Baffled by Felicia starter motor problem

[sir1960]

Our 1999 1.3 Felicia wouldn't start a couple of months ago. My son called the RAC and they diagnosed a starter motor failure. I replaced it with a ex-scrap unit and all was well for a few weeks. Then the same problem. Fitted a recon unit and no joy at all.

I have checked the solenoid and it fires on both the recon and scrapper units. The yellow Lucas connector cable reads 11.86V when the ignition is switched on so all seem well there. The starter motor turned for a while but now no joy at all. Vehicle works fine when bump started. Could it be a relay problem ? The battery and earth connections all check out as sound.

Lovely little car sat on drive not moving...any advice gratefully received.

Thanks.

[Call me Ishmael]

The battery could be on its way out. I'm no expert and it may be a long shot, but have you tried jump leads from another car?

[djaychela]

11.86 V isn't good for a battery. Best thing is to charge the battery overnight, and then start the car by whatever means and take it to somewhere that can run and alternator and battery test on it. That'll tell you what's what.

[rigsby]

I agree, the battery sounds as though it is on its last legs. The only other thing i can think of is a poor earth

[swedishskoda]

Does it happen now and then or every time? If now and then it could be the well-known felicia igniton barrel problem?

But at the same time I agree with previous posters that 11.86V is a bit low. Shouldn't prevent the starter from turning, though?

[TeflonTom]

it's not a relay, the power lead to the starter is direct from the battery via a large cable

is the solenoid clicking when you turn the key or is nothing happening at all?

[KenONeill]

Another vote for a sick battery I'm afraid. I'd expect the voltage across the terminals (engine not running) to be over 14v.

[sir1960]

Many thanks for the replys. I can confirm that the relay clicks when the ignition key is turned. I have checked the earth via a jump lead from the battery neg to the engine block and all seems okay, but no change in condition. I have checked the lights and I get a bright beam, suggesting that the battery may well be adequate, but I will check this out again as you suggest.

Thanks again.

[Richard Black]

Turn a light on - the inside light will do - and turn the key to try and start the engine. If it's the battery, the light will dim almost to extinction.

[djaychela]

Another vote for a sick battery I'm afraid. I'd expect the voltage across the terminals (engine not running) to be over 14v.

That's way too high. You'd see usually around 12.5-13.4v on a battery without the engine running and no load on it (usually lower than higher), and around 13.5-13.8 when it's running and charging.

OK, I think it's important to be clear with your terminology:

When you say "turn the ignition", do you mean to the "running" position, or the "cranking the engine" position when you hear the click?

Is the click a repeated sound, or just a single click?

And is it the relay (which you'd expect from inside the car, there are several in a Fel fusebox, one of which will turn when you turn it on (fuel pump)), or the solenoid when you crank the engine (the sound of this would be from the engine bay, and will be much louder).

Seriously, though, if you can get it started, getting it to someone with an all-in-one battery and alternator tester will remove a lot of messing about, and take just minutes.

[sir1960]

Update : Checked the battery with an all-in-one tester and a volt meter. Tester showed battery as good and meter read 12.1V. Interior light does not dim when ignition turned, and head lights shine brightly.

When I "turn the ignition" to the "running" position I hear a click from the relay cluster within the car. A single click, so I assume the fuel pump relay ? No click when key turned to the "cranking the engine" position. And no noise from the engine bay.

The starter motor solenoid does not fire when the ignition key is turned ; I checked the solenoid by removing the yellow wire, and fitting a temporary wire which I touched to the battery +ve. The solenoid fires every time. Even managed to start the car once after doing this.

Have bump started the car and she runs fine.

I wonder if there is a wire break between the ignition switch and the stater motor ? However I have measured 11.86V from the yellow wire when the ignition is turned to the "cranking the engine" position.

[TeflonTom]

more likely to be a broken iignition switch than a wire, they are well known for busting

[djaychela]

OK, if you touch the wire onto the solenoid terminal, if it fires every time, why doesn't the car start every time?

[richardsfavorit]

I agree with To - ignition barrel gets my vote. Try cleaning the key as well, and holding it in the position II for as bit longer and then it might start turning.

[BiGRUD]

My old Felicia wouldn't start once. I pulled each relay out one at a time and then replaced it. This must have cleaned a connection because it started every time after that. I had a leaky windscreen at the time so it may have had a bit of corrosion on one of the connections.

Worth a go...

[sir1960]

Sorted. Have fitted by pass starter switch as per thread and pictures posted by andyjw in 2007 !

http://briskoda.net/favorit-felicia-fun-forman/felicia-ignition-switch/89459/

Think it was an initial starter motor failure, followed by the seemingly classic ignition switch problem, judging by the threads on this site.

Fitting the switch was a doddle thanks to andyjw's photos. Have ensured that switch has adequate current rating.

Thanks to all...and a great site.