ECU Remap warning (from JKM)

[vRS Carl]

Bloody hell Carl, are you feeling ok?

Yup - I'm not just a pretty face you know :p

While I agree in principle with your point, it's nothing to do with a backdoor for the programmer/systems engineer. Anyone who put one in should be instantly fired.

If an embedded system locks the user out, then it's most likely a faulty unit and will need replacing anyway.

When things crash you will usually go in on a serial console or in the case of an embedded system a JTAG interface (as in this instance).

I was using the Term "backdoor" loosely to emphasise that there is always a way round it somehow

[Gyp]

Are you being serious?

Have a quick read of this:

Car-hacking: auto virus threat

Not sure if the referenced article was published by the IEEE, I might have a look later

Here we go...

Paper for the IEEE

Edited 4 August, 2010 by Gyp

[vRS Carl]

Have a quick read of this:

Car-hacking: auto virus threat

Not sure if the referenced article was published by the IEEE, I might have a look later

Yes and the cars were controlled by using a wireless laptop inside the car so i think we are all quite safe for now

You could always try that excuse for speeding

"I'm sorry Officer it's a virus in the car"

[JKM_Performance]

As we have had a bit more time to look into this issue since it first started appearing, I have some more information that you may find interesting.

I actually think the main reason all manufactures (not just Volkswagen / Audi / Seat and Skoda) are applying increased security measures to their cars various electronic systems is more to do with keeping our ‘Friends in Brussels’ happy than to ‘stop’ you tuning your car.

I’m not saying that tuning isn’t an element of it but there is a much more open reason for the increase in security.

From what I can recall, It was deemed ‘unfair’ by the European Union council that only main dealerships should be allowed to update the key systems of automobiles with the latest versions of software available. This was deemed to not give customers freedom of choice…. As a side note this ‘area’ of rules also contains the one that was contested in Brussels and ultimately allows you as the consumer to take your car to any garage that you choose and the warrantee will stand, as long as the manufactures service schedule and genuine parts are used etc etc etc

The majority of vehicle manufactures response to this situation was to basically say that they will allow certified garages in the aftermarket - who are not affiliated with a main brand dealership – to have access to the various software updates.

Apparently the software can/will be supplied to the ‘certified dealerships’ via CD or much more likely via company websites.

The Society of Automotive Engineers defined a ‘framework standard’ to allow Electronic system reprogramming to take place. Look up SAEJ2534 on the internet and you will find lots of data.

Various ‘tool manufactures’ could then design and make equipment to comply with the standard which in itself allowed freedom of choice to what interface was appropriate for any existing diagnostic tools.

Now it is my opinion that there is no way that a vehicle manufacture would allow their intellectual property (Software here) to be ‘out in the open’ without some form of tight control over its use. Hence manufactures have tightened up control of their IP with the introduction of tighter security measures..

I can understand this from the manufactures perspective – a side effect is that you need to get the encryption key for each ECU in order to load aftermarket tuning companies software.

I have a customer who is a network architect and he is a specialist in cryptographic systems, when I explained to him what approach was being taken by manufactures the look on his face was superb. No more serial programming in the aftermarket for a few lifetimes was his response!

To the best of my knowledge, for cars sold as of 1st September 2009 and intended for use in the European marketplace - They must/should now comply with SAEJ2534. However not all cars have so called ‘Anti-tune’ ECU firmware.

In fact we had a 2 month old MK6 GTI (Bosch MED17 ECU) into JKM last week for APR and it programmed fine.

Jim here at JKM on his 2.0 TSI Skoda (Bosch MED17 ECU) with an early year 2010 build date also did not have any ‘Anti-tune’ firmware.

We are lead to believe that most diesels are now locked however. There are no ‘giveaways’ as to what may or may not be locked – we have to try serial programming the car, if it does not start afterwards then we simply reprogram the OEM map back on and away you go.

Not all new cars are coming out with the latest Bosch MED17 ECU type either, for instance the new Golf R and Audi TT-RS to name a couple are both still running on Bosch MED9.

Hope this helps

Keith

[vRS Carl]

Cheers Keith

[Stuart_J]

One big plus is it will kill the monkey with a lap doing cheap & dodgy maps.

[cheezemonkhai]

One big plus is it will kill the monkey with a lap doing cheap & dodgy maps.

This can only be a good thing, especially if it helps to stop the modified but undeclared barry wagons to some extent.

[Krispe]

My 59reg VRS, (October 09 delivery) has bluefin installed. It is due a service soon so my dilema now is do I tell the dealer not to add any software updates, (therefore admitting I have a remap and possibly voiding any warranty claims), or risk a software update which could make re-loading my bluefin map impossible.....?????? :wonder: If Skoda dealer in Northampton was still going I'd just tell the mechanic as he was great with regards to modifications / warranty etc however my nearest dealer is now Bedford and I'm not sure how re-map friendly they are....

[octavia5]

My 59reg VRS, (October 09 delivery) has bluefin installed. It is due a service soon so my dilema now is do I tell the dealer not to add any software updates, (therefore admitting I have a remap and possibly voiding any warranty claims), or risk a software update which could make re-loading my bluefin map impossible.....?????? :wonder: If Skoda dealer in Northampton was still going I'd just tell the mechanic as he was great with regards to modifications / warranty etc however my nearest dealer is now Bedford and I'm not sure how re-map friendly they are....

Sent you a PM which might help