Ok peeps, an obscure question or two here.

I am looking to repair or replace my currently blown domestic power amplifier. I have seen on the web some Chinese made interesting looking gear. Done some web searching, but cannot find much about this gear in forums.

Product under consideration are made by companies called:

Bada

Cayin

Dussun

Meixing MingDa (particularly interesting these ones - MC368-B-90 and MC845C monoblocks)

Opera (for a new phone stage)

Shanling (have heard of them in UK press occasionally)

Distributor / supplier is here:

ORNEC - Home

Looks like a lot of hardware for the money and the Chinese are no slouches when it comes to building things to a spec rather than a price.

Anyone know what Chinese domestic electricity supply is? If mains transformer is swapped out, that will put a downer on things.

Knowledge, experience, comment or opinion all greatly received and absorbed.

Chris

I never use (knowingly) Chinese designed Audio gear, but it does sound quite interesting. If you do go down this route, you must post up your results.

I will be sure to if it is the way I go. Web rumour has it that some USA high end shops sell some of these things re badged and substantially re priced. I see one London supplier selling Shanling at a premium.

Chris

Chinese mains is 240ish volts same as UK. Well all my stuff worked there with no changes and that included hifi stuff.

Confirmed here. Mains power systems - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Can't help with your other query I'm afraid as it is 15 years since I worked there.

Surely, Chris, you'll be going out on a limb for stuff you've never heard and that you want to live with and that will last you years ?

:thumbdwn:

That brings up the warranty question as well I guess. Where would the goods be returned to in event of a failure? I don’t expect it to be China but they may only have one small centre in the UK. Mind you, one of my brand new Epos M22s have a loose binding post (not impressed for the price) and I didn’t want to return them as I will be without a speaker for a few weeks no doubt and they are a British Speaker. So you may be no worse off.

Found this little bit of discussion about one of the manufacturers on a forum. Don’t know if it shows of any warrant problems or not

Chinese mains is 240ish volts same as UK. Well all my stuff worked there with no changes and that included hifi stuff.

Confirmed here. Mains power systems - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Can't help with your other query I'm afraid as it is 15 years since I worked there.

Hong Kong and the new territories, and I'm assuming the rest of China, use the UK 240 volts and even use the same 3 pin plugs, I lived in HK for a while a few years back.

Doing some more research on tinterweb about the Meixing MingDa products. Firstly, I have found two UK suppliers who drop ship direct from HK or China. The cheapest supplier offers DOA warranty only, the fractionally more expensive one offers 12 month warranty with a UK agent / service engineer.

Reviews are scant but available. I did pick up on that thread re reliability and I may need to pull the mains voltage down a bit. Hi Fi World (A magazine I used to take and who are possibly the best on valve gear as some of their editorial team design commercial amps) fell in love with one of the Ming Da valve preamps.

All other reviews around the web are positive for the various products.

Mains voltage is 220V in Chine, 230 here nowdays. However, the voltage here can go up 10%, so may put a step down conditioning transformer in line to make it 220V nominal.

As for taking a flyer, it is a step into the unknown. I have always extensively listened to hi-fi before buying. However, the type construction and specs of the amplifiers available are so far below the prices we would pay here that I feel it worth the risk. I can always Ebay them out if I don't like the sound.

I have always wanted a good valve amplifier. When I made my current set of speakers, the design was made to be easy to drive for low feedback or single ended amps as I knew that is where I wanted to end up. They are 92dB/W sensitive and have an almost flat impedance curve. Now I have to make a few decisions. Do I go for a switchable pentode / triode mode 50W / 35W push pull design, or maybe a pair of single ended 35W monoblocks? Or a single ended integrated on the big old 805 or 845 valves? With the prices available, I can take a wide pick from what is on offer at a price not too far above what it will cost to refurb my class A solid state job.

Slightly risky but oh so tempting.

Chris

Not sure if you were determined to go down the valve route - I had or rather my father had a real nice valve amp but the cost of replacing valves and the electricity bill meant moving away...

If you want to be controversial, have a look at Hypex Electronics B.V.

I kinda know what you mean by tempting. There is something s exciting about sitting down and listening to a new system in your new house, especially one that excels. Over the years I have listened to equipment that the average Audiophile can only dream of and yet having bought my first ever proper speakers ie high build quality/components (and even then they are not active speakers/amps) I was so excited I have spent every free moment with them singing away. I can only say, it’s probably not big or clever to buy unknown far East electronics with possibly no real back-up, but what the hell, GO FOR IT! You know it makes sense......sort of.

Ok peeps, an obscure question or two here.

I am looking to repair or replace my currently blown domestic power amplifier. I have seen on the web some Chinese made interesting looking gear. Done some web searching, but cannot find much about this gear in forums.

Product under consideration are made by companies called:

Bada

Cayin

Dussun

Meixing MingDa (particularly interesting these ones - MC368-B-90 and MC845C monoblocks)

Opera (for a new phone stage)

Shanling (have heard of them in UK press occasionally)

Distributor / supplier is here:

ORNEC - Home

Looks like a lot of hardware for the money and the Chinese are no slouches when it comes to building things to a spec rather than a price.

Anyone know what Chinese domestic electricity supply is? If mains transformer is swapped out, that will put a downer on things.

Knowledge, experience, comment or opinion all greatly received and absorbed.

Chris

best thing , just buy a pair of Audiolab 8000 monoblocs.. problem solved . easy!

It is getting very tempting indeed. The choices I face are pretty easy ones in some respects. There are a few reviews by competent and known folks out there who rate the Miexing equipment very highly, so am unlikely to buy a complete pup. A 12 month warranty with a UK service shop is good also. I have other options:

Build a kit amp from a known and trusted supplier (World Audio Design spring to mind but at the price, they work out at more than I can buy one built and I am time poor).

Buy a decent solid state amp. Musical Fidelity have impressed me most, but I am looking at £1600 for the one I like the sound of.

Buy a used amp. None too keen on this.

Repair existing amp, but is it a highly customised item that has been running continuously since 1990, so whatever I replace, something else is close to going. It already eats some thing regularly due to case heat.

I am a big fan of the valve amplifier. A well implemented one will sound vibrant and detailed with no hint of harshness. This harshness is something that puts me off a lot of so called hi fi. Sit and listen to a chamber orchestra. Is there harshness? No. Why would I want it to sound harsh at home? So many mid to high end products will introduce that degree of harshness in an attempt to make you think you are getting detail. Of course a poorly implemented valve amp will have its own problems, harshness can be one of them.

Looking at the Meixing product range, I can have access to single ended monoblock amps of a decent power output. They may not make the claimed 40W, they may (the 805 valve can swing 125W) but at £700, there is huge potential. Another aspect of the choice is that these SE amps can sound a bit slow, but with very fast sounding CF driver speakers and front end, this should balance. I think if I go SE, I will go for the monoblocks as you need huge transformers for SE to work at any reasonable power. The MC805As I have my eye on weigh in at £700 and 42Kg a pair which should be enough iron to cope. Only downside is the 805 has a huge and bright heater so I may need to sit indoors with me shades on.

On the other hand, I can go to a cheaper option of a Class A push pull design amp. For around the £600 mark I can have a well reviewed 75W multi valve job, swithcble between triode and ultralinear mode, or a more conventional and smaller 50W job for between £420 and £520 depending on spec.

Any of these options has the potential to sound very good indeed. If implementation is good, none of them should be outclassed by anything ready built for under £2K. Reviews and forums alike all rate the Meixing amps very highly. Hi Fi World rated one of their preamps extremely highly. So although it is a risk, it is not an uncalculated one. It may also help that I live a few miles from probably the biggest valve supplier in the UK.

As for valve replacement, they are cheaper that a set of tyres for even the biggies and last a lot longer.

Chris

best thing , just buy a pair of Audiolab 8000 monoblocs.. problem solved . easy!

Hmmm...

I have auditioned them with similar speakers to mine and they were really in the mid league sound wise. They go very well with low efficiency speakers as they can work hard and lose much of the graininess in the upper midband. However, my speakers are sensitive by most standards and ruthlessly revealing, so the Audiolabs have no chance of cutting it. They simply do not work well with my speakers. I never really liked the Audiolab sound on my mates Proacs either thinking about it. It is just not to my taste.

I notice they are no longer tied in with Mclaren? Probably explains why they now cost a sensible amount for the performance.

What I am really after is a taste of the top end gear.

Chris

Out of interest, what would your source be? CD? Vinyl?

If I were closer, I'd invite you round to listen to my setup which is even more controversial than the Hypex stuff lol.

Out of interest, what would your source be? CD? Vinyl?

If I were closer, I'd invite you round to listen to my setup which is even more controversial than the Hypex stuff lol.

Both CD and Vinyl. Front end for vinyl is a bitsa made up from Rega and DNM bits with a modified RB300 tonearm.

CD front end is a Mission DAC fed by a top end Marantz transport.

Do tell more about your setup?

Chris

I decided to give the ilink a go It's a digital transport mechanism from compatible CD players which also contains clock signals and adaptive transmit rates, thereby reducing jitter considerably. SPDIF is really bad in that respect.

Also, I'm building up my collection of SACDs and the combo of ilink and the amp I have (Sony STR-DA7100ES) means I get the "direct stream digital" going straight into the amp and the digital amplification stage does the rest. The digital amplification technology is completely different and offers many advantages, and their latest incarnation IMHO is just awesome. Shame it's all being dropped now :(

My old man had a nice valve setup but changed it for transistor stuff a few years ago. Now he has a Plinius pre / power amp setup and separate phono pre-amp.

Lots of reading and research going on this week. More information about the companies products generally is showing a well regarded company with good product. It would seem that the valves that ship are "adequate" and give a performance way beyond anything at the price from the mainstream suppliers, but can be upgraded to really push into the high end. Other bits seem to be a decent mixture of mid to high end industry standard capacitors, resistors and potentiometers. All chassis are hard point to point wired.

Products that I think will be the ones:

Power amps:

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£699 per pair shipped with 12 month UK serviced warranty.

Pre amp trying to decide:

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£389 shipped with 12 month UK serviced warranty.

or

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£259 shipped with 12 month UK serviced warranty.

and

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£299 shipped with 12 month UK serviced warranty.

Of course everything will be subject to import duty and VAT as well.

It is all very tempting stuff indeed.

The power amps should drive my speakers with ease and go pretty loud if I want them to. Preamps, not fully decided. May even go valve pre MC7R with solid state passive component phono stage.

Decisions decisions.

Chris

Hmmm, if you go for it, 10/10 for taking the punt. Its high risk, but as you rightly state, could be an excellent route into having a flavour of genuinely high end kit.

I like the Audiolabs running some original AE1s... but its a completely different ball game to the kit Chris is on about here.

The best thing with the valve amps, is you no longer need a radiator in the room!!

Speaking with a senior Sound Supervisor recently, the subject of Chinese Audio gear came up. It transpired that he was going to set up a company with a mate to import the stuff as he was so impressed with it in general. He had previously been working in China and had a chance to audition the stuff. The idea only fell through as the Chinese supplier didn’t seem to be based on Planet Earth (he tried e-mailing in English and Chinese-correct variant and not translated by Google-but to of no avail)