Has anyone got any reliable stats on DPF issues? What is the frequency of serious problem?

Given that they have been so common for the last few years I find it hard to believe there really is a serious issue with them.

 

DPF's are fine if the car is used as it was designed to be used. That means that diesels are no longer any good for lots of town works and short 'cold' trips. The dpf takes a huge hit every time they are used like that, especially if the car is not used on a longer run regularly. None of my friends have had any problems with dpf equipped cars, and some have owned them for several years. But they don't do short trips. 

 

ps. Seb makes some good points...

Edited 17 February, 201511 yr by Estate Man

if you have decided not to go the diesel way , personally I'd go for a Japanese petrol as its what they do well

Oh and thanx estateman for your kind words nice to have some once a year

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2175111/Great-diesel-myth-They-DONT-save-money-petrol-models-economical-makes-car.html

Edited 17 February, 201511 yr by seboni121

I've an Accord and I've never even noticed a regen in 10k. I actually had to ask the Honda forums if I should have seen anything.

 

If you are buying a diesel to do the job it was designed for DPFs don't seem to cause many problems. If you're town driving petrol is the right way to go.

 

Modern cars do have more faults that older ones and they do tend to be more expensive. That's mainly down to incresed complexity, more parts = more potential points of failure.

I thought cars have never been as reliable as they are now? What do you mean by modern cars having more faults?

The faults are more common due to all the electricals now on board new cars , cars of yesteryear where more agricultural 4 wheels and engine , so more common faults although engines are far more reliable now it's all the ancillary stuff which fail , also the smaller engines with more bang tend to be the way forward now that's another can of worms

A car in the 70s probably had about 5,000 parts, a modern car probably has something like 500,000 when you take into account all the parts on the circuit boards; any one little bit of which can cause big problems.

I remember old-ish cars and they were a charismatic pain in the ar$e often. Especially British built cars of a certain era. I do remember misfires in heavy rain was common, you couldn't sit with the clutch in at traffic lights because you wore out the release bearing (carbon) Naff windscreen wipers which didn't always do as it says on the tin. 'Interesting' brakes and tyres. Inaudible MW radios, no power steering, (great gearboxes though ). No security at all! lack of performance, lack of decent fuel consumption etc etc etc. modern cars are great

Edited 17 February, 201511 yr by Lady Elanore

Right, I'm off to see a 2009 Mazda 6 TS petrol estate on Thursday. It's being sold from a Jaguar/Aston Martin dealer so should be fun walking around viewing the goods they have on offer. Who knows, I may even come home with a XF Shooting Brake

 

I'd probably rather have a TS2 with the bluetooth, iPod connectivity and 17" wheels but my head says this one is a good choice. It comes with a full 12-month warranty, 12 months AA cover, 12 months MOT and has only done 40,000 miles.

 

There are a couple of things that might annoy me and that's a lack of spare wheel in favour of some stupid foam repair and a pump, but a spare can be bought from Mazda for about £70. The other thing is the lack of iPod aux in and bluetooth, but the Parrott 9100i in the Superb served me well so I can go down this route again. And finally, the stance is a little high, but again, lowering kits can be had for reasonable money but all reports suggest it drives very well without so maybe it's time I started thinking of long-distance family comfort, and forget the rest.

 

Anyway, I'll drive it on Thursday and see what's what. I was really excited about the 2.2d but after reading all the horror stories associated with the Mazda diesels I started down this road of utter confusion. However, I can't find any major problems with the petrol engines at all except the fuel consumption, but as I only do about 8-10k miles a year, I think I'll live with it. Plus, the tax and insurance are cheaper than my lightly modded Superb.

 

Update to come at the end of the week. Thanks to everyone as usual, and if I do go Japanese I certainly won't be leaving the forum. I registered with the Mazda forum to say hello and ask some newbie questions and got 3 responses in 5 days - not exactly buzzing :no:      

 

 

 

 

 

Right, I'm off to see a 2009 Mazda 6 TS petrol estate on Thursday. It's being sold from a Jaguar/Aston Martin dealer so should be fun walking around viewing the goods they have on offer. Who knows, I may even come home with a XF Shooting Brake

 

I'd probably rather have a TS2 with the bluetooth, iPod connectivity and 17" wheels but my head says this one is a good choice. It comes with a full 12-month warranty, 12 months AA cover, 12 months MOT and has only done 40,000 miles.

 

There are a couple of things that might annoy me and that's a lack of spare wheel in favour of some stupid foam repair and a pump, but a spare can be bought from Mazda for about £70. The other thing is the lack of iPod aux in and bluetooth, but the Parrott 9100i in the Superb served me well so I can go down this route again. And finally, the stance is a little high, but again, lowering kits can be had for reasonable money but all reports suggest it drives very well without so maybe it's time I started thinking of long-distance family comfort, and forget the rest.

 

Anyway, I'll drive it on Thursday and see what's what. I was really excited about the 2.2d but after reading all the horror stories associated with the Mazda diesels I started down this road of utter confusion. However, I can't find any major problems with the petrol engines at all except the fuel consumption, but as I only do about 8-10k miles a year, I think I'll live with it. Plus, the tax and insurance are cheaper than my lightly modded Superb.

 

Update to come at the end of the week. Thanks to everyone as usual, and if I do go Japanese I certainly won't be leaving the forum. I registered with the Mazda forum to say hello and ask some newbie questions and got 3 responses in 5 days - not exactly buzzing :no:      

 

I looked at the Mazda as well when changing. It's a handsom car imho but I agree the stories of problems with the 2.2d were scarily common plus my mate had had a lot of issues with his 2.0d. Doing 8-10k probably means a diesel wouldn't really be of much benefit to you.

 

I signed up to the Honda forums (Honda Karma) they're nice enough chaps but nowhere near as busy as this place.

 

There was no equivalent to Lee01 to have stupid threads with

Edited 18 February, 201511 yr by Aspman

Fine particulate matter is greater on a car with a dpf , non dpf make larger particles

Nox will be the focus in the next few years , of course anything could come but it's some years away yet , especially for older eu4 engines and will require significant investment from garages , I reckon if it does come it will mean generally more stringent tests but less often ie every two years

 

I disagree, particles are the in thing at the moment and will be for some time, there are a lot of exceedances and is mainly caused by buses and other diesel engine vehicles. My feelings are diesel engined cars will be a thing of the past in the next generation.

 

And it's NO2 that they are concerned by ;-)

I disagree, particles are the in thing at the moment and will be for some time, there are a lot of exceedances and is mainly caused by buses and other diesel engine vehicles. My feelings are diesel engined cars will be a thing of the past in the next generation.

 

And it's NO2 that they are concerned by ;-)

NOx is the generic term (and correct!)  it covers both Nitric Oxide NO and Nitrogen Oxide NO2

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NOx

 

I agree diesels will be hit heavily and you are right particulates especially nano particulates are a huge issue but dont underestimate the war on NOx , which is going to be what cripples diesels , as an aside a dpf equipped engines can release 4 times more NOx when doing a regen than when running normally 

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/news/10862975/Emission-tests-substantially-underestimate-pollution-pumped-out-by-diesels.html

NOx is the generic term (and correct!)  it covers both Nitric Oxide NO and Nitrogen Oxide NO2

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NOx

 

I agree diesels will be hit heavily and you are right particulates especially nano particulates are a huge issue but dont underestimate the war on NOx , which is going to be what cripples diesels , as an aside a dpf equipped engines can release 4 times more NOx when doing a regen than when running normally 

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/news/10862975/Emission-tests-substantially-underestimate-pollution-pumped-out-by-diesels.html

 

Yes I know what NOx is, it's just that NO2 is the critical part in terms of legislation and pollution as it is one of the worst greenhouse gasses. I work in the environmental industry and have seen directly how the focus has moved onto particulates, 

IT'll be NOx and particulates (nano particulates particularly I think right now) fora  few years then someone will do a study and it'll be the rubber in the tyres or the lithium in batteries, or the fire retardent in the seats.

 

Don't worry if it can be taxed they'll find a problem with it to justify the tax.

Edited 18 February, 201511 yr by Aspman

All cars Janet always had varying degrees of "issues"= simple fact of mechanics.

That last car that had a major issue was A diesel Cavalier about 25 years ago that broke a cam belt

Do your research, pay your money and take your chances

To be honest, nox is not going to be a problem. We have the technology to fix that now and in our bench testing of the last engine design I was involved with, we did just that before it went out for testing. It works and has little if any effect on performance or economy, although cost of the vehicle is another thing. These units are currently pricey but that will fall like it did with CATS. Any loss is easily made up anyway with new electrickery. The combined dpf and cat that does all this is very efficient and exceeds the proposed limits for nox (an 80% reduction over current emissions). The main issue will be to keep the size of the combined unit down so that it heats up quickly and stays clean. But so far if it's used as modern diesels should be, there are no problems with it at the moment. Particulates, that too will be ok and the diesel engine is far from dead. But it won't really be until 2020 onwards that you see the new super efficient, super clean diesels offering super economy and performance. Work is going on at a lowly rate but the focus is currently to get as many petrols on the road instead of diesels as that is the current best way of reducing harmful emissions and cleaning up our air. It's no coincidence that all types of lung disease in adults and children has spiraled upwards since 2000 onwards as air quality in this country has become heavy with diesel particulates. They are the most prominent pollutant along with nox, while other pollutants are generally falling. They are everywhere and stay airborne for hours and hours. Petrols are currently much cleaner and offer similar performance to current diesels. Economy is not far off either. The only issue with Petrol engines which is still to come is again 'Particulates'. As companies search for more power and economy the amount of petrol particulates emitted will increase requiring a PPF (petrol particulate filter). Petrol particulates are even more lethal than diesel particulates and finer in composition meaning the risk to human health is greater and can be more immediate. So it'll be interesting to see how things progress, or not!