Hello

This may seem a silly question but I know there are lots of knowledgeable types on the forum. I had always thought that as long as you had car insurance that would cover when you drove a hire car. I have hired a car for one day and asked Privilege if the insurance covered the car and they said no.

The hire agreement says Price includes:

Unlimited mileage :

THEFT WAIVER

COLLISION DAMAGE WAIVER

VAT Included

I wonder if this is car insurance or will I need to phone Privilege and get the car insured.

The reason I ask is that from their answer it would seem clear that I do but when you hire a car you don't tend to know its reg until you pick it up. However you don't see lots of people on their mobiles arranging insurance before they drive off. So either I am missing a trick or lots of people are driving hire cars without insurance.

Sorry for the "silly" questions

Thanks

Hello

This may seem a silly question but I know there are lots of knowledgeable types on the forum. I had always thought that as long as you had car insurance that would cover when you drove a hire car. I have hired a car for one day and asked Privilege if the insurance covered the car and they said no.

The hire agreement says Price includes:

Unlimited mileage :

THEFT WAIVER

COLLISION DAMAGE WAIVER

VAT Included

I wonder if this is car insurance or will I need to phone Privilege and get the car insured.

The reason I ask is that from their answer it would seem clear that I do but when you hire a car you don't tend to know its reg until you pick it up. However you don't see lots of people on their mobiles arranging insurance before they drive off. So either I am missing a trick or lots of people are driving hire cars without insurance.

Sorry for the "silly" questions

Thanks

I'm pretty sure that hire cars have their own insurance otherwise people would find it too much hassle to actually hire them. I used to hire cars before I got the Octavia and I never once even considered getting my own insurance for them

If you've got fully comp insurance aren't you insured 3rd party for other vehicles anyway?

Of course, I could be wrong :S

If you've got fully comp insurance aren't you insured 3rd party for other vehicles anyway?

If you have comprehensive insurance ( the word 'fully' is unneccesary as it can't be anything else) then you are only insured 3rd party to drive other vehicles provided the other vehicle is also insured.

When you rent a hire car it is already insured for you but you can take out additional cover to avoid a high excess in the event of an accident (which can be as much as the first £600 of any claim}.

Further cover can be taken out to include passenger injuries and theft from the vehicle.

When renting a car in the USA, the cost of insurance waivers can be higher than the cost of the car rental.

There are circumstances when it makes sense to not take out any additional insurance costs; for example, if you rent cars regularly you can save so much money by not doing so but you have to weigh this against the cost of paying an excess in the event of a claim.

Also, check out the terms and conditions of your credit or debit cards.

If you use an American Express card then it covers your insurance waivers free of charge.

I wonder if this is car insurance or will I need to phone Privilege and get the car insured.

No, you don't need to phone Privilege. Keep them out of it.

Use the insurance provided with the car rental.

Believe me, the car rental company won't allow you to drive off in an un-insured car!

Car insurance? .... It's a minefield!

Edited 13 January, 201016 yr by BOBAD

If you have comprehensive insurance ( the word 'fully' is unneccesary as it can't be anything else) then you are only insured 3rd party to drive other vehicles provided the other vehicle is also insured.

When you rent a hire car it is already insured for you but you can take out additional cover to avoid a high excess in the event of an accident (which can be as much as the first £600 of any claim}.

Further cover can be taken out to include passenger injuries and theft from the vehicle.

When renting a car in the USA, the cost of insurance waivers can be higher than the cost of the car rental.

There are circumstances when it makes sense to not take out any additional insurance costs; for example, if you rent cars regularly you can save so much money by not doing so but you have to weigh this against the cost of paying an excess in the event of a claim.

Also, check out the terms and conditions of your credit or debit cards.

If you use an American Express card then it covers your insurance waivers free of charge.

No, you don't need to phone Privilege. Keep them out of it.

Use the insurance provided with the car rental.

Believe me, the car rental company won't allow you to drive off in an un-insured car!

Car insurance? .... It's a minefield!

Many thanks. I knew Briskoda would come up trumps

Plus your insurance will exclude hire cars (from a dedicated hire firm) usually UNLESS they arranged it as a courtesy car.

If you have comprehensive insurance ( the word 'fully' is unneccesary as it can't be anything else) then you are only insured 3rd party to drive other vehicles provided the other vehicle is also insured.

Indeed it is a minefield.

This statement is actually incorrect and totally depends on the wording in your policy.

A vehicle certainly doesn't have to be insured for you to be able to use your DOC - unless your policy actually says this.

I have in the past, quite legally driven an uninsured vehicle with my DOC.

My current insurance is the same - there is absolutely no mention of the requirement of the other vehicle being insured for me to use my DOC.

You cannot however park the vehicle up on the street because as soon as you get out of the vehicle it is no longer insured and you cannot place an uninsured vehicle on the street.

The rental company has fleet insurance that will cover all their cars, usually to the minimum requirements of the country involved.

Theft Waiver and Collision damage waiver is like you upgrading that insurance to Fully comp insurance in the UK, if you do not take this cover out then you run the risk of having to payout upto the total value of the car from your own pocket should the car be written off or stolen. Never rent a car without CDW or TW, its just to risky when weighted up against how little these 2 things cost.

i often hire cars, the cost of hiring up to a mondeo size from a independent local hire firm plus fuel, is normally cheaper than the cost of the train to go from cornwall to cardiff, well infact i could hire a brand new fiesta for 5 days for less than the a return train journey.

i always have to sign a declaration for their fleet insurance that says i havent made more than 1 claim in the last 2 years, and i have less than 6 points- mines got none

Theft Waiver and Collision damage waiver is like you upgrading that insurance to Fully comp insurance

No it isn't. There is no way a reputable car rental company would allow you to drive one of their cars on a 3rd party insurance only basis; the potential risk would be far too great.

By taking out CDW you are simply removing the cost of the excess charge applied in the event of a claim.

if you do not take this cover out then you run the risk of having to payout upto the total value of the car from your own pocket should the car be written off or stolen.

No, you are only required to pay out the cost of the excess charge, which can be very high, but which varies from company to company.

Never rent a car without CDW or TW, its just to risky when weighted up against how little these 2 things cost.

Not true. It depends entirely on how often you rent cars. My last trip to the USA (on business) involved 2 mini-van rentals per day for 20 days per month over 8 weeks, which made for a total of over 80 separate rentals. (Just to clarify - 2 groups of people hence two cars, but I was paying the bill for both cars..) The cost of CDW would have been immense if taken out for every rental and it was well worth risking having to pay out the total cost of $500 excess which would have been charged (by National Car Rental - a major rental company..) had I needed to make a claim.

(I didn't!)

If you only rent a car once every pancake day then it is probably re-assuring to pay for CDW. (But imo still not necessary.)

As for Theft Waiver, this usually applies to your belongings being stolen from the vehicle after a break-in (as opposed to the cost of replacing the vehicle if it has been stolen) and is just as un-necessary as personal injury insurance. Both of these items are covered by your travel insurance, and in the event of a claim relating to either of these, you can only make one claim off ONE insurance company for each event.

You won't be paid out twice by two different companies for the same incident. Read the small print.

how little these 2 things cost.

HaHaHaHa. So funny.

Bob.

Edited 19 January, 201016 yr by BOBAD

This statement is actually incorrect

Not incorrect Stoofa, but certainly there are exceptions as you have shown.

However, the standard policy is perfectly clear on this as the following wording in my policy shows:

"DRIVING OTHER CARS.

WHEN DRIVING OTHER CARS COVER IS LIMITED TO THIRD PARTY ONLY.

DAMAGE TO THE CAR YOU ARE DRIVING UNDER THIS EXTENSION IS NOT COVERED BY YOUR POLICY"

I don't doubt that your policy contains a different clause permitting you to drive other vehicles which are not insured while enjoying comprehensive cover, but you will almost certainly be paying heavily for this benefit through your increased insurance premium.

What you have there is an amended version of a Traders' Policy and they don't come cheap.

What I was referring to was a normal, standard, average policy and anyone doubting that would be well advised to check out their own policy first before driving another vehicle in the mistaken belief that they were comprehensively insured.

and totally depends on the wording in your policy

Agreed, see above

You cannot however park the vehicle up on the street because as soon as you get out of the vehicle it is no longer insured

This is supported by the line: "When driving other cars, cover is limited to THIRD PARTY ONLY" (i.e. not THEFT)

Bob.

Indeed it is a minefield.

This statement is actually incorrect and totally depends on the wording in your policy.

A vehicle certainly doesn't have to be insured for you to be able to use your DOC - unless your policy actually says this.

I have in the past, quite legally driven an uninsured vehicle with my DOC.

My current insurance is the same - there is absolutely no mention of the requirement of the other vehicle being insured for me to use my DOC.

You cannot however park the vehicle up on the street because as soon as you get out of the vehicle it is no longer insured and you cannot place an uninsured vehicle on the street.

Have to disagree

I've seen 2 instances on road wars where drivers were told that their insurance is only valid if the car has insurance on it. You cant use the 3rd party use on an otherwise uninsured vehicle.

The most recent was Devon & Cornwall force, so filmed within the last 2 years.

You are just going to have to trust me on this one.

My statement:

"A vehicle does NOT have to be insured for you to use your DOC"

I too saw the Road Wars episode in question and they were wrong.

They said that the car had to be insured.

This is totally down to your insurance company.

When I was with Norwich Union I was asked to drive a car home for a friend under my DOC.

The car was not covered under any other insurance policy.

I contacted NU, explained the situation and they said that was absolutley fine - my DOC cover was not reliant on the vehicle already being insured.

Bobad,

You made the statement:

If you have comprehensive insurance ( the word 'fully' is unneccesary as it can't be anything else) then you are only insured 3rd party to drive other vehicles provided the other vehicle is also insured.

This is a blanket statement and as a blanket statement is indeed incorrect.

It is the last part of your statement:

then you are only insured 3rd party to drive other vehicles provided the other vehicle is also insured

The part in bold is incorrect and a massive misconception (see reference to Road Wars above - not even all the police ae aware).

To get 3rd party insurance on a vehicle via DOC the vehicle only needs to be insured be somebody else IF your insurance documents say so.

If you were talking about getting comprehensive insurance on any vehicle you drive then that is a whole different ball game and not "standard DOC" which most comprehensive policy holders get by default.

I have 2 policies both comprehensive, 1 gives me third party cover on other cars, 1 does not. The company my sister is with comprehensive also does not offer 3rd patry cover.

There are now a lot of comprehensive policies out there that do not include 3rd party cover, mainly as they got annoyed by people insuring a fiesta and then driving an expensive car 3rd party on that policy.

As far as cover applies the Road Traffic Act only refers to persons not vehicles so why should the car you are borrowing be insured? However as said you should not park it on a public road.

i clarified this with my insurer recently, the other vehicle does not have to be insured, however carry your documents with you as if the car isnt insured it is not featured on the insurance database, so risk being stopped if auto number plate recognition spot you, and car seizedif you cant provide proof of cover at roadside. the V5 can't be in your name neither, the only requirements are its taxed and mot'd,

every insurer is different however as my previous insurer said the car must have its own insurer. and the insurer before that said i wasnt allowed to drive other cars at all.

so best is to check with your insurer your self,

this is the statement featured on my policy

The policyholder may also drive a motor car or motor cycle not belonging to him and not hired to him under a hire purchase agreement. This does not included securing the release of a motor vehicle which has been seized by, or on behalf of, any government or public authority. the vehicle must have valid tax and mot.

"standard DOC" which most comprehensive policy holders get by default.

Ah, talking of blanket statements being incorrect............ !

As there appears to be so many different approaches to this thorny subject, I would suggest that before anybody drives another car under the DOC part of their insurance policy, they check the wording on their insurance certificate, or even better puts in a phone call to their insurance company to confirm their status. Getting it wrong can be very expensive in terms of fines, points, car seizures etc.

Bob.

You are just going to have to trust me on this one.

My statement:

"A vehicle does NOT have to be insured for you to use your DOC"

I too saw the Road Wars episode in question and they were wrong.

They said that the car had to be insured.

This is totally down to your insurance company.

When I was with Norwich Union I was asked to drive a car home for a friend under my DOC.

The car was not covered under any other insurance policy.

I contacted NU, explained the situation and they said that was absolutley fine - my DOC cover was not reliant on the vehicle already being insured.

The reason being, as they explained, is once you parked it it was obv no longer insured. It is only insured whilst you are driving it. thus parking it anywhere but on private land (garage, your driveway etc).