Which model should we get?

[pauper]

We live on a smallholding in rural Wales.  We currently have a diesel Fiat Panda, which we chose partly for its fuel economy.  We currently average 60 - 65mpg which is excellent, but that is mainly because we seldom have to do much stop-start driving in traffic, and quite a lot of our milage comprises long journeys to the SE of England to visit aged parents.  The other reason we bought the Panda (it's a 2006 one we got s/h a couple of years ago) is that it can tow 1000kg braked which is quite generous for a small car - better I think than most of the petrol versions.  We need to occasionally tow a braked trailer and the 1 tonne limit is very useful.

 

However we will need to replace it before it's worn out and worth less, or indeed worthless.  We have been looking at the Fabias, the diesels seem to have a similar generous towing limit, and our attention was drawn to the fuel economy claims for the Greenline. However, see my earlier post about why Skoda won't allow a towbar on a Greenline.  What sort of fuel economy (not while towing, just normal use in non-urban roads) might we expect from a non-greenline diesel? 

 

We think we must be fairly light of foot because not many other people seem to manage as much as 65mpg from a Panda.  Before that we had in succession two 1.5 diesel peugeot 106's,  which were both actually better on fuel than the Panda. When we first got the Panda with its modern common rail turbocharged engine we drove it like we used to drive the Peugeots (non-turbo non-electronic diesels), and the Panda got much worse fuel consumption than the Peugeot, in the mid 50's.  We have since learned to modify our driving style to try to keep the turbocharger spinning - it is completely gutless below about 2000rpm and also apparently very fuel inefficient.  I wonder if different driving styles (including just driving faster and harder of course) account for the wildly different figures that people on this forum claim for the same cars?

 

Anyway we'd be interested to hear anyone else's experience with the various diesel Fabia II models.

 

 

[BossFox]

Personally I think you'll get the same MPG from the Fabia.

I've averaged 65mpg in a non-greenline 1.6 diesel.

[MarginWalker]

My 1.9 PD averages 50-55 mpg but 60 mpg can easily be achieved by sticking to speed limits and keeping it in the 'sweet spot' rev range (1900-2100 rpm). I have managed 68 mpg once or twice. Plenty of urge when you want to make decent progress and as reliable as a Sherman tank. One of the finest sub 2-litre diesel engine designs of all time IMO, but somewhat old school in the refinement department.

[davidwhite]

Hi, whilst I can't comment on towing capability I will recommend and endorse wholeheartedly MarginWalker's post my 1.9tdi pd 3 whilst not the most refined or quitest engined car regularly return high 50's low 60's mpg ok I don't drive ''fast '' nor do I drive with purely economy in mind ( I have seen approaching 70 mpg on the M1 restricted 50 mph stretch regarding the 1.6 cr diesel much has be said regarding the requirement to keep the revs 'high' to be more economical would this be achievable when towing ?  

[MarginWalker]

I've read several posts about the need to use a different driving style to get the best out of the 1.6 CR. I'm not sure I like the idea of driving a diesel that you need to rev like a petrol engine but I'm sure the 105 hp version of the 1.6 CR would be a good puller for your trailer. Having driven the 75hp version of this engine (courtesy car), which was quieter but considerably slower and less torquey than my 1.9, I would advise against anything other than the 105 hp version of the Fabia 1.6 CR TDi for your needs.

Some are of the opinion that the 1.9 PD is a more flexible engine than the 1.6 CR, offering more of its torque at lower revs. If you want a car less than 4 years old however, then you'll have to forget the 1.9, as it was replaced by the 1.6 in 2010, at the same time as the Mk 2 Fabia facelift. You'd be lucky to find a 1.9 PD Fabia with less than 50 k on the clock, but then we're talking about an engine that is capable of running for over 200 k miles without major issues provided it is serviced according to schedule.

Edited 3 July, 2014 by MarginWalker

[tamiyaandy]

Depending on the age your looking at, I can highly recommend the 1.4Tdi 80, I can see 70+MPG on motorways, and always in the 60s for daily use.

 

The long term memory has now been running for 1450 miles and is showing 63.7MPG :clap:

 

Plus being a 3-Cylinder it makes some great little growls through the rev range

[BossFox]

I've read several posts about the need to use a different driving style to get the best out of the 1.6 CR. I'm not sure I like the idea of driving a diesel that you need to rev like a petrol engine but I'm sure the 105 hp version of the 1.6 CR would be a good puller for your trailer. Having driven the 75hp version of this engine (courtesy car), which was quieter but considerably slower and less torquey than my 1.9, I would advise against anything other than the 105 hp version of the Fabia 1.6 CR TDi for your needs.

 

It's not so much having to drive it like a petrol and rev it.  More like just making sure you have enough revs to be on the turbo if you want to accelerate.

In my experience accelerating from low revs (under maybe 2,000) causes the engine to throw fuel through the engine as the turbo isn't up to speed, which harms economy.

 

I had the same talk with the guy who serves fuel in my local petrol station who went from a 1.9 PD to a 1.6 CR.

Said he couldn't believe how bad on fuel it was in comparison.  Then when we talked about it noticed in the following months the fuel economy was actually quite similar.

 

Also, for info, the 1.6 CR 75 PS detuned version of the 1.6 fills a gap in the range I don't understand.

The 1.2 three cylinder Greenline engine produces the same power, is a little faster and uses less fuel...

 

105 version would certainly be my choice.

 

The 1.6 CR engine in 105 form doesn't feel as quick as the old 1.9 PD 100, but it is.  The power is spread out and more linear.

The surge of torque in the 1.9 makes it feel faster than it really is as it pushes you back in the seat more.

[fabiamk2SE]

It's not so much having to drive it like a petrol and rev it. More like just making sure you have enough revs to be on the turbo if you want to accelerate.

In my experience accelerating from low revs (under maybe 2,000) causes the engine to throw fuel through the engine as the turbo isn't up to speed, which harms economy.

I guess this is a result of a smaller capacity, bigger turbo'd engine?

I used to drive a transit 140 sport like this. It was completely dead below 2k and really easy to stall setting off. Then as soon as you hit 2k, a great load of torque steer and wheel spin appeared, and you were off!

[The Plumber]

Sounds like a Fabia Scout TDI 105 would be ideal for your needs, with its more resilient bumpers and side cladding.

 

 

TP

[myheartbeatsfortwo]

Indeed fabia scout and change the wheels for a set of winters for the lanes. If theyre anything like where i used to live...

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[bluecar1]

the greenline can't have a factory fit towbar as standard, just not an option, as it is an eco model

 

the greenline can tow, and max braked trailer weight is 1000kg

 

if you are only towing now and again, consider the greenline, it is good value for money as it has lots of accessories (cruise, esp, tpm, hill hold etc) and impressive mpg on long runs when driven carefully

 

if you are going to be towing more than just occasionally a 1.6TDi is a better option, the 105ps has a 1200kg max braked trailer as well, the 75ps has only 1000kg, but lower mpg

[fabiamk2SE]

the greenline can't have a factory fit towbar as standard, just not an option, as it is an eco model

the greenline can tow, and max braked trailer weight is 1000kg

if you are only towing now and again, consider the greenline, it is good value for money as it has lots of accessories (cruise, esp, tpm, hill hold etc) and impressive mpg on long runs when driven carefully

if you are going to be towing more than just occasionally a 1.6TDi is a better option, the 105ps has a 1200kg max braked trailer as well, the 75ps has only 1000kg, but lower mpg

Yup. And if you need more towing capacity than that, itll be an Octy. And i guess thatll impact on buying price and fuel economy.