I'll keep this short and concise, but I'm at a loss what to do next and it's driving me crazy (literally)!!....

56 Octavia MK2 VRs FSH 85,000.

I have a vibration/shudder that frankly is making the car undriveable on the motorway. The vibration can be felt through the whole car and is worse at speed (70+) but definately though the whole range. The steering feels vague - almost like the wheels are loose. It's also worse when the car is loaded with passengers. I can feel the problem at all speeds, probably because I know the car well. The car has gone from a vehicle I felt very confident driving, to not wanting to go over 70. At the moment, I stay in the slow lane around 50!!!!.

It's been to many garages including two dealers and no one can find a fault - that said, no one has taken it on a motorway at speed.

Whats been checked;

- Countless wheel balances - everytime they give difference reading by 10-15 grams, rebalanced many times - no difference

- Tyres changed, wheels rotated - no difference

- Finally wanted to eliminate wheels and found a Hunter Roadforce. One wheel had a slight buckle on inside egde but balanced fine. RoadForce reported all wheels spot on lateral/radial runouts/tyre imperfections..etc - no difference

- 4 wheel alignment on Hunter system - everything spot on!

- Visually inspected (by several garages, including one with a ramp with vibration plates). Everything visible no problems,all bushes, steering components, shocks, springs. Skoda dealer ran safety check - no issues, recently MOT'd - no issues. That said, there's a large cover on the underside which prevents inspection of everything - to my knowledge, no one has taken this off (whats underneath?).

- I began to suspect maybe vibration is from powertrain. Ive read issues regarding the DMF. I do have a slight judder when moving off, and driving through town can be a bit jerky, but the vibration is definately still there when dipping the clutch at speed. I'm assuming this eliminates powertrain, DMF??

- One thing I have noticed is that hitting the brakes sharply at low speed, there's a dull 'clunk' from the near side, somewhere near the footwell? It's also there when going over small bumps again at low speed (this isn't brake pad clunck which everyone seems to be telling me). It has been down several potholes, that frankly I thought had ripped the wheel off (NSF).

Nothing has been taken apart yet - purely visual inspection.

Anyone any advice - this is driving me mad. Anyone recommend someone that knows what they are talking about in the West Midlands?

Edited 30 October, 201114 yr by sandyacreuk

Can't say I'm an expert but it might be worth thinking about the type of vibration you're suffering to see if it gives you, or anyone else, more of a clue.

Does it vary in pitch (the frequency changes) or amplitude (just gets louder) when you change speed (in the same gear), or when you change engine revs (keep same speed but change gear)?

The fact it's worse in a loaded car implies, to me anyway, that something up front (wheels, suspension, drivetrain etc) are less loaded and more free to vibrate.

I'm thinking it might also be something areodnamic (something loose flapping around that gets steadily louder the faster you go). Being fully loaded might lift the front of the car just enough to allow a different airflow and change the vibration.

Sorry this isn't much help, just my initial thoughts (which i'm sure you'd considered already) but hope you get it sorted.

My money is on the DMF.

The vast majority (if not all) of the symptoms you describe can be attributed to a dying dual mass flywheel.

Looks like you've gone through a fair few of the options there already.

A few questions that come to mind;

When the vibration is apparent, place the gearbox to neutral (where safe to do so, obviously!) - does that noise change/disappear/stay the same?

Does the noise happen in all gears at that speed? I expect you'd naturally be in 6th at that speed, but place the gearbox in 5th and note whether the noise changes at all. Then do the same in 4th.

I find it strange given all the things tried, that nobody's taken it for a roadtest! With these sorts of issue that's often the only way to diagnose.

On the DMF issue, I'd expect it to be noticeable before 70mph. And also that at that speed, once constant, that the DMF wouldn't be stressed in any way. Only if it was REALLY knackered and vibrating constantly. In which case, it would also vibrate at lower speeds.

I would also wonder whether there's an issue with some part of the braking system. A slightly warped disc perhaps? Although I'd expect this issue to become known first at a speed below 70mph. Worth a check though.

Best of luck

Ive a vibration and knocking noise which sounds like the car is falling to bits when i hit a small bump which is coming from the strut top bearings on there way out. A garage or dealers should of noticed that but thought id suggest it on the off chance there not looking that closely at the car

Can't say I'm an expert but it might be worth thinking about the type of vibration you're suffering to see if it gives you, or anyone else, more of a clue.

Does it vary in pitch (the frequency changes) or amplitude (just gets louder) when you change speed (in the same gear), or when you change engine revs (keep same speed but change gear)?

The fact it's worse in a loaded car implies, to me anyway, that something up front (wheels, suspension, drivetrain etc) are less loaded and more free to vibrate.

I'm thinking it might also be something areodnamic (something loose flapping around that gets steadily louder the faster you go). Being fully loaded might lift the front of the car just enough to allow a different airflow and change the vibration.

Sorry this isn't much help, just my initial thoughts (which i'm sure you'd considered already) but hope you get it sorted.

My money is on the DMF.

The vast majority (if not all) of the symptoms you describe can be attributed to a dying dual mass flywheel.

silver1011 - thanks for the reply. My thoughts were on this when I began researching DMFs. Low speed driveability is jumpy and I have to ride the clutch a lot - that said, when crusing at motorway speeds I have tried coasting in neutral, dipping the clutch and revving the engine (while maintainig speed) - the vibration/wobble does not change at all. Would this test eliminate the DMF??

I dont think its the DMF then if you dip the clutch and its still there, more likely to be suspension related, oddly i'm gettin a knocking on the left hand side more noticeable over small bumps in the road and i have noticed small spots of black grease on the wheel twice now... :(

I would get the hubs checked for runout.

I dont think its the DMF then if you dip the clutch and its still there, more likely to be suspension related, oddly i'm gettin a knocking on the left hand side more noticeable over small bumps in the road and i have noticed small spots of black grease on the wheel twice now... :(

That's a CV joint boot split IMHO. I'd get it changed before dirt gets in and you have to replace the whole joint.

Would that explain the knocking noise also??

Would that explain the knocking noise also??

I would think so. You don't seem to have had much luck at all with it.

Try it on full lock - if it knocks badly, it will normally be the CV joint.

lol nah i dont but i love it....

I had this happened to me once on my Renault.

Over 120km/h the steering vibrated badly, then over 140km/h it reduced, but still had vibrations.

It was a rubber bushing on right side front suspension triangle.

The air pressure going under car made this.

have you tried someone else's wheels and tyres (a complete set?). Bent driveshaft?

Give Midland VW a bell- they're the best VAG specialist I've used.

Just another idea, are all engine mounts OK. :yes:

I've been getting something similar in mine for the last few weeks...worse at 40-50 then better above 60, had thought it was just me being sensitive to the road surface but maybe not...

I've been getting something similar in mine for the last few weeks...worse at 40-50 then better above 60, had thought it was just me being sensitive to the road surface but maybe not...

Things like that point for wheels being out of balance. If it does feel on steering wheel at that speed then have it done and Im sure you will be happy driver after.

Going back to initial problem Im well supprised noone bothered with road test. How you can diagnose a problem when you dont know whats going on? To me with all what you have done so far it points as there might be a problem with:

1. Possible driveshaft play. If they move up and down easly they can create vibration at all speed and it will get bad at certain speed.

2. Possible play on suspension but them are intermittent from time to time. If yours is always there then I would look into rotating parts.

3. One of the things that was checked was mis-diagnosed. At this point I would like to suggest to check tyres again.

To do test put your hand on a tread and move it around tyre. It should be smooth on inside and outside. If you feel any imperfections - you found your problem. Just had customer with tyres with tread like saw on inside and he had it check in two places and everyone was saying - Its fine. We swaped tyres and proved them wrong. Those irregular tyres will make your ride much louder and it can create vibration as well. Balancing doesnt do job in 100%. That would explain why everytime you balance you get them 10-15g off.

sandyacreuk you said you had alignment done on Hunter - do you have a printout I could look at?

Edited 1 November, 201114 yr by allias

All,

Really appreciate all of your comments.

Allias

- driveshaft play / suspension - Several garages have looked at this and a Skoda dealer run a "safety check" after I asked for ALL bushes mounts to be checked - nothing found. The only one thing someone did spot was the offside drive shaft has a small amount of play in it. If you grab it you can move it 'in and out' by a few millimeters (the near side is solid) - no up/down movement at all. Would a few mm of play point to a problem?

- Wheels/Tyres - Ive had probably 20 re-balances (all sightly different interestingly) no difference. I've hopefully eliminated them up after having the roadforce test. Tyre heel & toe - This was suspected after I spoke with Dunlop who immediately asked me to check for a sawtooth feel to the tyre (inside edge). They have seen this create vibrations through the tyres. Tyres changed - no difference!!!

- 4 wheel alignment printout - yes, I will drop a copy on here asap.

alberg - engine mounts - I dont have access to a ramp so I can only see from the top of the engine. I'll check out.

cjb - driveshaft is something Im going to get checked out asap. Appreciate the link to Midland VW.

Totally frustrating, and it's difficult to get anyone to spend anytime trying to identify the problem.

BTW - anyone any ideas if there are any mounts/bushes hidden by the undertray? I remember when it was on the ramps, theres a large cover that no one has taken off yet.

Again, thanks for all your help.

BTW - anyone any ideas if there are any mounts/bushes hidden by the undertray? I remember when it was on the ramps, theres a large cover that no one has taken off yet.

Again, thanks for all your help.

I *think* the dogbone might be covered by the undertray? not sure.

alberg - engine mounts - I dont have access to a ramp so I can only see from the top of the engine. I'll check out.

You dont need a ramp to check it. You need someone who can help you. Start car, pull hand brake and try to take off. As you rock your engine trying to take off (going in 1st and later in reverse) see for engine movement under the bonnet. If movement is visibale within engine bay then one of the mounts is damaged. Engine should sit solid.

as far play in driveshaft - what you desribe is normal.

Are you based?

Allias,

Here's the printouts of the 4 wheel alignment. I had one done in Jan and another done in Aug. I cant embed the picture link - you'll have to go to the following url.

https://skydrive.live.com/redir.aspx?cid=b25bbf56fa0d12e2&page=play&resid=B25BBF56FA0D12E2!825

Note - the guys advised the NS rear toe shows out of spec, but by so little it's not worth cost of adjusting.

I'm convinced this is a suspension / drivetrain problem. I'm hoping I can rule out the DMF as the problem definately doesnt change when I coast at speed / dip the clutch / rev the engine. Although the clutch does judder and it's jerky to drive around town - perhaps it's on its way out (problem 2!). Reading up they only seem to last around 80,000 miles - marvellous invention!.

On alignment side I would say it does look good but Im suppried they havent adjust back to 100% correct position. I know those specs would coused your problem so defently you can rule out alignment problem. To bad you that far as I would love to check it.