defeat(?), leaving something on - another reason I like to start knowing the new battery was fully charged when I fitted it in case I need to check or have more reserve for drain or car charging system issues (though I would do a check on the car's charging if I was really concerned things can get missed).

 

As I (think I) put before a 2021 car has a lot more on it than a 2014 car or even 2017 so more wearing on car's battery and charging system but the use of an appropriate charger maintainer, following the car's Owner's Manual and charger instructions, particularly in a preventative manner when/where required should greatly extend the useful life of the battery certainly beyond 3 years or VW's 4 or 5 years recommendations.

 

I think I have covered everything but if you want to know more just ask others or I can try to give you answers.

 

Hi, Is 14,8V charging at cold engine after start is ok value ?

Very probably given how low your car battery is.  It does depend if this is at revs or idle, without or without load or high load, state of charge of battery and other factors but as you're going to fit a new battery you could test again with the new battery fitted particularly if you fully charge the new battery before installing it into the car. A quick Google and perhaps this will explain more and why I prefer to fully charge the new battery before fitting. ( I do not recommend a CTEK because I think they are overpriced and not necessary for usual battery maintenance). - https://www.ctek.com/se/nyheter/why-your-alternator-is-not-enough-for-charging-your-12v-car-battery

 

So, from the beginning: subject is skoda scala with 1.5 150 hp tsi engine from MY2021. History is that it runs with start stop on, and this could be the factor that may damage the battery.

But facts:

 

1. Skoda gives warrnings about low battery level, it runs short distances, once I have charged battery over 3-4 hours but no result

2. After 3-4 days of idle, old battery drops to 11,4V, after enginge starts, it peeks to 14,8V at idle engine speed

3. We have decided to by new bosch battery, that I mentioned last post

4. Battery was changed in work shop but after replace mechanic mentioned that car has low level of chargning, 

5. I have checked today: new battery idle engine stop is 12,5V, with engine running is only 12,8 V by multimeter gauge

6. I have coded the battery in ECU by OBD11, I have puts 60 Ah instead of 59 Ah, and changed 1111111111 to 1111111112

7. OBD11 in parameters shows 12,667 V when engine is running at idle speed, I added long distance lights, blower etc, and it stays on that value

 

Simple question: my older cars runs at 14,2 14,3 V at idle engine speed and it shows that alternator is working correctly, but how about this system ?

Is it normal that ECU lowers the charging tension when battery is full (new) ?

 

I dont want to make new costs. Mechanic says about alternator malfunction when he sees only 12,8V at idle engine speed. But it's new generation of car and it may be different ?

 

I will be glad for all helpfull responses. 

Using the start/stop does not damage the battery, perhaps overall the battery might be better and last longer but it does not damage the battery, the battery can be damaged by system or component or part malfunction or car owner or driver use / abuse / neglect.  A 2021 car has more on it for the owner/user to use to wear the battery more and sooner than say a 2014 or much earlier cars.  On my old cars if I bought a new battery I would expect about 10 years before I need pay it any attention or perhaps use a battery charger (last was a 1973 MG Midget) but that's a different car from a different time.

 

You have also added in something to the system, that obviously needs to be not causing any issues, I am not saying it has has, how could I possibly know.

 

3-4 hours may or may not be enough to charge the battery sufficiently let alone fully, there are many variables, I recommend fully recharging the battery using an appropriate charger maintainer after reading the car's Owner's Manual and charger instructions, the lower the amperage of charger but the long it will take to get to full, I usually link to a 4-amp charger maintainer but if the battery charger is very low a 2-amp charger may be better but will take longer around twice as long, so possibly many hours (to days in bad cases).

 

One cause of battery being in a low state of charge is the car's charging system not operating properly, checking the charging system is a basic check for unexpected cause of battery in low state of charge.

 

What is the type of battery showing in the OBD11?

 

See the link I put up in my previous post for last two questions, test again when driving the car or at other points at other times and perhaps again a month's time and see what figures you get and report back or consider if you are satisfied or you want the mechanic to do more checks and work. 

ETA: would using a multimeter with the probes directly on the new battery terminal posts give the same figures as your OBD11?

 

1 hour ago, nta16 said:

ETA: would using a multimeter with the probes directly on the new battery terminal posts give the same figures as your OBD11?

 

Yes. OBD gives 12,67 multimetr gives 12,79 aprox. I will fully charge Old battery, I takę it back, at least I will use it in my octavia 2013, it has ori battery, no problema at all, no start stop from factor.

OBD shows EFB. And battery is EFB indeed. New one too.

1 minute ago, radoszczak said:

Yes. OBD gives 12,67 multimetr gives 12,79 aprox. I will fully charge Old battery, I takę it back, at least I will use it in my octavia 2013, it has ori battery, no problema at all, no start stop from factor.

 

Yeap I got the OBD11 voltages but that's through two different lots of computers/programs, the plug bit uses battery power anyway, I was thinking of more direct meter figures to see how they compare and as conformation.  Of course different meters can/will give different figures depending on how accurate they are but a direct whisper in the ear is often better than a second-hand "Chinese whisper".

 

You should always check, double and treble-check where required, and cross-reference any information you get from any source (especially the internet and computers), and test testing equipment before different tests to make sure of correct function.

 

At the very least you have a new battery fitted, 'coded' correctly, so you can afford to relax for a while at least, give things a while to settle then check as and when you feel necessary.

 

If you didn't check the new battery voltage or fully charge it before fitting you don't have a datum point for it to compare against with your present figures so, but with your present figures you have a datum point for a future comparison.

 

With the old battery, unless it is fully stuck shut so you can't, check the 'water' (electrolyte) levels in each of the 6 cells and add as required to get to correct level((s) (usually end cell if any), at the same time have look at the plates inside each cell to see the condition.  Then fully charge with an appropriate charger maintainer, the lower amperage the better 2-amps or lower would be great, might take many hours or a couple of days (or bit more) to get it to full on the charger or you might see no increase after a certain time and it never gets to full so you might as well stop there.  Obvious take all the precautions mentioned when dealing with the battery.  A battery that is not much good for a 2021 car could last a very long time on a 2014 car (less so if a diesel in a cold place like perhaps Poland) but if you do occasional FULL recharges with an appropriate battery charger when required it will last even longer (same for new battery on 2021 car).  You may be well aware of battery drain in winter but there is more self-drain of the battery in warm weather, battery likes say ambient of 20c and doubles its self-discharge at 30c (and doubles again at 40c).

 

Plenty of battery and battery charging information about from battery manufacturers, and of course some misinformation on the internet.

 

Forget your car for a while and lets us know how you get on a bit later, good luck.

 

So far so good, no battery level warnings in Scala. 

On 30/10/2024 at 11:15, radoszczak said:

So far so good, no battery level warnings in Scala. 

After month it is allright. So the problem was poor battery. I'm wondering could I use this 3 yo battery in another car. I've charged it few times with electronic charger, and it show 90-95 percent of charge after 8-10 h of charging. 

Voltage after two weeks is 12V, is it not to low ? Battery is disconnected from any load, I keep it in basement in temp. aprox. 10-15 *C.  

8-10 hours of charging may not have been enough but it depends at what amperage the recharge was made at.  The general rule is very low and very slow is better, 2-amps or less charger.

 

You do need to have checked this battery before (and after) charging for all 6 cells having the correct level of 'water' (electrolyte) in them and that the plates were not buckled or furred up.

 

12v is a low state of charge for a battery out of a car and IF the battery was fully charged properly to even say 90% to drop to 12v after just two weeks suggests the battery wouldn't probably perform well in another car (unless it's a very old petrol manual car with none or little computer stuff on it and associated electronics and it is to be driven very often and regularly on reasonable length journeys so that not too much electric is used and the alternator can keep topping the battery up).  You could perhaps use the battery in non-car use in your basement or shed, run a radio or lighting and recharge as required.  Otherwise recycle for a small payment, about £8 from a "scrappy" in England.

 

From our very, very, dear friends, VW, blessed their cotton socks, we do luv them. -

 

Charge level             No-load          voltage

1.28 g/cm3                 100%              12.7 V

1.21 g/cm3                 60%                12.3 V

1.18 g/cm3                 40%                12.1 V

1.10 g/cm3                 0%                  11.7 V

 

10 hours ago, radoszczak said:

After month it is allright. So the problem was poor battery. I'm wondering could I use this 3 yo battery in another car. I've charged it few times with electronic charger, and it show 90-95 percent of charge after 8-10 h of charging. 

Voltage after two weeks is 12V, is it not to low ? Battery is disconnected from any load, I keep it in basement in temp. aprox. 10-15 *C.  

 

Buy an electronic battery load tester, if you input the correct AH rating and the testing regime used for the result it will give you a good idea of the remaining life expressed as a percentage, a percentage of what nobody knows 😁 it will automatically compensate for cell voltage.

 

My experience of a decade with said tester is that if a vehicle is not a reluctant starter a battery with supposed  40% remaining life will crank it and start it in all 4 seasons without it feeling like its about to expire, assuming the battery is the correct size for the vehicle.

 

What will be noticeable is the lack of autonomy (dont know th word in English) when the vehicle is not in regular use.

 

I have a couple of older batteries for jump starting, my tipping trailer hydraulic pump etc, one (Bosch) has always had a low off charge cell voltage from new , its around the 12v of yours now yet that is the one with the most life and cranking power, I was concerned about it from day 1 yet it turns out to be the best and I probably did not even need to replace it.

3 hours ago, nta16 said:

The general rule is very low and very slow is better, 2-amps or less charger.

 

Your general rule which you keep repeating yet 99.9% of the charge cycles of every battery on every vehicle across the planet is the complete opposite of that.

 

No problem with a 2 amp charger and no need to buy a bigger one which will spend most of its time at a low charge rate anyway but the day you have a flat battery and want to quickly recharge to put just enough juice in to start the vehicle and male your journey a more powerful charger is appreciated.

Mine charger starrs with 3,5amps, and ends with 1,2amps.

@radoszczak your battery for whatever reason(s) was put into a poor state of charge and health and you wanted to "bench" recharge it for use on another car so 3.5 was better than say 5 or 8 amps but not as good as 2-amps or a bit less, that is my personal experience from decades of helping out my neighbour's with their various batteries over decades, and it is backed up by what I've read, you can check these things out for yourself rather than take my word for it.  I've recharged batteries in lower, and much lower, states of health and charge (and older) than you have mentioned and not had the drop you mention from a battery just sitting there with self-discharge only so I'd not trust yours with much load or use in a car in a cold country.

 

If you look at the battery manufacturer's specification sheet you may find 4-amps stated for normal charging, VW on car is 0.1 of Ah but check with your 'Owner's Manual' for the car.

 

I use an inexpensive 4-amp "smart" (they are not smart) charger maintainer for my wife's 2015 Fabia but the battery is not allowed to go too low in charge.  Batteries have never required any attention other than very occasional routine maintenance checks on any other cars we have owned but this was and is the first 2015 car either of us has owned and the first VW product either of us has owned, with its (to me over) complicated computer programs and start stop (we did own four Škodas 30+ years ago).

 

Whether your Aliexpress button has caused any issues I would not have a clue but if your new battery's performance does not seem as good as it should I would monitor the effects of that button just in case, I would probably/possibly be wrong but that is what I would do you may not.

 

Edited 28 November, 20241 yr by nta16
typos

I charge my batteries very often, I gave the last one away after 7 years, but it was still fine

15 hours ago, nta16 said:

@radoszczak your battery for whatever reason(s) was put into a poor state of charge and health and you wanted to "bench" recharge it for use on another car so 3.5 was better than say 5 or 8 amps but not as good as 2-amps or a bit less, that is my personal experience from decades of helping out my neighbour's with their various batteries over decades, and it is backed up by what I've read, you can check these things out for yourself rather than take my word for it.  I've recharged batteries in lower, and much lower, states of health and charge (and older) than you have mentioned and not had the drop you mention from a battery just sitting there with self-discharge only so I'd not trust yours with much load or use in a car in a cold country.

 

If you look at the battery manufacturer's specification sheet you may find 4-amps stated for normal charging, VW on car is 0.1 of Ah but check with your 'Owner's Manual' for the car.

 

I use an inexpensive 4-amp "smart" (they are not smart) charger maintainer for my wife's 2015 Fabia but the battery is not allowed to go too low in charge.  Batteries have never required any attention other than very occasional routine maintenance checks on any other cars we have owned but this was and is the first 2015 car either of us has owned and the first VW product either of us has owned, with its (to me over) complicated computer programs and start stop (we did own four Škodas 30+ years ago).

 

Whether your Aliexpress button has caused any issues I would not have a clue but if your new battery's performance does not seem as good as it should I would monitor the effects of that button just in case, I would probably/possibly be wrong but that is what I would do you may not.

 

Thank you for your opinion and help. In case of 'button s/s cable' it was added to the car after first battery problems. We have bought car from secound hand in may this year. Baterry seems to be in bad contidion. For now It is about a month when my wife is driving with new bateery and car show no low battery status so I forgot about this issue. 

On 27/11/2024 at 14:11, nta16 said:

8-10 hours of charging may not have been enough but it depends at what amperage the recharge was made at.  The general rule is very low and very slow is better, 2-amps or less charger.

 

You do need to have checked this battery before (and after) charging for all 6 cells having the correct level of 'water' (electrolyte) in them and that the plates were not buckled or furred up.

 

12v is a low state of charge for a battery out of a car and IF the battery was fully charged properly to even say 90% to drop to 12v after just two weeks suggests the battery wouldn't probably perform well in another car (unless it's a very old petrol manual car with none or little computer stuff on it and associated electronics and it is to be driven very often and regularly on reasonable length journeys so that not too much electric is used and the alternator can keep topping the battery up).  You could perhaps use the battery in non-car use in your basement or shed, run a radio or lighting and recharge as required.  Otherwise recycle for a small payment, about £8 from a "scrappy" in England.

 

From our very, very, dear friends, VW, blessed their cotton socks, we do luv them. -

 

Charge level             No-load          voltage

1.28 g/cm3                 100%              12.7 V

1.21 g/cm3                 60%                12.3 V

1.18 g/cm3                 40%                12.1 V

1.10 g/cm3                 0%                  11.7 V

 

If that battery was near to fully charged and voltage has dropped to less than 40% in two weeks on open circuit, it is probably bad. It may be possible to recover, but almost certainly beyond it.

Try using a charger with the Recond function.
My CTEK MXS 5.0 has such a function