Ferodo DS2500's, Performance pad? My Arse.

[James I]

I wonder if the DS2500 really is a good brake pad?

 I have had EBC Yellow stuff in the past and most people claim they are rubbish and crumble to nothing, Ferodo is always recommended, so when I got the Golf I fitted Ferodo DS2500's at a cost of £150 for the front axle compared to £75 for Yellow stuff, I didn't mind this extra cost as everybody said they were excellent.

 

 Well, after 500 miles on the Golf I was very underwhelmed with the DS2500's so decided an upgrade was needed, today I removed the pads and quite frankly was shocked at what I found, DS2500's crumbling away from the edges!

 

 Here is the proof of my findings and I will be contacting Ferodo direct to see if my money can be refunded.

 

 Pads were fitted at the same time as new discs which were not grooved or drilled and I observed the bedding in period.

 

 

 

 

[Yeti_Man]

How did you bed them in? They dont look right to me. Mine were bedded in pretty hard and as recommended and they were by far the best pads I've ever had. Great from cold and just got better the hotter they got. Only time I really over cooked them was in the Yeti whilst doing a decently long downhill section of an Austrian pass - they were smoking. Five minutes cooling off and they were as good as new.

[James I]

Pads were fitted along with new discs. Then a steady drive of short journeys to get some gradual heat into them, later the same day it was a dual carriageway run, 70 mph, traffic lights and roundabouts so speeding up and slowing down, initial braking efficiency was good. That was September time, after that just usual everyday driving, October we did a track day, no more than 10 laps before we came in to cool down, probably did 50 laps all day.

 Since then it has just been occasional use, nipping here and there with a mix of driving, the pads you see above have only stopped the car for about 500 miles from new in September.

 

 I would have expected more from them, the EBC pads I had in the Fabia were fitted in the evening before a track day so they were bedded in rather harshly but did not crumble like these have.

[niceyellow vrs]

James, I've never tried the Ferrodos so can't add comment on them but I do swear by Tarox corsa .401. I've used them on my Octavia and I'm just waiting for another set to arrive from Italy for the Rover. I pay £140 from Larkspeed for them for the Rover so they aint cheap but I've never ever had any brake fade with them during very hard Road Rally driving and track work. Worth a look I reckons. 

[James I]

James, I've never tried the Ferrodos so can't add comment on them but I do swear by Tarox corsa .401. I've used them on my Octavia and I'm just waiting for another set to arrive from Italy for the Rover. I pay £140 from Larkspeed for them for the Rover so they aint cheap but I've never ever had any brake fade with them during very hard Road Rally driving and track work. Worth a look I reckons. 

 

 Do you do any special bedding in of your pads before going out on a competitive rally?   I am not bothered about the price, I was looking at DS3000's for the Brembo calliper and they are £200+ but if they are going to crumble I don't see the point, I will look for something else, not Ferodo.

[niceyellow vrs]

The last set arrived on the day of a rally so I quickly threw them on the car when I got home from work and went out for a quick drive. Gentle braking at first and then progressively harder. Managed to get about 60 miles of country lanes onto before the start of the rally and then after 60 miles of rally they were definately bedded in

[Yeti_Man]

Do you do any special bedding in of your pads before going out on a competitive rally?   I am not bothered about the price, I was looking at DS3000's for the Brembo calliper and they are £200+ but if they are going to crumble I don't see the point, I will look for something else, not Ferodo.

I specifically bed mine in (as opposed to just bedding them in whilst driving around). 20 odd stops increasing in speed and for longer durations but never coming to a stop (so off the pedal at around 20mph) and given time to cool every four or five goes before increasing the speed). Always served me well and the two sets I've had have never had issues and last extremely well (usually eating through the disk at the same rate!) I've given/sold both of mine to others who have used them on their cars as and when I've upgraded to bigger setups/different calipers. Again, mine weren't like that so I'd be taking issue with the manufacturer or supplier after such a small amount of use.

[James I]

I am reading other forums and it would seem that DS2500's do not cope well with heat and are not recommended for anything more than fast road applications. Track is a no no for these pads.

 Now I know people slate Yellow stuff from EBC and say they crumble but for half the price of the Ferodo's I had no issues at all with them, this seems to turn the saying "you get what you pay for" on its head!

[Yeti_Man]

I am reading other forums and it would seem that DS2500's do not cope well with heat and are not recommended for anything more than fast road applications. Track is a no no for these pads.

Now I know people slate Yellow stuff from EBC and say they crumble but for half the price of the Ferodo's I had no issues at all with them, this seems to turn the saying "you get what you pay for" on its head!

Brakes is an area where Ive always said you get what you pay for as every experience I've had has proved it to me. I've had the EBCs before and they weren't great but they were on a light car and that was said to be the problem by the supplier. IMO the ds2500's simply get better the more heat you put through them. Iirc Ferrodo actually suggest you bed them in with 5-600 degrees of heat! Id suggest the way they got pushed when I've driven Grossglockner pass and the amazing North Italian roads, Davos towards Stelvio pass proved them to me with no doubts whatsoever and that was in a relatively heavy car. Cars that i was travelling with experienced brake issues, mainly fade and biling of the fluid. (i had ATE Super Blue) Certainly my current Porsche setup with Mintex M1144's (running the same fluid) would give out way before my Ferrodo's did. Next move for me is to get some DS2500's back in there ASAP.

[James I]

I have some you can have..............

 

 I have emailed Ferodo to see what they say, I have DS3000's in the callipers I fitted today, they have about 7mm left on them and they look fine to be honest.  

 I will post up again when I have something back off them 

[James I]

I got a response off Ferodo this morning, it would seem it is all my fault for not following a bedding in ritual that is not documented.  I did drive about 100 miles of stop start in the car so as a few heat cycles were through the pads but try proving that to Ferodo, anyway, here is there response.

Any way, does anybody know the part number for Mintex pads that will fit Brembo callipers as Ferodo can do one!

 

 

Dear Sir, If you want to make a claim you should contact your dealer or service station where you bought the pads. What I could see from the presented photos the reason for this condition is probably incorrect entering into exploitation, overheating. Usually it happens as a result of heavy braking in the first 50-100 miles after the installation

[Sparkly]

That is apalling customer service in my eyes Jamie.  Gutted to hear this.

 

For a reference for everyone else on here, my friend ran EBC Yellowstuff on his Golf Mk IV and at the end of their life having covered many many k's he took them off to change for some new ones and found the pads had crumbled and begun to come away from their backing.

 

EBC, in spite of the decent life/usage he had already extracted from the pads, STILL sent out a replacement set as a gesture and to show their commitment to quality.

 

Lesson to be learnt for Ferodo methinks as these pads have been talked up on this forum in a big way, but now we see what support you get if they do go wrong, bit shoddy.  Are these pads so fussy that you if you don't quite observe a 100% perfect bedding in period according to Ferodo HQ that they fall to bits, I think not.

 

Piffle

[BossFox]

I'm running the DS2500 pads in the diesel Yeti.

Very happy with them, but I did 400 miles on the road before taking to the track.

Stops well, noticably better than stock and also not had any fade issues.

They were fitted with the original discs that had 26k miles on them, but are not heavilly marked.

[James I]

Seems to be the case that Ferodo are over rated, I was laughed at when i bought Yellow Stuff pads but in my opinion they were better than Ferodo's.

 

 

 I am now contacting Ferodo again and Larkspeed where I bought them from to see what can be done if anything.

 

 

 So, what pads should I use in my brembo's as they will need new pads after the track day in February.... 

 

Tarox?

Mintex?

EBC?

 

Will do some research i think, see what comes up..

[James I]

In your case Richard, if fitting Ferodo to the Citigo, would you be able to do 500 road miles to bed the pads in?  Or anybody else for that matter with a track car, probably not, I was quite miffed that none of this bedding in ritual was documented in the fitting notes or on the ferodo website...

 

 I am not expecting much back from these guys and will not be sending them anymore of my money either!

[snow_muncher]

That's a pretty poor customer service

 

Would have cost little to send out some replacements, rather than peeing a customer off

 

Have heard good things about about EBC Blue

 

The OEM spec Mintex/Pagid pads cann't cope with fast road driving, let alone anything more sustained

 

ps

 

The bedding in instructions the blue stuff basically the same as for DS2500/3000

 

The LCR/Junior GT caliper + 323mm setup is prone to poor heat dissipation, so if you want to give the pads the best chance fit some bells and rotors

[Sparkly]

That's a pretty poor customer service

 

Would have cost little to send out some replacements, rather than peeing a customer off

 

 

 

The LCR/Junior GT caliper + 323mm setup is prone to poor heat dissipation, so if you want to give the pads the best chance fit some bells and rotors

 

Totally agree on the customer service, they should know the effect of a bad news story like this, even worse when it ends up with no offer or gesture of support from the supplier. Just dumb really as word of mouth on here probably sells a healthy number of sets for them.

 

On the GT Juniors that would actually make sense given those small (well relatively) 4 pot calipers have got such an enclosed design and then combine that with big stopping power ratio'd to small (relatively) discs.  Had never condidered that. Interesting.  Shame that's a more costly disc option short term.

[Yeti_Man]

 I was quite miffed that none of this bedding in ritual was documented in the fitting notes or on the ferodo website...

 

 

I think it is documented on there as im pretty sure thats where I hit for instructions for bedding mine in.

 

edit - http://www.ferodoracing.com/it/car_racing/pad_bedding.htm

 

They used to have two slightly different guides - one was specific for the DS series (or at least for non full race pads) iirc.

[BossFox]

Not heard about running them in if I am honest, it was just because I was using the car on the road too...

[James I]

I followed that run in with the Golf on the road, probably not getting them quite hot enough on the road.

 First run out on track was a steady away job too as I had bolted the car together and was rather dubious about my ability lol    I did about 4 laps and then in for a check over BUT all this is irrelevant Ferodo will not be assisting with any issues I have as in their eyes it is my fault that pads failed.

[James I]

I am a little happier this afternoon as Rob at Larkspeed has had a reply from the importer of the Ferodo pads, contrary to the reply I got from Ferodo themselves the importer claims the problem is that of rust! Yes, RUST, because my car only gets occasional use the pads have a high iron content and therefore they rust and corrode away, you couldn't make it up could you!!

 

 Here is the reply from Larkspeed.

 

 

Hi Jamie,

     That’s very strange I have only seen this kind of reaction with pads that have suffered extreme heat, this causes the pads to crumble as the bonding agent that holds everything together starts to break up. Do you have any pictures of the discs?

Regards Rob

 

Rob Watkins

Sales Manager

Larkspeed Ltd

Tel: 01132643231

Mail: [email protected]

Web: www.larkspeed.com

Thanks for your interest in Larkspeed. We hope you find any quotes acceptable and that we have dealt with your enquiry well.

[kentphil1]

James I, I may be wrong, but looking at that last email, I think they want piccies of the discs as they are looking for extreme heat blueing.

 

Like I said, I may be wrong, so don't give up quite yet, as a picture says a thousand words in your defence if you show them the discs dont show signs of extreme abuse.

 

Hope it helps,

 

Phil.

[JoshH]

James, EBC yellow are actually getting a good rep now. Quality is much improved and they are the ONLY pad the can be run in the Civic Cup series.

[Dark_Hero]

Sorry to see you've had problems with these James. I for one was interested in these. It is strange that they would fail like this as they aren't strictly street legal, so should be used for track days etc. hope it all works out for you though

[Cossie1]

I had DS2500's in my Evo, upto 400bhp they were awesome, but very dusty, when running over 600bhp they were very quick to give major brake fade (even on just a spirited 2 mile drive down a country lane).

 

Due to that I never bothered with them on the vRS, and used DS3000's instead.

 

When I fitted the 3000's (with new discs) it was the day before the trackday, so they only got bedded in gentle on the way to combe, but after the first 2 or 3 laps they have bedded in fully.

 

Sadly the gearbox went bang on that day (after about 10 - 12 laps), and I ended up being towed 40 miles home on a rope behind a double cab tipper transit. However due to going down steep hills I ended up doing the braking for me and the transit

 

Needless to say that set of DS3000's have now worn out after just 30 or 40 laps of combe and maybe 500 miles of road use.

 

Oh and you can get DS3000's for LCR brembo's for under £150 delivered