Forget the bike argument because I was just being a poop stirrer,

but I really don't see what benefit there is to DRL's and I have found plenty of them to be a distraction head on. How can they be a safety feature? how invisible is 1.5 tons of car? I would stand by the statement that if visibilty is low, then go to dipped headlights, how many lights do you need on the front?

Before Audi started sticking them on RS6's etc, nobody was interested, and in countries where DRL's where mandatory, manufacturers like Volvo just used to hardwire or code the headlights to dipped beam.

If someone can produce concrete proof that DRL's have directly been responsible for preventing death's then fine and I will shut up but don't tell me that anyone here who has DRL's (PS mine has them from the factory to, but I have them coded off by the dealer) truly thinks they are for safety, you will mostly think they are "cool" but won't actually stump up and say it

I actually agreee with most of this. The only bit I don't agree with is them being distraction- I've never been dazzled by them.

What was getting my goat up was the mention in the original article of DRLs on cars making bikes less visible.

Oh, and fluffmeister- you had a Prius? Your opinion on anything vehicle related suddenly has no credibility :p

Very invisible judging by the amount of times i have to brake, swerve, stop and give various hand gestures during an average week. Its a good job i'm on the ball. I really don't know how people get from a-b in one piece sometimes.

How invisible is a bus with a yellow front and dipped headlights? One of the West of Scotland fleets used to run like that, and they had now fewer shunts than any other similar sized fleet. The issue is "did not look" rather than "looked and failed to see".

Oh, and fluffmeister- you had a Prius? Your opinion on anything vehicle related suddenly has no credibility :p

Which I ran for 7 months from new, was an excellent car and cost me £800 in depreciation when I decided it was not for me, paid £20k new, got £19.2k in p/ex with 10 k on the clock

Way way off topic but there you go, it was brilliant, but my regular 500 run up to the highlands where it's Achilles heel, it's even got a couple of laps of the nurburgring under it's belt

Edited 11 February, 201115 yr by fluffmeister

Beautifully put Ken

Second that!

The bit I said earlier about indicators... Someone noticed the "Inboard" bit ant interpreted correctly. The indicators should be on top, underneath or OUTSIDE the headlights, not inside, ie, nearer to the grill than the headlights. It IS loopheled by the use of wing mounted signals and, more frequently, by the ones in the mirrors. These are not illegal but they are often used so designers can put indicators closer to the grill, say in many Pugs, Focus' etc. The point about the illegal lighting, I think someone took too literal. I wqs NOT suggesting it is illeagal from the factory but if the owner then fits non standard "Unaproved" equipment, it could well be!

When I said how do you feel now, knowing your 20k motor is unfit for road use or possibly an mot failuire, it was a rhetorical question, NOT a direct one, aimed at anyone who had any 20k car!

As for HID's, If I remember correctly, to be legal, you must have wash-wipes fitted to the headlights AND self-levelling beams, too! Note self-levelling... Not the little wheel you use if and when you remember it!!!

Just fitting something you came across on ebay, may NOT be legal or even safe!

Anyway, I digress as, people seem to take things far too personally... If you are not blinding everyone else and you think it looks cool, do it. If you you attract the attention of "Plod", be a man, (Or woman, depending on yopur sex) put your hand up and take the penalty. Don't try pleading ignorance or blaming the manufacturer for the stuff you bolt on your vehicle, thinking it's cool!

Second that!

The bit I said earlier about indicators... Someone noticed the "Inboard" bit ant interpreted correctly. The indicators should be on top, underneath or OUTSIDE the headlights, not inside, ie, nearer to the grill than the headlights. It IS loopheled by the use of wing mounted signals and, more frequently, by the ones in the mirrors. These are not illegal but they are often used so designers can put indicators closer to the grill, say in many Pugs, Focus' etc. The point about the illegal lighting, I think someone took too literal. I wqs NOT suggesting it is illeagal from the factory but if the owner then fits non standard "Unaproved" equipment, it could well be!

When I said how do you feel now, knowing your 20k motor is unfit for road use or possibly an mot failuire, it was a rhetorical question, NOT a direct one, aimed at anyone who had any 20k car!

As for HID's, If I remember correctly, to be legal, you must have wash-wipes fitted to the headlights AND self-levelling beams, too! Note self-levelling... Not the little wheel you use if and when you remember it!!!

Just fitting something you came across on ebay, may NOT be legal or even safe!

Anyway, I digress as, people seem to take things far too personally... If you are not blinding everyone else and you think it looks cool, do it. If you you attract the attention of "Plod", be a man, (Or woman, depending on yopur sex) put your hand up and take the penalty. Don't try pleading ignorance or blaming the manufacturer for the stuff you bolt on your vehicle, thinking it's cool!

Ok makes a bit more sense. I totally agree on the use of aftermarket lights. I have paid good money for my Self levelling, auto washing xenon lights!

Is the new European legislation just the precursor to eco/money saving measures by government such as later lighting -up times, saving on street lighting at the twilights and after midnight.

Perhaps there is scope to still have these extra bright lights but to take advantage of them in ways the for "Gaud sake notice me " owners of the vehicles hadn't envisaged. Equipped with photo sensors the output of these lights could be regulated to match the ambient lighting conditions and even to adjust for oncoming traffic.

Who would have guessed this was possible ?

Nick

Second that!

The bit I said earlier about indicators... Someone noticed the "Inboard" bit ant interpreted correctly. The indicators should be on top, underneath or OUTSIDE the headlights, not inside, ie, nearer to the grill than the headlights. It IS loopheled by the use of wing mounted signals and, more frequently, by the ones in the mirrors. These are not illegal but they are often used so designers can put indicators closer to the grill, say in many Pugs, Focus' etc. The point about the illegal lighting, I think someone took too literal. I wqs NOT suggesting it is illeagal from the factory but if the owner then fits non standard "Unaproved" equipment, it could well be!

When I said how do you feel now, knowing your 20k motor is unfit for road use or possibly an mot failuire, it was a rhetorical question, NOT a direct one, aimed at anyone who had any 20k car!

As for HID's, If I remember correctly, to be legal, you must have wash-wipes fitted to the headlights AND self-levelling beams, too! Note self-levelling... Not the little wheel you use if and when you remember it!!!

Just fitting something you came across on ebay, may NOT be legal or even safe!

Anyway, I digress as, people seem to take things far too personally... If you are not blinding everyone else and you think it looks cool, do it. If you you attract the attention of "Plod", be a man, (Or woman, depending on yopur sex) put your hand up and take the penalty. Don't try pleading ignorance or blaming the manufacturer for the stuff you bolt on your vehicle, thinking it's cool!

All very valid points- but this thread was never about aftermarket HIDS etc, it's about Xenons and DRL's.

I've rarely been blinded by a factory Xenon or DRL (except for range Rovers right up my chuff) but aftermarket HIDS are a different thing entirely and I totally agree with you.