Animal lovers sign this. Please.

[danny6189]

This properly upset me. Please sign this petition. It may not change a thing. But what is 5 minutes of your time. There is a undercover video on this but I don't really want to post it.

Do it on a fag break

Do it on lunch or before you go to bed or before work. Just do it.

http://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/stop-raccoon-dogs-being-skinned-alive-in-china-for-fake-ugg-boots-suffering-slow-sickening-horrendous-deaths?utm_campaign=share_button_mobile&utm_medium=facebook&utm_source=share_petition

[danny6189]

Any sarcastic or I don't like animals comments, keep them to yourselves.

Thank you.

[ell]

Signed, cant see how anyone could do something like that..

[Dark_Hero]

Signed. The Chinese are sick

[R1DAVIE]

Signed, horrified quite frankly :'(

[RobsterVRS]

Signed, didn't even watch the video as I cannot bear to see stuff like that. Thanks to Danny6189 for posting it.

[Macdemon]

Even if you don't like animals.......how can you ignore it and let it continue???

Lets drop a Sarin bomb on China and watch them suffer

[seboni121]

Seen this before and worse ! , its not just dogs that are butchered in this way , I've signed and am truly disgusted but what we need to remember different people in different countries look at pets in a different way, we are looking through western eyes not condoning it but pets are produce for a fast section of this global community, fake stuff is cheaper and people will buy it , must remember next time I'm in turkey get a fake rolex

[Gwilo]

but what we need to remember different people in different countries look at pets in a different way, we are looking through western eyes not condoning it but pets are produce for a fast section of this global community

And therein lies the rub. The Chinese don't see dogs etc as pets, they see them as a protein source, and many are bred for precisely that.

over here, we've just had some quarters up in arms over horsemeat.......what was it that they were bothered about, that it was horse, or that they weren't told? A radio presenter summed it up saying if you want to pay a quid for your lasagne, you've got no right to complain about what's in it, you can't expect it to be beef.

In europe, some countries eat horse, some eat donkey, some eat seals, some eat cuts of an animal we'd turn our nose up at.

While inhuman treatment is not acceptable I'd agree, western mores shouldn't be imposed forcibly on other cultures just because we don't understand it.

[Huskoda]

I think the issue here is the animals are being skinned alive and then left to die a horribly painful death.

It wouldn't take much to kill the animal first then skin it.

I love eating meat and have no problem with fur/leather, but that people can do this sickened me.

[seboni121]

I think the issue here is the animals are being skinned alive and then left to die a horribly painful death.

It wouldn't take much to kill the animal first then skin it.

I love eating meat and have no problem with fur/leather, but that people can do this sickened me.

I understand where you are coming from but if it was killed before skinned blood would spoil the fur , this is why they do it that way , they would drug them first but spoil the meat, suffocating them would be better IMO but all that takes time, so not sure what the answer is here

[Huskoda]

I think they have ways around it with the sheep and cows they kill here for their meat and skins.

Even if it would take more effort, this kind of behaviour is inexcusable.

[painejake]

I understand where you are coming from but if it was killed before skinned blood would spoil the fur , this is why they do it that way , they would drug them first but spoil the meat, suffocating them would be better IMO but all that takes time, so not sure what the answer is here

Answer is simple. Don't do it. We don't allow fox fur to be used anymore how is this any different?

[seboni121]

Answer is simple. Don't do it. We don't allow fox fur to be used anymore how is this any different?

Different country and values. We shouldn't expect people from different parts of the world to live with our standards of morality, fox skins where used in this country not very long ago, not condoning it its the way life is

[seboni121]

I think they have ways around it with the sheep and cows they kill here for their meat and skins.

Even if it would take more effort, this kind of behaviour is inexcusable.

Inexcusable? Yes we kill more humanly but these infrastructure cost and they are poor catch 22 I'm afraid

[danny6189]

Forget what they are doing it for. The animals are still alive and suffering. Has anyone seen the video with the Dog that has been skinned and is still alive?

Start doing that with murders and rapists and I'm sure the world will have something to say. But with animals in china it's a case of out of sight out of mind.

[Gwilo]

Forget what they are doing it for. The animals are still alive and suffering. Has anyone seen the video with the Dog that has been skinned and is still alive?

Start doing that with murders and rapists and I'm sure the world will have something to say. But with animals in china it's a case of out of sight out of mind.

You may have a valid point, but it's also about not interfering with other cultures, imposing our sensibilities on a situation in a heavy handed manner. Long live the empire, and all that.

I don't presume to know how much reading around you've done on the petitions subject, however a few points to consider.

1. The petition organiser appears to be a one-man outfit with a single topic agenda, though much is made of saying "they" are against all animal cruelty.

2. The entry about the racoon dogs quotes a member of HSI. HSI work with governments etc to find practical, culturally senstive solutions - according to their own PR output. Therefore, one can assume the matter will be brought to the attention of the relevant authorities and discussions had.

3. Some internet petition isn't going to influence a rogue outift in China, regardless of any laws that may, or indeed may not, apply locally. Rogues will always flout the law and it's no different from some of activities filmed in abbatoirs and intensive farms in this country.

4. While it doesn't detract from the barbaric treatment, and I'm not seeking to justifiy it here, but racoon dogs are not actually dogs. The majority of people in this country are (probably) unconcerned with how the leather in their jacket/fur in boots/steak on plate/bacon in bap was treated, as long as the price is right and it feels ethical to them. Calling these animals dogs immediately taps into the "mans best friend" sentiment and therefore makes it less acceptable than if it was a cow being shot in the head with a faulty stun bolt, being repeatedly electrocuted with a cattle prod, having it's throat slit and then being chainsawed in half, while still alive?

I'm really not against you here, but society can't pick and choose pet projects and turn a blind eye to comparable "crimes" taking place on our own shores. You're either against all or you're not. To treat one species of animal life as somehow more valuable than another based on cuteness or how violent the killing, is just a bit naive - and that's general comment, not one targeted at the OP.

[seboni121]

http://www.canids.org/species/nyctereutes_procyonoides.htm

[Gwilo]

http://www.canids.or...rocyonoides.htm

Seb, while the background info deepens our understanding of the species, the OPs reaction is more about the treatment. Most westerners, of which i'm loosely a part of, would agree with the sentiment that's hopefully motivated this thread - Even if a species is rated as "least concern", it still doesn't allow inhumane treatment, regardless of where or towards whoever/whatever. We just need to see that different cultures have different values though, and accept that, rather than berate and take a holier than thou stance, which, sadly, a growing majority of these internet campaign groups tend to adopt. Best to starve them of publicity and attention and if anyone is serious about animal rights, then get involved with established, reputable organisations that have an appreciable public profile.

Edited 28 February, 2013 by Gwilo

[kaa]

there is no excuse for such treatment of anything be it animal or human in such a way. Using "its a different culture" is just a poor reason for letting it happen after all I bet they'd get upset if somewhere showed children being treat the same.

The animals should be killed humanely by injection or some other method first not skinned alive, you just cant imagine the pain they must go through in those hours before death.

But we cant aim solely at the chinese after the incident with the dog in Sheffield being set alight

[Huskoda]

Something being part of culture or tradition does not inherently give it a right to exist. At some point human sacrifice was part of culture and tradition and it was rightly stopped. In our culture women were not given the vote and were treated as second class citizens. There are cultures now that treat women as livestock or practise genital mutilation. They shouldn't be defended either just based on them being different and people are working hard to eliminate such primitive and barbaric practises.

Causing unnecessary suffering through cruelty can't just be excused away by saying its a different culture.

They don't really need anything fancy here, just break the animals neck first then skin it. Neither fur nor meat would be spoiled by that. This is just laziness and cruelty for the fun of it.

Edit: And I'm not exactly some deranged animal rights fanatic. You can take my veal steaks and fur lined leather boots from my cold, dead hands (feet?). I'd just prefer they were produced in a humane way.