Hey guys,

Well I've finally decided I think I'm gonna keep the fabia and just spend a bit more money on it, basically I'm looking to run a safe 240bhp ad wondering whether a hybrid or the darkside developments kit would be the best all round choice?

I like the idea of the manifold etc that comes with the darkside kit as it looks the part, however if I was to go hybrid id probably buy the manifold anyway if this was possible to run along with the hybrid without any major modification. I'm currently running a pd160 intake with standard paper element filter, remap and the tx autosport intercooler. Since fitting the cooler I've def noticed a difference, pulls harder, less smoker and a bit quicker. In sure this cooler would be adequate? Thoughts?

So all I'd need really is the turbo kit/hybrid, clutch and exhaust? Or is the standard exhaust ok for 240bhp? What clutch would be best? I don't mind running a smf if it's going to handle the power best.

Bascially looking for all the pros and cons of each option, what difference I might expect between the two, hybrid spool quicker, bigger turbo more top end etc I generally don't take the car over 4.5k if that would be any help. The car is very well maintained and serviced every 5k genuine parts good oil etc and everything mechanical is good, so I imagine the internals would be ok for 240? Im also running 312 brakes up front with 256 rear.

I'm located in northern Ireland so any mapping would be done by torque tronix which I have a very high opinion of, they've built countless hybrids do have experience there. With the darkside kit however it's usually darkside themselves that do the mapping, so I wouldnt have that option. Would that be anything to worry about? Dave at TT is very capable so the mapping shouldn't be an issue but just would like your thoughts?

Regarding the exhaust, miltek sports cat and cat back would be ideal, what does the downpipe with the darkside kit involve? Would that mean I'd have to run no cat?

Thanks guys

Jordan

Edited 18 July, 201213 yr by wilsy7

I will follow this as I have been wondering the same

This is turning into an interesting thread, personally don't like the Forge logo on the FMIC tbh I'd prefer it plain more stealth, and there's the fact that it isn't a Forge item.

Southbend do a SMF kit in various levels of torque ratings for your requirements on the Darkside site. Not cheap though but get very good reviews across the pond in USA. It's what I would probaly go for.

I think I'd go for the Darkside kit to be fair, if you get bored you can go to race injectors and a differerant turbo setup.

Just my opinions. Good luck deciding what you do and be sure to show the results.

This is turning into an interesting thread, personally don't like the Forge logo on the FMIC tbh I'd prefer it plain more stealth, and there's the fact that it isn't a Forge item.

Southbend do a SMF kit in various levels of torque ratings for your requirements on the Darkside site. Not cheap though but get very good reviews across the pond in USA. It's what I would probaly go for.

I think I'd go for the Darkside kit to be fair, if you get bored you can go to race injectors and a differerant turbo setup.

Just my opinions. Good luck deciding what you do and be sure to show the results.

It's really not very noticeable on the car which I like but If you spot it, it looks pretty good, just my opinion. I know it's not a forge, just makes it look like one lol was more concerned whether it will be able to cope, I think it should be fine as its fully exposed to the air flow, anytime I check it during a run it's always freezing unless I'm driving on a bit there would be a bit of heat in it as expected in sure but even at that the outlet pipe remains cold I'll have a look at the smf thanks, I would have went for the darkside kit hands down a while back but of late see a few things saying the big turbo is more overrated than a hybrid. How do you feel regarding the mapping, having it fitted and mapped by a company other than darkside themselves?

Cheers

Jordan

Darkside kit will be more "comfortable" at that power level, especially if you get the GTB2260vk turbo. It will have potential for much more.

Darkside kit will be more "comfortable" at that power level, especially if you get the GTB2260vk turbo. It will have potential for much more.

Going by their website the 2056 isn't available anymore so I'd have to be the 2260, would it be ok running 240? I know it's capable of 310 going by the website, would it be very laggy and sluggish? Because its prob not getting into its stride running 240?

Cheers

Jordan

2260 doesn't start to tail off like a hybrid can, feels like it wants to keep going way past the limiter/fuel cut. to me the difference between a hybrid and 2260 is similar to the difference between a standard (PD160) and a hybrid, given the availability I wouldn't think of going hybrid these days

as above, the 2260vk don't forget is a STOCK turbo, not a hybrid. And because being the latest design, the boost doesn't come in any later than a normal turbo. Ultimately however, the way the turbo cuts in and when is down to mapping, not the turbo itself. Really a mapper needs to know the compressor map for the turbo before they start playing.

Would it be worth getting the turbine wheel blades cutback at all? Or better off leaving as they are? What sort of figures could Wilsy7 see with above mods and Darkside Kit fitted without breaking anything, anymore than 240bhp reliably?

Edited 18 July, 201213 yr by redcupraboy

From what I've seen/read... the 2260VK is very good but it is still a very big turbo compared to the original KKK tiddler. Getting a smokeless tune that's responsive might prove a challenge.

Closest match for stock responsiveness would be the 1756VK which itself is a 210-230HP turbo.

Something of a shame the 2056 isn't available to fill the gap between 1756 and 2260 IMO.

How much money are we talking to get a standard vRS to 240bhp ?

There's a 2260 on edition 38 forsale at the minute

Cant see that intercooler sufficing! Been reports on seatsport owners even the forge 130 item struggles with 220 plus!! And yours is half the size!

You need to aim bigger my friend

Cant see that intercooler sufficing! Been reports on seatsport owners even the forge 130 item struggles with 220 plus!! And yours is half the size!

Was this track use or just general street use?I guess it all depends on what the car will be used for. I would expect any intercooler to struggle after a couple of laps around a race track

Was this track use or just general street use?I guess it all depends on what the car will be used for. I would expect any intercooler to struggle after a couple of laps around a race track

I had a bigger intercooler on mine, it quite happily worked for lap after lap of Brands hatch with no noticable tail of of performance over 20 minutes.

As you say, it depends what you want to do with the car.

On the Darkside site they have/had a chart to show when the various turbos achieve full boost.

It showed that the bigger the turbo, the higher rpm until full boost was achieved. Smaller ones were around 2,200rpm which is great for everyday driving. The large one was around 3,200rpm. Which is too close to the redline for me personally as you'd just get it singing and it's be time to change gear.

A huge turbo coming in higher up the rev range is great for Santa Pod as you are ragging it. But on the road or on a track when you are going up and down the rev range due to a pesky thing called corners I'd rather have a slightly smaller turbo and have the car on song than keep falling out of the powerband during corners. Mid corner gear changes to get you back in the powerband on the way out of the corner are not generally a good idea IMO.

This is exactly why my new project will be not run huge power, it will run good power that's usuable making it a better drive and faster in normal circumstances.

Look at the last Briskoda action day. The faster Fabia VRS deisel was not the most powerful there.

I think the quickest was around 200bhp with a very good set up including brakes and suspension. This is the secret of being quick.

Yes, driver ability and commitment are a factor, but it's quickest lap was around 2 or 3 seconds faster than a 270bhp one.

The 270bhp would blitz the 200bhp one down Santa Pod, but not on the road and not on a track. It would be much, much closer IMO.

This is why I went for a set up that got the boost in early. Slightly less powerful so not as good for pub talk, but very quick.

I had a bigger intercooler on mine, it quite happily worked for lap after lap of Brands hatch with no noticable tail of of performance over 20 minutes.

As you say, it depends what you want to do with the car.

On the Darkside site they have/had a chart to show when the various turbos achieve full boost.

It showed that the bigger the turbo, the higher rpm until full boost was achieved. Smaller ones were around 2,200rpm which is great for everyday driving. The large one was around 3,200rpm. Which is too close to the redline for me personally as you'd just get it singing and it's be time to change gear.

A huge turbo coming in higher up the rev range is great for Santa Pod as you are ragging it. But on the road or on a track when you are going up and down the rev range due to a pesky thing called corners I'd rather have a slightly smaller turbo and have the car on song than keep falling out of the powerband during corners. Mid corner gear changes to get you back in the powerband on the way out of the corner are not generally a good idea IMO.

This is exactly why my new project will be not run huge power, it will run good power that's usuable making it a better drive and faster in normal circumstances.

Look at the last Briskoda action day. The faster Fabia VRS deisel was not the most powerful there.

I think the quickest was around 200bhp with a very good set up including brakes and suspension. This is the secret of being quick.

Yes, driver ability and commitment are a factor, but it's quickest lap was around 2 or 3 seconds faster than a 270bhp one.

The 270bhp would blitz the 200bhp one down Santa Pod, but not on the road and not on a track. It would be much, much closer IMO.

This is why I went for a set up that got the boost in early. Slightly less powerful so not as good for pub talk, but very quick.

I know where your coming from but anytime im driving the car fairly hard, corners included, the revs would rarely/never drop below 3000rpm so I don't think the full boost Rpm would be an issue, as It would always be kept about that 3000 band. Your right tho when it comes to everyday pottling about town etc, but I'm not really concerned with that an the higher boost Rpm as I could quite happily have 50bhp when pottling about and not notice the difference

This could also be good for fuel economy as it

Would be running off boost when driving easy. I'm not going for the big turbo just to say I have it, would go for the 2056 if it was still available, just want something that is capable of running the power comfortable

Cheers

Jordan

Not wanting to promote another forum - but if you're wanting to go big turbo have a look at Ibizaoc forum and Tom. 's build thread.

He has a big turbo Ibiza and has documented the build right from the beginning. An interesting read but set aside about 2 hrs lol. It'll show you everything that is needed to get towards 300bhp - Im not sure if he's even there yet! And I hate to think how much he has spent. Impressive stuff though

A safe setup on a hybrid VB your looking around 215bhp. If you want more then go the GTB route.

For road driving i'd want one that gives the widest power band. Area under the curve is what you want

Cant see that intercooler sufficing! Been reports on seatsport owners even the forge 130 item struggles with 220 plus!! And yours is half the size!

You need to aim bigger my friend

Any of the behind-bumper-bar intercoolers are somewhat slim (40mm) plus suffer from having part of the i/c masked by the bar. The below the bar ones tend to be 65mm (well, the cheap ones...).

J.

you can't just look at where peak boost is made to decide if a turbo is good or bad, you need to know what boost the turbo is making across the rev range. I know it's running different fuelling, but look at the dyno printout of a PD150 Golf with a 2260, I think it'll probably drive quite nicely on the road

Personally I don't like how theirs nothing below 2.5k.

We run our own gtb2260vk kit on our demo fabia and tbh we bloody love it pulls so well you can stick your foot down in 6th and the power is there. Really is fun to drive would recommend it to anyone.

We run our own gtb2260vk kit on our demo fabia and tbh we bloody love it pulls so well you can stick your foot down in 6th and the power is there. Really is fun to drive would recommend it to anyone.

I'd love to see a dyno run on that, because the numbers suggest you need revs.

We run our own gtb2260vk kit on our demo fabia and tbh we bloody love it pulls so well you can stick your foot down in 6th and the power is there. Really is fun to drive would recommend it to anyone.

Who are "we"?

Hi bossfox We are taking it for rolling road in a few weeks so I will post them up for you ASAP me and my brother own our own business doing turbo kits and serviceing to the pd130/150 range . Hope this helps