rear drums sticking

[FabiaGreenline]

My 2009 Fabia Greenline with 20,500 miles has started to have a problem with the rear drum brakes. My commute each morning is just under 5 miles, and sometimes first thing, but more so evening time - when I reverse out of my space the rear drums stick. The car rides on the suspension until clunk, they release. Question - Is this covered under warranty, I can't say I've ever had to replace shoes at such low miles, especially when the front pads are fine and still the originals. Could there be a minor fluid seepage do you think causing the binding when parked? The brakes work fine in use, when I had the car serviced at 17,500 they adjusted the handbrake.

[raisbeck]

I havent had this on mine after 17500 miles but I did have exactly this on my Mk1

On one occasion I almost didn't get moving. As you said, the back rears upward until 'clonk' it suddenly lets go.

The cure was to lubricate the shoe linkages and remove some excess brake dust. This wasn't warranty as the car was well in to its late middle age.

I certainly would expect it to be a warranty claim on such a young vehicle. Is lubricating and cleaning the rear shoes a service requirement at the 2nd service ?

If adjusting the handbrake means moving the shoes a little closer to the drum then you may have your answer. They might have overdone it a bit.

Fact is nothing is worn out, the car has a defect and your just out of a service. I wouldnt expect to pay a penny........

[Black]

Had this on my last Fabia mk2, started around 30k miles and fixed under warranty only to reapear, something to do with a spring in the drums. One one occasion only released after dragging the rear wheels for 5m down the road, that 1.4 tdi had some torque!

[Guest]

If this is only happening in the freezing weather, it's due to frozen moisture either in the rear drums and/or moisture ingress into the handbrake cable and linkages causing the rear shoes to 'freeze' in the 'on' position. It's more likely to be something external to the rear drums as you say the suspension rides up indicating it's both the rear drums that are stuck on. This is usually the cable and linkages causing the problem. As a temporary fix...don't apply the handbrake too firmly and leave the vehicle in first gear so it isn't going to move. If safe, don't use the handbrake when leaving the vehicle on a flat surface in the car par, just leave it in reverse gear until the problem is sorted. Rear drums are normally cleaned out at 20k. In some circumstances hydraulic leaks can cause the shoes to stick if it mixes with brake dust but it's unlikely you have a leak at such a low mileage. Check you brake fluid level to make sure it's at the full mark. My guess is that once we get some warmer weather and dry roads, if you take her for a good run things will start to dry out and the problem will go away. Can't properly answer if this is covered under warranty. Normally most manufacturers don't cover this sort of thing unless the car is less than 6 months old and even then it's a battle. There isn't much about brakes that is covered under warranty as they are consumables and how they work and how long they last is dependant on so many factors. A 5 mile commute each way doesn't do brakes or any part of your car very much good. Nothing much on the car dries out in the winter with a low mileage commute and this can affect the brakes.

Edited 30 December, 2010 by Estate Man

[Black]

Estate Man not sure which dealers you are talking about but I have had two brake repairs under warranty from Skoda on the same car for binding drums. Car was about 18 months old with at least 30k on the clock. From VW I have had rear brake calipers adjusted FOC a number of times.

[Guest]

Estate Man not sure which dealers you are talking about but I have had two brake repairs under warranty from Skoda on the same car for binding drums. Car was about 18 months old with at least 30k on the clock. From VW I have had rear brake calipers adjusted FOC a number of times.

Yes...if you have a good dealer this can happen. Easy adjustments taking only minutes such as your calipers a dealer will often do foc especially if you are known to them. But it depends exactly what the problem is and what is causing it. Brake adjustments, pads and shoes are not covered under warranty...normally, but it does vary from manufacturer to manufacturer. Some give you 6 months from new others nothing. Skoda, are obviously very good.

Edited 31 December, 2010 by Estate Man

[xman]

Skoda, are obviously very good.

I'm growing more and more convinced that you have some connection with Skoda.

Wear and tear are not covered by warranty, but binding brakes are obviously an operational problem that should not be associated with wear and tear. The rear brake drums are self adjusting (as are disc brakes) and if that auto adjustment ceases to work properly during the normal warranty period I am pretty sure this is a warranty issue.

Having suffered from sticking rear brake drums in my Mk1 Fabia (with consequential failure of slave cylinders due to overheating) I am of the opinion that the rear drum setup on the Fabia is a poor design. Certainly access to the auto adjustment wedge is very poor compared to say a Fiat Punto.

Edited 31 December, 2010 by xman

[FabiaGreenline]

I've booked it in for the 13th, the first time I can get across to Meadens in the New Forest and they have a slot on one of my days off. Seeing as thats nearly two weeks away, I've given the rear brakes a little exercise with the handbrake whilst the car is moving, and also exercised the ABS. Got a little more travel on the handbrake than before, and this morning no sticking. I just wonder if like a lot of rear brakes the lack of use just gums things up. Its going to be parked now for a couple of days so we'll see if that has sorted it out. If it has fixed it I'll just cancel the booking. When I asked the question is it covered by warranty I was told no.

[Fab Estate]

Strangely enough mine started sticking yesterday.

[raisbeck]

I've booked it in for the 13th, the first time I can get across to Meadens in the New Forest and they have a slot on one of my days off. Seeing as thats nearly two weeks away, I've given the rear brakes a little exercise with the handbrake whilst the car is moving, and also exercised the ABS. Got a little more travel on the handbrake than before, and this morning no sticking. I just wonder if like a lot of rear brakes the lack of use just gums things up. Its going to be parked now for a couple of days so we'll see if that has sorted it out. If it has fixed it I'll just cancel the booking. When I asked the question is it covered by warranty I was told no.

Mine has been parked up with the handbrake on since xmas eve......(been using our 1.4 MPI). Just been outside to see whats what. Took the handbrake off and initially wouldnt roll......bit of a heave and its the front discs sticking a little with the rust build up on the discs. Rears are completely free.

My old Mk 1 only started this after the handbrake was tightened and when I parked up in damp conditions. I wouldnt be in the least surprised if after you exercised everything it goes away....Might also depend how hard you heave on the handbrake

[Guest]

by Xman

Wear and tear are not covered by warranty, but binding brakes are obviously an operational problem that should not be associated with wear and tear.

Well, actually...when the adjusters get to the end of there adjustment, or everything just gets very very dirty through wear and tear in between services, the brakes can bind. But we are talking here about a gentleman who has sticking handbrake problems which brings in a whole new load of whirly gigs that can freeze up or go wonky. Unless there is a fault with any of those bits, it aint covered. Water in the handbrake cable or drums that freezes, or crud causing the problem (the usual cause!) isn't. Plain simple and unfortunate too.

by Xman

The rear brake drums are self adjusting (as are disc brakes) and if that auto adjustment ceases to work properly during the normal warranty period I am pretty sure this is a warranty issue.

In all my time as a tech I've never had a faulty adjuster on any car. I've seen plenty that have stopped working due to dirt and crud getting into the drums due to owners using their cars as boats, and just huge amounts of brake dust building up in-between services (rare). Dirt causing things to jam or seize up is not covered under warranty.

by Xman

Having suffered from sticking rear brake drums in my Mk1 Fabia (with consequential failure of slave cylinders due to overheating) I am of the opinion that the rear drum setup on the Fabia is a poor design. Certainly access to the auto adjustment wedge is very poor compared to say a Fiat Punto.

You have to go some to get enough heat to cause brake cylinder failure if the brakes are binding. As an experienced driver I'm surprised you didn't notice something was wrong. Anyhoo, it normally happens (although not exclusively) the other way round. The cylinder/s weep or leak over a period of time and this causes a sticky coating to develop on and around the back plate causing the brakes to bind, and obviously get hot. There is nothing wrong with the design of the self adjusters on the Skoda Fabia, it's the same as most others and just as bullet proof.

Sorry to disappoint...I still don't work for Skoda and since my illness, I can't work for anyone at the moment.

Edited 31 December, 2010 by Estate Man

[xman]

Estate Man, As far as your shouting off or late editing of other posts to increase ridicule is concerned - :moon:

It's your insistence of your self declared "statements of fact" that I find misleading. The OP and others in this thread have been having trouble at 20,000 miles and to suggest that this is definitely not a warranty problem sounds typical of a dealer fob off and is clearly poor advice and legally not right.

You seem to be incapable of engaging in discussion, always throwing down the same "in the trade" tirade.

In future, I will try not to post anything, as I find your attitude offensive.

Sadly it seems a lot of forums tend to get dominant members who stifle open debate.

Edited 2 January, 2011 by xman

[fordfan]

Warranty is there to cover against defects in materials and workmanship during manufacture, it does not cover against inappropriate design, adjustments, wear and tear and breakages caused by inappropriate use.

Brakes are always tricky with regards to warranty claims for the reasons mentioned above, also I don't think that the manufacturers service schedule helps. I've seen plenty of 3 year old dealer serviced cars where the wheels have never been removed and more than one set of Fabia shoes where the handbrake pivot lever has seized.

Again as above, if you are known to the dealer they may repair it on a good will basis, their other options are to try for a warranty claim or charge the customer. Just because they haven't charged you for it, it doesn't mean that the warranty claim has been successful, they may think that chasing the customer will be counter productive and absorb the costs themselves.

[Guest Tsi Fly]

Estate Man, As far as your shouting off or late editing of other posts to increase ridicule is concerned - :moon:

It's your insistence of your self declared "statements of fact" that I find misleading. The OP and others in this thread have been having trouble at 20,000 miles and to suggest that this is definitely not a warranty problem sounds typical of a dealer fob off and is clearly poor advice and legally not right.

You seem to be incapable of engaging in discussion, always throwing down the same "in the trade" tirade.

In future, I will try not to post anything, as I find your attitude offensive.

Sadly it seems a lot of forums tend to get dominant members who stifle open debate.

I am sorry but I see things the other way round. Estate Man is offering sound impartial advice you on the other hand seem to be aggressive towards him.

Damn it, 2nd Feb and broke my new years resolution not to get involved.

Edited 2 January, 2011 by Tsi Fly

[Guest]

Estate Man, As far as your shouting off or late editing of other posts to increase ridicule is concerned - :moon:

It's your insistence of your self declared "statements of fact" that I find misleading. The OP and others in this thread have been having trouble at 20,000 miles and to suggest that this is definitely not a warranty problem sounds typical of a dealer fob off and is clearly poor advice and legally not right.

You seem to be incapable of engaging in discussion, always throwing down the same "in the trade" tirade.

In future, I will try not to post anything, as I find your attitude offensive.

Sadly it seems a lot of forums tend to get dominant members who stifle open debate.

Hi xman,

I'm certainly not trying to ridicule you or any of your statements. If you look at some of your posts however, you do tend to make 'absolute' statements that are dubious at best and often incorrect, and that's ok, that's what the forum is for so we can all learn. I've been shot down too on the odd occasion when I've posted some out of date info. It happens to us all. However, I do sometimes have an alternative view to yours and many others, based frequently on my experience in the trade, and if someone says something I know to be incorrect, of course I may give the facts as I know them, as you do too! I've learned loads about my car on here. You often contribute good stuff too as far as I can see. So don't really know what you are going on about, except do keep posting and have a Happy New Year!

[raisbeck]

Going a bit off subject here but as its brakes I wanted to mention something I have a bit of an issue with on my new...ish Greenline

The front discs.........they really corrode up easily. I am well aware that when wet and salty you can get a bit more rust on your discs than normal but this Greenline seems more susceptible than my previous Fabias. We have an old 1.4 MPI which even in all this salt and damp doesnt gather corrosion on the discs anything like my Greenline does. My previous 1.2 HTP Fabia never corroded like these do and had the original set all the way to 98,000 miles.

I do the same journey I have always done with this car as well as previous Fabias, all 3 cars seem to use the same discs.

Just seems a bit odd thats all.

[horkin]

Haven't driven mine for over 24 hours and just had a look. Some minor water marks, slightest surface rust but not bad. I've had cars whos discs have been red rusty just standing over night. My Mazda 3 was prone to this. It's not really a probnlem as it is normal surface rust. I suppose the composition of the metals vary between manufacturers and therefore the discs react in different ways. It would however be a problem if the car was stood for months and the rust allowed to corrode the disc. Lets face it, any normal ferrous metal will rust if left exposed.

[Adrianh1]

I don't know Estate Man but I know he is a Skoda enthusiast. But I've never thought for a minute that he worked for Skoda. Or that he shouts down other members. Xman's comments were rude and obnoxious and unworthy of this forum.

[Black]

I think the discs are pretty poor, had to replace the ones on my old Fab II at 40k miles. Very disapointing as I had a volvo S60 beforehand which covered 50k in the same conditions with no issues at all. VAG brakes are however well known in the trade for not being that good.

[Guest]

My motorcycle and car are the same regarding this disc corrosion issue. It seems more predominate since the removal of asbestos from the pads. The new compounds in the pads was found to wear the discs very quickly. To help with this, manufacturers started fitting discs with less stainless steel in them and more cast material instead, causing rust to happen very easily. On the upside this is supposed to increase brake efficiency due to better heat disapation and stuff. My brakes are good but discs still seem to wear out more quickly though.

[FabiaGreenline]

Well the update is my problem has gone. The exercising of the brakes using the handbrake when moving at speed, and giving the ABS a good work out have cured the problem. They day after a tiny little bit of sticking, and I drove 130 miles, parked up for two days, and no sticking at all. Drove 130 home, and was fine this morning and still fine this evening. I think like a lot of rear drums they don't get used nearly enough, and I don't drive like a pillock to be jamming on the brakes to often. Perhaps they were designed with the 'bmw' driver in mind, enough said. lol.

[fabia55]

did you use your handbrake gently to slow the car when moving or suddenly to stop the car altogether without using the brake pedal?

[horkin]

Using the handbrake when driving at speed?? Hell you've got more balls than me Lucky you didn't see the back end overtaking you at some speed!!! Lol

I think it's only fair to point out that "ESTATE MAN" was right once again as he predicted with warmer weather and a bit of use, the problem would go away, he takes some stick from certain quarters but he sure knows what he's talking about!! .. :yes:

Edited 4 January, 2011 by horkin

[FabiaGreenline]

Using the handbrake when driving at speed?? Hell you've got more balls than me Lucky you didn't see the back end overtaking you at some speed!!! Lol

I think it's only fair to point out that "ESTATE MAN" was right once again as he predicted with warmer weather and a bit of use, the problem would go away, he takes some stick from certain quarters but he sure knows what he's talking about!! .. :yes:

When I say speed were talking 30mph max, and very gently bringing up the handle just so you can feel it apply, then let it off. Repeated a few times. I had no intention of creating a rear wheel lock up! just enough to bed the linings against the drum. Tonight again its all back to normal still. Might add it wasn't on enough to even illuminate the dash warning light.

[vRSLen]

I watched the wife reverse out of the garage today, dragging the nsr wheel for about 4 meters before release.......