Today has been a bloody nightmare as far as driving is concerned. The roads I use to get to work had all been gritted regularly last week, so things were generally ok, but this morning none of the roads had been gritted. It took me 3 hours to get to work in the end, when it usually takes 45 minutes, and on the way I saw so many smashed up cars.

There was a long queue of cars driving very slowly, turned out two smashed up cars were blocking the road at the top of a hill so only one direction of traffic could move at a time. There were no police directing this, just people taking turns to get past. Whilst I was waiting I saw some stupid bitch driving walking speed going up the hill, she was in first gear and redlining the engine, when she inevitably found grip at the top of the hill she spun off the road.

Anyway, I eventually got to the smashed up cars, and waited my turn to go. I left a big gap between me and the car in front, and crept in 1st gear on tickover, clutching too, and proceeded down the hill. On the way down the hill I saw the drivers of the cars on the side of the road, this is a narrow b road in the middle of nowhere with no pavements, so they were standing next to the road. As soon as I saw them I totally lost control, and the mini in front of me was going so slowly I caught up with it very quickly.

First I tried braking, but that made things worse, I then tried cadence braking, but that still did nothing, then i tried coasting, but that just made me go faster, then I tried engine braking and that made things even worse, so all I could do was aim the car. I had 2 options. Drive straight into the back of the car infront of me and potentially wreck at least 3 cars, or try to drive off the road into deeper snow.

I didn't want to hit the car infront of me, that would have cost me £650 on my excess, but I couldn't drive off the road because I would have probably killed the two stupid pillocks stood next to the road. So I just started sounding the horn and put the hazards on to try and get the mini to speed up, but he didnt. So I had no choice, and drove off the road, as soon as the left wheel touched the snow the car stopped without spinning.

I felt so helpless in that situation, everything I tried didn't work and it could have gone so wrong. Is there anything at all I can do to get out of a skid when going down a steep hill covered in ice?

Today has been a bloody nightmare as far as driving is concerned. The roads I use to get to work had all been gritted regularly last week, so things were generally ok, but this morning none of the roads had been gritted. It took me 3 hours to get to work in the end, when it usually takes 45 minutes, and on the way I saw so many smashed up cars.

There was a long queue of cars driving very slowly, turned out two smashed up cars were blocking the road at the top of a hill so only one direction of traffic could move at a time. There were no police directing this, just people taking turns to get past. Whilst I was waiting I saw some stupid bitch driving walking speed going up the hill, she was in first gear and redlining the engine, when she inevitably found grip at the top of the hill she spun off the road.

Anyway, I eventually got to the smashed up cars, and waited my turn to go. I left a big gap between me and the car in front, and crept in 1st gear on tickover, clutching too, and proceeded down the hill. On the way down the hill I saw the drivers of the cars on the side of the road, this is a narrow b road in the middle of nowhere with no pavements, so they were standing next to the road. As soon as I saw them I totally lost control, and the mini in front of me was going so slowly I caught up with it very quickly.

First I tried braking, but that made things worse, I then tried cadence braking, but that still did nothing, then i tried coasting, but that just made me go faster, then I tried engine braking and that made things even worse, so all I could do was aim the car. I had 2 options. Drive straight into the back of the car infront of me and potentially wreck at least 3 cars, or try to drive off the road into deeper snow.

I didn't want to hit the car infront of me, that would have cost me £650 on my excess, but I couldn't drive off the road because I would have probably killed the two stupid pillocks stood next to the road. So I just started sounding the horn and put the hazards on to try and get the mini to speed up, but he didnt. So I had no choice, and drove off the road, as soon as the left wheel touched the snow the car stopped without spinning.

I felt so helpless in that situation, everything I tried didn't work and it could have gone so wrong. Is there anything at all I can do to get out of a skid when going down a steep hill covered in ice?

No just close your eyes and hope for the best.

Short simple answer there. No nothing you can do really when skidding on ice.

If it starts to slide one way or the other is reasonably gently steer the way the car is heading oddly as it sounds, just leave it in 1st and if necessary sound the horn frequently, a series of blasts on the horn draws attention that a continuous one.

When the car corrects itself or it starts to go the other way steer it that way again, but again do it gently, don't panic, it'll only make things worse. If you hit something you hit something, been there done that, which would you rather do?

Kill a child, Kill yourself or someone else or pay an excess.

A car can be repaired, you can't bring someone back from the dead.

Just to be clear I drove off the road after I had passed the pedestrians, but I was very close to hitting the car infront of me until I had chance to drive off the road.

If your traction has gone and you can't get it back, it's just gravity at that point, sadly!

worst thing you can do is keep on the brakes, makes me chuckle the number of drivers i've seen just sliding with locked up wheels

off the brakes, low a gear as possible then only touch the brakes very gently once the engine is down to tickover

Their is something that can be done when engine braking causes wheels to lock up on ice down hill.The way to regain control is to accelerate the engine to increase wheel speed. The wheel speed must match road speed before retardation can begin again. Once the wheels have gained the correct speed then start decelerating again and so on. Also once wheels are turning at the correct speed steering becomes available again This is the only way to do it. Of course leaving a sensible gap between vehicles is imperative, particularly in adverse conditions. One has to remain very cool and not panic. Ideally the danger would have been identified in advance, this is where experience comes in. Without being patronising and that is not intended, at 20 someone may not have that sort of experience unless they have done an awful lot of driving or frequently been in the company of experienced drives over many miles.

Fit Winter Tyres, they have far better traction and steering on winter roads on ice/ snow, wet roads and so on. They are well worth the investment and may well save your life.

Had a similar experience yesterday on a short steep section of road that drops from my house. It had been pretty OK all the last few weeks, but after a fresh snow fall I had a 4 wheels sliding moment aimed straight at a parked car. Brakes on or off made no difference. Luckily I had space to turn towards the footpath before the parked car by revving the engine with the wheel turned nearly full lock in the direction I wanted to go - the car was still very slow to change direction. I had plenty of grip to stop it before I got to the kerb and to reverse back onto the road and pass the parked car, so there was a sheet of ice under the snow in just the wrong place - problem is you don't know it's there until you're sliding on it. If my water supply from the mains wasn't frozen and I didn't need to collect water for the house I'd use my bike to get around all the time in these conditions - more mechanical grip and a much better feel for traction...

using your gears and engine revs is about the only way you can safely slow the car when on real slippy roads youwould have just been a passenger on that hil there though. been there before

I felt so helpless in that situation, everything I tried didn't work and it could have gone so wrong. Is there anything at all I can do to get out of a skid when going down a steep hill covered in ice?

Personally I use engine braking asap on downhills. Brakes, snow, ice and downhill don't mix well. If you need to use much braking you'll already be going too fast. OTOH the engine braking on a new 1.4TSI isn't much unless in 2nd or 3rd, Don't know if setting a lower idle speed would help, although it's improving with age. Like others say winter tyres will help.

Hmm is it possible to engage reverse whilst slipping forwards if the wheels are locked up?

Hmm is it possible to engage reverse whilst slipping forwards if the wheels are locked up?

At best this wouldn't do anything, at worst it would cause you to go into a spin. If you wheels have locked up then they have already lost traction and the only way to regain traction is to release the brakes.

Assuming you have abs brakes, I would use that rather than engine for decelerating. Engine is ok to hold speed with, but I'm cautious about it when it's very slippy. With the climae here in Norway, I use spikes.

Oh for spiked tyres in the UK when we have ice and not grit or salt on the roads.

Edited 12 January, 201016 yr by cheezemonkhai

If it is really icy there is very little you can do except go really slowly to start with and don't lock the wheels up, coasting with your foot on the clutch and gently applying the brakes will be better than using engine braking as you are using all four wheels not just the two front ones. On snow (maybe not ice) the abs is no use if you want to stop quicker .....switch the abs off and when the brakes are used the snow builds up in front of the tyre forming a barrier and slowing the car down, just remember that for the steering to work the wheels must be rotating so don't expect to be able to steer at the same.........with abs it keeps letting the wheel spin a bit and this barrier never appears but you will be able to steer

WINTER TYRES!!! Thats all that will help in these conditions

I have had no trouble on steep icy hills, like the mini that was in front of you who was also having no difficulty. At the top of the hill, car in 1st or 2nd gear, no throttle at all and let the car take you down the hill. Engine braking will stop you from going to fast, and you will get to the bottom without any problem. It seems that in these times, drivers are not taught how to slow down and control the car using engine braking, unlike when I learnt to drive. Applying the brakes on the hill, or trying to engage a gear to low for your current speed whilst already going down hill will make things far worse. once you are going to fast and lose control then you become a passenger in your own car.

I felt so helpless in that situation, everything I tried didn't work and it could have gone so wrong. Is there anything at all I can do to get out of a skid when going down a steep hill covered in ice?

Very little if it's that bad - best to avoid it entirely.

Best thing anyone could have done would have been to walk back up the hill and advise all drivers to either not attempt the descent or only go once the descent is clear.

I am not going to pretend I would have done any better in the situation you advise, but I have to constantly remind myself to never dip the clutch when descending the local hills in this weather. If I started out in 3rd instead of 2nd then I maybe use the brakes to restrain the car, but not to slow it down.

One of our cars is getting snow tyres next year. That much I am sure of.

Lots of good advice on here. Don't rely on the ABS, because if all 4 wheels lock, it assumes you've stopped and doesn't work, so you just slide. The old pre-ABS trick of tapping the brake pedal with your foot can be quite effective, but on a continuous sheet of ICE, it may not help much. Most important is keep your speed down and don't panic when it starts to slide, which is easier said than done. I had plenty of bottom clenching moments when I've panicked!

Would cars with ESP have inertial or velocity sensors to keep the ABS active?

I've always used Cadence braking before ABS and it does work, to a point. Then the laws of physics take over.

If you can find one, a decent skid avoidance/handling course is well worth it. Look for one that uses a cradle rather than the old oil, water and slick tyres. They can create a variety of conditions.

Would cars with ESP have inertial or velocity sensors to keep the ABS active?

Probably not - ESP doesn't release brakes, it only brakes with one wheel. If your wheels are already all locked, there is nothing ESP can add.

In winter driving courses (in Finland) there is a simulated situation where you have to first avoid an obstacle by turning into the opposite lane and then quickly turn back to avoid hitting an oncoming car. The primary lesson is that if you as much as think of touching the brakes - even with ABS - you will lose control of the car. The second lesson is that ESP allows ordinary drivers to cope with this by simply letting off the accelerator and coasting through. To do the same without ESP requires significantly slower speeds or the skills of a (Finnish) rally driver. With some practice, I was able to clear this obstacle in 60 km/h, where I initially failed to do so at 40 km/h because I briefly touched the brakes. Of course this only involved brightly coloured cones and a dented self-esteem, no oncoming lorry.

This lesson somewhat applies to braking when going downhill - if you start skidding, you can only regain control using the throttle.

WINTER TYRES!!! Thats all that will help in these conditions

Would non-studded winter tyres help on sheet ice?

Steve