Hi to All

The Fabia vRS has been a fantastic driving school car, without a doubt the best I could have chosen at the time (October 2005). It has been mostly reliable, recently needing a new CHG and Clutch / DFM, but that is it for the 112,000 miles it has so far covered. Skoda UK agreed to cover the cost of a new clutch (with labour) as the existing one was not worn out but dragging (the previous one was too, hence this one still in warranty) and also agreed to cover half the cost of the head gasket replacement as it was considered premature even though not within warranty.

The car is now running beautifully and I am pleased to have it back, but I need to start thinking about it's replacement.

Thus far, a few ideas are floating around my head, mostly about how to run something more fuel efficient than the vRS:

Staying with Skoda, the Fabia Sport has very comfortable seats and good leg room. The 1.9 is too front heavy IMO and the ride makes me queasy. I reckon the 1.4 diesel would be the pick for me. Good fuel economy, good engine character, low insurance. On the downside, this is not the vRS, so residuals may be nowhere near as good as my current car. 2 Year unlimited mileage warranty still applies?

Citroen C2 VTS diesel. Nippy and cheap to buy, good fuel economy, nippy and fun to drive. Image wise, better than the Fabia (this is important in a school car). On the downside, will it be typically French in reliability terms? A 2 year unlimited miles warranty is good, but Citroen residuals are notoriously poor.

Fiat. Bravo 1.6 16v Diesel looks good on paper and some cracking deals available, but very poor rear visibility. Grande Punto Sporting looks good, but too heavy on fuel in the current climate, leaving the underpowered small diesels. Why don't Fiat do the 1.6 16v eco diesel in a Punto shell? 500 diesel sport, I really like, but looks may put off the lads. A good blend of economy and purchase price. 2 year unlimited miles warranties. Fiat residuals are poor. JD power surveh has the cars near the bottom in reliablity and the dealers down the bottom in service. This rings true. I was in a Fiat showroom and the sales guy came across as disinterested.

Mini Cooper D. This is the one that most gets my interest at the moment. Pretty much top of the pile in fuel economy at the moment, it should be fun to drive, has a 3 year unlimited miles warranty and reasonable performance. Image is good for commercial purposes. Residuals will be strong. On the downside, it is horrendously expensive to buy if you want decent seats and air con (which I do). No deals available at all, may be just outside my budget.

From the leftfield, the Mitsubishi Colt Diesel. 3 Year unlimited miles warranty. No idea what it is like to drive, but prices OK. Residuals could be poor and image an unknown.

Seat Ibiza could be worth a look, particularly could get a good deal with the new one on its way.

I am stuck for any other choices. Many manufacturers do a 60,000 mile warranty, or 1 1/2 years for me, so no good. There are the likes of Hyundai and Kia, but have read poor things about Kia dealers and reliability. Know guys teaching in Hyundai and they reckon the cars are OK once you iron out all the problems.

So any comments on the above? Any other ideas?

Chris

My niece is learning in a Cooper D (with the stop start engine). Hates it.

She finds the engine cutting out at lights very disconcerting.

Diesel Swift?

Kia Pro_C'eed 2.0l?

Panda 100HP?

Mazda 2 Sport?

Swift Sport?

Basically the list I was looking at

My niece is learning in a Cooper D (with the stop start engine). Hates it.

She finds the engine cutting out at lights very disconcerting.

Diesel Swift?

The Stop start can be disabled at the flick of a switch if the pupil does not like it.

The swift would be on my list, but the 60,000 mile warranty and high price if you want aircon keep it off the list.

Kia have done really badly in the JD power survey. The 2.0 Litre diesel could be OK, but I need to trim my fuel costs. Residuals will be non existent and the Ceed is not cheap in overall ownership.

The Panda 100hp / Mazda 2 and Swift Sport are all good ideas but, Panda: Fuel economy and looks, Mazda 2: 60,000 mile warranty, Swift Sport: Fuel consumption and the need to run only super unleaded, plus limited warranty time.

Petrol cars, especially smaller engine ones, are generally less able to take the mileage, so it has to be an oil burner.

Chris

I was realy only suggesting the Kia because it was about the only thing I could think of that was about the right sort of size and has similar performance to a Furbie vRS.

SWMBO had a Getz when I had my vRS - I wish I'd bought one too! It was without doubt a better engineered vehicle. The materials were not as good quality, but the build and reliability made up for it.

The 7 year unlimited mileage warranty isn't losing them money - ever wonder why that could be

The Bravo is coming with 5 year warranty and a grand of fuel - but I suspect the warranty will get used

Yaris diesel with remap ?

SWMBO had a Getz when I had my vRS - I wish I'd bought one too! It was without doubt a better engineered vehicle. The materials were not as good quality, but the build and reliability made up for it.

The 7 year unlimited mileage warranty isn't losing them money - ever wonder why that could be

The Bravo is coming with 5 year warranty and a grand of fuel - but I suspect the warranty will get used

I think the Hyundai is 5 year unlimited mileage, which is very good. I will try a Getz out when I go test driving next month.

The Bravo is actually a 3 year unlimited miles / + 2 year dealer /60,000 miles warranty, so 3 years for me. It is a really nice car from what I have seen, but the rear visibility is really very poor for someone learning IMO.

The vRS has been a great car (still is, but I want shot before it's value drops to nowt), and although I would like similar performance again, fuel consumption is king. Currently spending £7000 per year on diesel, need to get that down.

Chris

Yaris diesel with remap ?

Yaris would be nice, but 60,000 mile warranty goes against it. Can get pretty good deals on them as instructors mind. Relative costs and data that I have so far:

http://www.cbuckle.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/Carcomp.htm

Chris

the citroen looks good on paper, I had three citroens in a row, and all needed new gearboxes in 40k.... so did the vRS for that matter! but you could take a chance, everything else was reliable on them.....

the 1.6 16v eco diesel will be in the punto soon, its a new engine, so its gone to the bravo first... and you noted the two year unlimited mileage, be aware the bravo comes with a 5 YEAR unlimited miles warrenty and you note the JD power survey, but mine has been more reliable than the skoda, but then I have a good local dealer, one of the reasons I left skoda was the poor dealers near me, and very very bad customer service..... how you've managed to get all the stuff done to your car I've no idea, skoda wouldn't entertain half that stuff for me!

note: I believe its 5 year unlimited miles... thats the ad I saw... i could be wrong reading one of the posters above...

mini looks very good, but come on , you're an instructor, how many instructors have you talked to who've owned one?! they break down right left and centre..... clutches at about 20k and BMW wont replace them under warrenty ect ect how many mini's were bought by instructors when they first came out, and how many instructors have them now?! only one near me, and he recently sold his for a suzuki swift, as he was sick of it breaking down.....

I like the swift.... nearly bought the sport, but they wouldn't give me a good deal, you may be able to wrangle a nice discount if you can find one to fit your economy criteria.....

the hyundi getz... now we at globe (the driving school I'm with) have 11 cars, i have the GPS one has a swift, one has a clio... all the others are getz's... i've driven them pleanty doing the instructor training for our trainee's, and they are a good car, reliable, easy to drive ect ect ect, but do you want that? ssssooooooo boring, just an average city car..... if you want total economy of cost, go for it, i would get bored......

what about a fiat 500 1.3 multijet? £35 tax (free in 2009) 60+ fuel economy, and all the 'chique' you could want to pull people in.... not a very exciting drive though.... the mini is better, but then the cheapest mini is more expensive than the most expensive 500! (note: fiats driving school deal is currently 11.9% off the list price, and £500 cash for duels... if I remember correctly...)

another thought, if you go to motorpoint, you can get an imported grande punto sporting with the 1.3 m/jet in it! only 75 bhp, but you get the looks with the cheaper running costs, they don't make that variant in this country though... think they come from Ireland... circa £8k I think....

another idea... the volvo C30... a couple of instructers near me have thse.... dunno anything about them though, or the costs involved... they do look bloody cool though!

Hi Dave

The Grande Punto with the 1.6 Eco engine would be absolutely spot on. The warranty is only 2 years, but at a reasonable price, I could just renew then. I think the Bravo is out because the rear visibility. I have said it before, but try imagining you are holding your letterbox open at arms length and looking out and you get the idea. The warranty is definitely 3 years unlimited + 2 dealer / 60,000. I checked with the local dealer. The 500 diesel sport looks to be a good choice, but I have reservations about wether the lads would go off, it being a bit of a "girly" car in some peoples eyes.

The Citroen under consideration is the C2 VTS with the 1.6 diesel engine and 5 speed box. I have no idea how well they last.

The Mini is popular with instructors around here. There are a lot of folks using them but I have only spoken to 2. Both reckon they have been good, but one has only had her car a couple of months. Would have to look into things like clutch wear and replacement cost.

The Getz, I know what you mean. Don't think I could do that.

There is a guy round here looking at a C30 for his next car. Only 60K warranty though.

My supplying Skoda dealer has been really very good indeed. It is because of this that another Skoda is near the top of my list of possibles. The dealer has helped me with various bits and pieces over the period I have had the car. The Fiat dealer I went into around here however, could barely be bothered to serve me when I was looking to buy a car. That does not bode well for after sales service. Luck of the draw I suppose.

Whatever I buy, I think it has to have the 2 year unlimited miles warranty as a minimum requirement. 3 is nice. This puts Toyota, Suzuki, Ford (I get huge discount from them on Fiestas) and Vauxhall out of the equation.

Still very interested in the C2 though. Which model did you have that spat it's gearbox out so quickly?

Chris

Alternatively you could keep a sh*gged out :P but repaired Fabby for a couple of years :P and it wouldn't owe you a terrible amount.

+ you might even enjoy driving it.

Yrs ago - Brother In Law spent relative fortune on Hillman Imp. Sold it soon after to someone at same workplace - the guy ran it for 3 yrs and other than changeing spark plugs and oil never spent a penny on it.

Alternatively you could keep a sh*gged out :P but repaired Fabby for a couple of years :P and it wouldn't owe you a terrible amount.

+ you might even enjoy driving it.

Yrs ago - Brother In Law spent relative fortune on Hillman Imp. Sold it soon after to someone at same workplace - the guy ran it for 3 yrs and other than changeing spark plugs and oil never spent a penny on it.

It has crossed my mind, but at the same time, the Fabby interior is starting to wear and I can save £2200 a year on juice by replacing it. I have seriously thought about keeping it longer, but from a cold hearted commercial point of view, it does not make sense to keep it.

The Getz, I know what you mean. Don't think I could do that.

Considered the Hyundai i10? Auto Express rated it as the best supermini, ahead of the Panda. 5year unlimited warranty, reliable and apparently good to drive...

Or get a second car for 'fun' with what you save?

Hi Dave

The Grande Punto with the 1.6 Eco engine would be absolutely spot on. The warranty is only 2 years, but at a reasonable price, I could just renew then. I think the Bravo is out because the rear visibility. I have said it before, but try imagining you are holding your letterbox open at arms length and looking out and you get the idea. The warranty is definitely 3 years unlimited + 2 dealer / 60,000. I checked with the local dealer. The 500 diesel sport looks to be a good choice, but I have reservations about wether the lads would go off, it being a bit of a "girly" car in some peoples eyes.

The Citroen under consideration is the C2 VTS with the 1.6 diesel engine and 5 speed box. I have no idea how well they last.

The Mini is popular with instructors around here. There are a lot of folks using them but I have only spoken to 2. Both reckon they have been good, but one has only had her car a couple of months. Would have to look into things like clutch wear and replacement cost.

The Getz, I know what you mean. Don't think I could do that.

There is a guy round here looking at a C30 for his next car. Only 60K warranty though.

My supplying Skoda dealer has been really very good indeed. It is because of this that another Skoda is near the top of my list of possibles. The dealer has helped me with various bits and pieces over the period I have had the car. The Fiat dealer I went into around here however, could barely be bothered to serve me when I was looking to buy a car. That does not bode well for after sales service. Luck of the draw I suppose.

Whatever I buy, I think it has to have the 2 year unlimited miles warranty as a minimum requirement. 3 is nice. This puts Toyota, Suzuki, Ford (I get huge discount from them on Fiestas) and Vauxhall out of the equation.

Still very interested in the C2 though. Which model did you have that spat it's gearbox out so quickly?

Chris

the ciroens I have had all had the same 5 speed box (mine were 1.6 petrols) and the same problems (bearing wear, different tones on neutral as you lift /press the clutch, then destruction if not attended to!) but the rest of the car was reliable, which is why I bought threee in a row.... until I found skoda.....

if you have a good dealer (and it seems you do) maybe you should go for a fabia II 1.4 diesel...... the dealer and after care service make it for me, my dealer really looks after me, so they will get my repeat custom.... I loved the vRS but my dealers (and I went all they way up to Scotland to try to find a good one,) were pants, so was the lack of warrenty work...

maybe the aftercare service should decide it for you?

let us know what happens ....

New Ford KA is ready! | Auto Express News | News | Auto Express

Initially, there will be a choice of 63bhp 1.2-litre and 100bhp 1.4-litre petrol engines, as well as a 1.3-litre Multijet diesel. The latter will be good for 75bhp and 145Nm of torque, while returning more than 50mpg.

New Ford KA is ready! | Auto Express News | News | Auto Express

Initially, there will be a choice of 63bhp 1.2-litre and 100bhp 1.4-litre petrol engines, as well as a 1.3-litre Multijet diesel. The latter will be good for 75bhp and 145Nm of torque, while returning more than 50mpg.

thats a good idea, not so girly as the 500, so may appeal to both sexes......

Thanks for the replies all. The car must be a diesel, so the i10 is out. The idea is to buy something that lasts either 2 or 3 years under warranty and is worth something when I sell it. Also important to me is that it is at least good to drive. I will check out the Getz. Test driving commences next month.

Someone suggested a BMW 1 series today. Might be a bit too heavy (in the wallet or in weight terms). Still cannot shake off my interest in the Bravo either, particularly as they are available at good prices from brokers. I just wonder how well my pupils would manage with rear visibility.

Chris

Chris, slow process but compare the "real costs" on Home - What Car? Helping you buy better for an idea of the running costs. Saves you working it out for yourself.

How does Real Cost work?

The starting point of Real Cost is the What Car Target Price' date=' which is a realistic discounted figure to aim for in the showroom.

Just how much will you get back when you sell the car on? That's where our Depreciation Index comes in, giving a predicted resale value for every car on sale. We take away the likely part-ex price of a car after three years and 36,000 miles from our Target Price.

Next we fill in the blanks. A year's road tax (Vehicle Excise Duty) is included in the purchase price of new cars, but there'll be two more tax discs to pay for before three years are up. We also include the cost of three years' insurance, based on a typical premium. Next, we add in the likely cost of servicing over three years. Finally, we add in the cost of fuel for 36,000 miles, based on the official combined figure.

The final total is the Real Cost of running each new car - and it's unique to What Car?. [/quote']

Off the wall choice? Prius!

Off the wall choice? Prius!

Poor economy and ropey to drive That ticks all the boxes...

Poor economy and ropey to drive That ticks all the boxes...

It has to be a manual gearbox, not auto dilithium crystal phase inversion drive, that incidentally is less efficient than my existing Fabia:D

Chris