oversteer or understeer

[matthew101]

as the wet weather is here i was hoping to get some roundabout sliding in, but the cars refusing to play ball, all i get is boring safe understeer, even with new tyres on the front and s#$t ones on the back, handbreak would solve this obvs, bit dodgy tho!

[Phil-E]

I always found my felicia way too under-steer-ry to get any over steer action going! Even in the dry. The only time I managed was in the snow!

Edited 11 November, 2010 by philje123

[RobinSLXi]

That'll be 'cause the engine's in the wrong end!

The only time I've had oversteer in a FWD car (Mondeo) was more terrifying than enjoyable, and whilst I understand the physics I wouldn't claim to have the driving skills to do it in a deliberate and controlled manner! RWD is another matter, of course...

[RainbowFire]

Wet, oily, a few bits of Gravesend and the truck (which is back, complete with new gearbox etcetcetc) quite happily slides all over the place. I usually find a bit of understeer then straight off the throttle gets the back stepping out nicely, in both the truck and my Focus.

Sadly, not as nicely as my old 2.0 Sierra with 5 crates of bricks in the back :-( that was some serious fun ;)

(apologies to anyone who got held up on the Hempstead Valley Link Road watching the gold Sierra go sideways round the middle roundabout, three or four times each trip)

Mind you, my first car was a Morris Marina. Leaf-spring rear suspension. Nuff said

Alex

[matthew101]

yeah mine wont even when provoked, lift of just lets the car straighten up, even tried left foot braking while understeering... slides nicely on the handbrake, but hate the idea of stretching the cable!

[KenONeill]

Not only the engine position, but the drive, and the suspension geometry, are working against you.

It may be possible to provoke lift-off oversteer as follows, but note that this is actively dangerous anywhere except a proper skid pan:-

1) Force the car to turn-in and keep turning higher G until you reach a situation where the car holds a constant path even when you apply more steering lock.

2) Now snap the throttle closed but do not brake. You might get sudden and violent lift-off oversteer, which you'll not can catch. The car might gather it up by itself, or might spin out. See why I said this was actively dangerous?

[matthew101]

yeah thats pretty much what i tried, guess il just stick to the handbreak! shame my old escort did it beautifully!!

[TeflonTom]

what you need to do is sitiffen up the rear axle beam.. if you do a search on here i did a thread about a home-made rear sway bar made using a modified vauxhall tigra front anti-roll bar

[VWD]

Mind you, my first car was a Morris Marina. Leaf-spring rear suspension. Nuff said

Alex

Alex- that was the standard of cars of yore -but well stable compared to the Moggie Van -which you drove by the seat of your pants ( and if the road was slippy - well you wouldn't want cloth seats)

[felicia16v]

never had a problem with understeer

[RainbowFire]

Alex- that was the standard of cars of yore -but well stable compared to the Moggie Van -which you drove by the seat of your pants ( and if the road was slippy - well you wouldn't want cloth seats)

Quite by co-incidence I found a Youtube video of a fairly young Tiff Needel on Top Gear (clip was old enough to have William Woodard in it!) demonstrating understeer and oversteer....first thing he came out in was a Minor.

But yes the cars of yesteryear were far more fun to drive than those of today. Car control was fun in those days, not a chore like it is today. Give me leave springs, drums and skiddy, skinny cross-plys and I won't even ask for it to be wet. ;-)

Whilst on the "fun" aspect of driving, I saw an old Yank-Tank the other day (no idea what it was though). Had the following on the bumper sticker: "Disc brakes are for cowards!" I did somewhat smile at that one. ;-)

Alex

[TeflonTom]

ahh here it is... from the dim and distant deepest darkest recesses of feliciadom... crikey, i should lay off the beer now i think

Home-brew felicia rear anti-roll bar

[RedmeX]

There are few options to encourage felicia to oversteer.

1)worsen rear-end grip

fit it with rear ARB, better is doubled ARB

use old rear tyres (as you did)

get as much trunk load as you can

2) improve front-end grip (thats better option)

get rid of front ARB, if you have one

get some negative camber (2+°)

get some caster (need serious geometry changes)

widen front axle

get semi-slicks

[danp]

may get shot but here it goes get a e36 m3

[KenONeill]

There are few options to encourage felicia to oversteer.

1)worsen rear-end grip

fit it with rear ARB, better is doubled ARB

use old rear tyres (as you did)

get as much trunk load as you can

2) improve front-end grip (thats better option)

get rid of front ARB, if you have one

get some negative camber (2+°)

get some caster (need serious geometry changes)

widen front axle

get semi-slicks

(2) Increasing the track (widen front axle) will also increase negative camber, if you do not relocate the strut top mounts outwards.

Can you change the length of the angled tie links on the Fellie (and Favorit I suspect) front wishbones? If so, then pulling/pushing (as applicable) the stub axles forwards will give you increased caster.