Advice saught - Return to work after stress

[gadgetman]

Follow on from http://www.briskoda.net/forums/off-topic-chit-chat/signed-off-work-stress/79129/?highlight=stress

As it happens I ended up 4 weeks off through the doc (signed off 2 weeks initially, then another 2). When phoning up the boss to say I'd be off for another 2 weeks, he was arsy (doc did it, not me!). He also advised my wages were on 1/2 pay due to company sickness policy.

During this time had scans on my neck and cardeologist tests (24hr monitor, echo, running and resting ECG). Even before the results arrived to day everything kept saying stress.

Returned to work Tues. I wasn't ready, but need to pay bills. That's what I told doc on Thurs last week when getting x-ray results, and he asked. He didn't pursue, but I get the impression he didn't think I was ready either.

So tues morning I advise Manager I'll be in the office for my return to work interview. He says not around til tues. "What should I do I ask" What do you want me to do I get back. So I say "I guess I'm doing the calls I've been texted?" Yup I'll see you tomorrow (wed) at 9am.

So wed am. And after doing practically nothing for 4 weeks, driving around and doing physical activity was exhausting. I felt like tripe, and didn't leave home til 9am. Anxious, generally like I did 4 weeks ago. Arrive at 9.45, and people are talking to me asking how I am. It's 10.10 before I track down manager for interview.

He asks How I am, and I'm honest in that I am back at work due to money, and am still the same. I need assistance in returning to work. When asked if anything at work was stressing me IMO, I told them about the project I was seconded to. He removes me from the project immediately. He's been in the same situation in the past, and the best way is to get into a routine and jump right back on the bike he says.

"Yes but I feel I need gentle introduction and build up to my normal duties". Can't have you working 1 job and home in the afternoon. Off to Oxford (from Wycombe you go, St albans on the way back and enfield, then home to Staines.

WTF?

So today I do a job and feel like rubbish. I get to the second, and after it's done I ring the boss and tell him how I feel and that I feel I am struggling. He sends me home.

I was going to write a friendly email just outlining that I want to work with him to integrate back into work normally, but feel I cannot cope with the pace so far. I'm unsure of how to phrase it.

I hear from a colleague tonight a letter has ben sent to me of unknown content from my manager. I'm now really worried what it says, and whether to still write an email and if I do what to write!

Please help.

[thomj42]

health is the most important thing. full stop. if you are stressing about what the manager will do next, it'll only make you worse. get well, then get back to work.

[gadgetman]

health is the most important thing. full stop. if you are stressing about what the manager will do next, it'll only make you worse. get well, then get back to work.

I am at work. Doing the best I can and what I feel i'm capable of regardless. My boss and I aren't qualified to make that call, so unless I go back to the doc and he stipulates what he thinks I'm capable of, it's surely down to what feels right?

Start slow, then have daily goals would be my thoughts, increasing the load gradually, yet so we can both reach near normal again.

Decided to write an email, yet really don't know how to phrase things. I don't want to be this way, and seek his help to return me to normal. BUT he needs to understand that whilst he found getting on with it helped, for me I'm struggling. I feel I need to get this to him before his letter arrives.

I don't want to be aggressive at all until he plays an aggresive hand, in which case I've no doubt I'll need 'work related' documented by the doc ready for a nasty split.

I don't want that at all. I just need help, and feel I have to perform regardless. I know this wont help me at all but what can I do?

I've cried, yes really cried in my wifes arms every night I've returned from work this week. The counciling service The doc gave me details for on the 1st of May has such a long list for assesment, that my appt isn't until 14th June!

the threat of his letter is setting me back. Not sure if the colleague told me as a heads up, or was told to call me 'should you speak to him to see how he is, wink wink'

Just feel they're trying to push me the final bit over the edge so I walk rather then get pushed.

[cjb]

health is the most important thing. full stop. if you are stressing about what the manager will do next, it'll only make you worse. get well, then get back to work.

Seconded. SWMBO has had a nasty experience: she tried to go back part time, but they just put the pressure back on. It turned nasty after we had a home visit form her boss and a HR person, and i told them what i thought. She has since found another job. Get yourself well before anything else. Mnay people will not understand, unfortunately. There *is* light at the end of the tunnel, but you need to be well before you can go there.

Don't panic at what the contents of this letter might be. Forget about it until you know, and then ask again: You don't know what they will say.

[gadgetman]

Thanks guys.

Still feel an email is a good idea. If anyone has any ideas for content, I'm around. I'd like the email to arrive before the letter does, and if put right, and my hunch is correct, a bit of guilt on the managers part.

I still think he thinks it's all a put on and me playing. TBH I would have been one of those people about anyone with stress. Now I know what it's like, I feel really really bad about things I said about someone a few years back.

[cjb]

Don't rush into anything. I'd wait for the letter. It might be they will be reasonable and realise that 1st day was too much.

I wouldn't call what you got was a reasonable return to work. Your employer has a 'duty of care' to you. Are you in a trade union? Probably not, these days.

What does your wife think? She will know you better than any of us can guess from a web forum.

[BigW]

What is it you do for a living Gadgetman?

[gadgetman]

She's worried for me, and feels powerless. She wants to take it away for me with a magic wand but know she can't.

No, no union. After the attitude of someone I once thought of as a friend, and who I'd have thought would be understanding (esp after he said he'd been through the same years ago). Sadly I'm not getting that impression at all.

I though putting something in writting, nicely and just emphasising what was discussed at my return to work meeting, yet not documented in anyway might be benificial.

[gadgetman]

What is it you do for a living Gadgetman?

Field engineer for a vending firm. So it's physical and mental (thinking + call centre chasing jobs). 4 weeks out, I'm really feeling shell shocked.

was made redundant twice, each was a few months out of work yet I found returning easy. this however's hit me for 6, and I'm man enough to admit I've cried quite a lot. Been withdrawn, lashed out over silly things at the Mrs, and generally been more emotional than a pregnant woman!

[WW_VRS]

Stress can be caused by many things, in your case it was work.

Sometimes it's best to get out of the situation, hard to say if this is right for you without knowing yourself or your job.

Look at the options you have available to you, getting made redundant is not a problem from a 'getting a new job' perspective, but when it happened to me it was a bit of a shock for sure.

I went through a phase where I was totally stressed out and could not function properly at my job, I forced myself through one week by sheer will power, but I told my HR department and line manager(s) why I went through the stress, and they accepted that unlike usual, I cut back to what I felt I could cope with. I could barely cope with that, but the focus on those hours helped. Then I had a week off completely where I burried myself in DIY. Different kind of thing from my normal job, and it was quite satisfying.

If you're able to have a change of scenery it might be worth it. Remember though, you're only human and tbh getting your emotions out of your system is a healthy thing to do. All the best

[gadgetman]

Thought I'd update.

I wrote the email, and waited and waited for a reply which I got last Friday. Now my boss didn't take what I'd call a pro-active responsibility or even duty of care over me.

---------,

As you know I have found returning to work this week harder than I had envisaged. As discussed with you at my return to work interview on Wednesday, my first day back on Tuesday I found especially difficult having had no routine nor physical and mental activities comparable to work during my certified absence over the last few weeks.

Until this, I have never been certified absent from employment, and have found this has hit me hard having never experienced anything like this before. Coupled with the referrals for further tests to rule out anything serious with my health, has meant the last few weeks have certainly not been easy for me. Thankfully the results thus far seem to rule out serious/chronic medical issues, which is one comfort at this time – the latest being results of some of the tests conducted by the Cardeolist whose letter awaited me upon my return home today.

I have strived to give myself goals this week to make the transition back to work easier for me, taking and focusing on each task at a time. I have found this has some benefit to me to make it through each part of the day. This as discussed Wednesday, was also a reason that has put back my re-location from Staines to Northampton (as previously agreed) as my home was removed from the market after talks with my wife to allow me to focus on my health – this has now been put back on the market as of 30th May.

This has also been my attitude having last smoked when taken ill, as well as taking up activities to relax and improve my well being through self-help whilst awaiting the counseling sessions arranged by my doctor – which as mentioned Wednesday will start 14th June due to long waiting lists.

However, today as I advised you, I felt as though I was struggling, and finding today especially difficult. This was not an admission I took lightly, and see this as being honest with you rather than any sign of weakness. This week I feel that maybe I have carried out more, on a daily basis, than my current health ability will allow me at this time. I know, with your help I can overcome this to full fitness once again.

I am keen to work with you & [employers name] (in partnership with a health professional if deemed appropriate) to quickly identify my current capabilities, and work with you to create a personalized, and suitably progressive return to work at a rate which builds upon my identified abilities through means of achievable goals. I am also keen to fully re-integrate into the field engineering, and company team once again and work to help achieve the goals and visions for the future.

I look forward to hearing your thoughts on assisting me achieve this.

Regards,

In fact, as 2 members of staff were on hols, I was basically put right back to work as normal, with only a peace meal (IMO) phone call at the end of the day to see how I'd been. His attitude sucked when I told him the turth, and not once did he say "OK, tyomorrow we'll take it a bit easier". In fact he gets an SMS when ever I get a job, and send an ETA. Thurs eve I sent an ETA of 6pm, and that day not a phone call at all. No "Dont worry as it's 1.5 hours to get home" or "I don't want you over doing it and making yourself ill again" nothing.

Friday I had to come home after only one job, as I couldnt stay awake and felt rough again. It was later on that night I got the email of a letter, yet strangely still nothing by post on headed paper as advised.

Thank you for your email dated 1st June 2007 outlining the difficulties you feel you are facing in your return to work.

I understand that you are suffering from an illness aggravated by stress and as discussed in our meeting on Wednesday 30th May 2007 we have agreed to remove you from the ------------------ project in order to help your transition back to work.

I acknowledge that you will be receiving counselling from 14th June 2007 to help you deal with your problems and that you will also be receiving treatment from a Chiropractor to resolve your back problems.

It is your responsibility to continue your treatment, to make the necessary lifestyle changes as advised by healthcare professionals and to update me with your progress weekly. As agreed I am calling you every day to monitor your progress and to support you wherever I can.

The company will endeavour to help you return to work gradually and have set the following weekly goals over the next four weeks commencing Monday 11th June 2007:

Week commencing Hours to be worked

11th June 2007 30hrs per week

18th June 2007 33hrs per week

25th June 2007 35 hrs per week

2nd July 2007 37.5 hrs per week

plus weekend cover.

As you can understand you are an important member of our team and your absence affects the rest of the team. If you feel you are unable to meet these goals within the outlined four weeks we will be required to meet to discuss your position within the company.

Yours sincerely,

The weekend I was on call, yet was so rough my wife took me to the hospital as I was so weak. Bloods, and a CT scan (the docs scared the life out of the Mrs as to their initial thoughts), yet after a few hours released and told by the doc TAKE IT EASIER! Tell boss, boss says not to work the weekend.

Mon (yesterday) still rough so get appt with doctors, and get signed off yet again for a week. The doc I saw took a real interest, saying I can speak to him daily until my counciling starts on thurs (long waiting list of nearly 2 months!) and to get my employer to writ to him so he can tell them whats what (poilitely work with them to break me back in more gently).

As discussed earlier by phone, the doctor seen today (due to absence of my registered GP Dr ---------) is happy to discuss with you his thoughts on my capabilities and work with both yourself and myself to assist me to return to health as quickly and effectively as possible. As such he has offered his full support this week both before and after my referred counseling session.

His details for you to contact him are as follows:

[Dr details & Address]

Once again I would like to express my sincere thanks for your support during this time.

Regards,

I know these arent his words, and must be from some HR company he's sought help from. Some people have said this is too harsh, is likely to add to my stress, and potentially falls under constructive dismissal.

I'm really at my witts end. Not only can I no longer take feeling this way, but am financially scared (as wages cut for sickness as per policy) and also my job based on their letter, attitudes and me not being well - something I cant help, yet feel they blame me for.

All this is really getting me down, and making it really hard to get out of this hole I find myself in. If i wasnt stronger, I fear I might not be posting this right now. But my streagth is fast running out - hopefully the councilling will help reverse this.

If you're still reading this, thanks for listening to my ramblings.

[sms]

Basically (after being there myself with depression brought on by stress), they are meant to help you get back into things carefully, this is after a full medical to check you are fit enough to return to work. They are also to watch your workload and make sure you are coping. However if they dont you can quit on the grounds of constructive dismissal and go to tribunal. The problem with stress and depression is its not a case of a simple blood test, most of its in the head i.e. mind (not made up) and they have to prove you are either fit or unfit which is basically impossible, only you know if you are fit enough to cope with what you are/were doing.

I would suggest going to a citizen advice bureau or contact a union like amicus (google unions) and join one and get advice.

Last of all keep a diary and all corresspondence between you and your boss!!!

[gadgetman]

Thanks SMStext.

I haven't really kept good details so far, but I will keep everything from now on.

Due to go back next week as latest sick note expires. Really unsure whether I need the docs to approve me going back, or I simply go back, and once again lay everything on the table at my return to work interview.

[cjb]

quit on the grounds of constructive dismissal and go to tribunal.

This was a possibility for swmbo, and she sought legal advice. The problem is, that in itself is a *very* stressful experience. I'd recommend considering a visit to a solicitor conversant with employment law, if it's not too expensive. Hers gave excellent advice and is far more qualified.

In the end she played out as much sick pay as possible, I thrashed her company car for my daily commute for a while, then she found another job.

Your employer does have a duty of care, but IME they don't carry it out very well.

Your upset/lashing out etc is understandable. Depression is an illness but often not recognised.

My personal advice is to give your employer every chance to try to act responsibly, keep all correspondence (hard copies), but expect them to be sh!t. Be very careful to appear reasonable to any request they have.

Oh, and to repeat:

Get yourself well. That is the important thing.

[gadgetman]

Thanks everyone.

I guess what is getting me more and more is that I feel, rightly or wrongly, that i'me being seen as a lazy c*** who's found a get out of work and is milking it. I can certainly think of better ways of spending my time.

My quandry now is do I attempt a second return, or simply go back to the docs and get them to make the call?

Either way, I'll be very firm with my employers regarding needing their help, and getting a serious commitment from them as to how they are doing it, broken down into actions day by day.

I think a trip to the CAB is in order too, just so I'm aware of my rights on what I should be expecting them to do for me - as TBH I'm not tollay sure if I'm asking enough or too much!

Also found out the doc I saw, and who specifically asked me to get them to write to him is now on leave for holiday. I beleive only 1 week, but surely this throws a spanner in the works from my side if I end up at work on Monday?

I think i'm gonna go for a nice relaxing walk this afternoon and try to forget everything for 30 mins of so - I think I need it before I go nuts!!!!!

[sms]

the doctor is the only one out of you, him and your boss who has the medical expertise to diagnose if you are well enough to work, you to will know if you are yourself and can work. your boss (i doubt) has no medical qualifications otherwise he would be a doctor and not a company boss.

[gadgetman]

Well return to work would be Mon. But this time I've made appt for 9am monday, and will ensure the doc A) makes that call, and dictates to me (if passed fit for work) how HE says I should do it.

Last time I simply went back because I had to, rather than was ready, got worked more than capable, and now am off yet again as a result. This will be brought up at the return to work interview, oh yes it will!