For a while now, my engine check light has been giving code P2015 - intake manifold runner position sensor/switch. This is when the variable intake manifold flaps stick due to oily carbon deposits - it's a fault common to many petrol Tsi VAG engines.  It hasn't caused any driving issues but resets were lasting increasingly shorter intervals and it would have eventually given misfires ... and I hate the 'engine' light being on!  The solution was to renew the intake manifold, a job that takes a few hours - many are done under warranty. My vRS has done 42,000 miles and is out of warranty.

 

The same cause of the sticking flaps - oily fumes from the crankcase breather - also slowly carbons up the engine intake valves and can reduce performance.  None of the detergents in petrol, seafoam etc treatments can do anything about this.  I was intrigued to see what my valves were like so, rather than pay a garage for quite a few hours to renew the manifold and do a decoke, I decided to do it myself. 

 

I bought the 06J133201AS manifold for £290 and a set of injector seals for £32 from Rainsworth Skoda on ebay.  Taking it really slowly, and following a video, it took me 9 hours!  However, I'm happy with the result - no engine light and runs smoother. There are plenty of how-to's on the web about the two steps.

 

 

 

I thought someone might be particulary interested in the valve state before and after so here's some pics:

 

 

 

Note that I have only ever used Shell V-Power 98 RON petrol!

 

The same cause of the sticking flaps - oily fumes from the crankcase breather - also slowly carbons up the engine intake valves and can reduce performance.  None of the detergents in petrol, seafoam etc treatments can do anything about this.  I was intrigued to see what my valves were like so, rather than pay a garage for quite a few hours to renew the manifold and do a decoke, I decided to do it myself. 

 

 

 

Note that I have only ever used Shell V-Power 98 RON petrol!

 

What petrol you use is irrelevant as it is injected straight into the combustion chambers & doesn't "wash" the valves.  The valves never see the fuel.

 

Why do you say that seafom, etc can't fix this?  What chemical inlet cleaners (and what method of introducing the cleaner to the unlet) did you use prior to mechanicaly cleaning the valves?

 

Your build up isn't that bad and a chemical inlet clean before each service would probably be beneficial in reducing the amount of build-up

For modern direct injection cars I completely agree that the petrol quality has no impact whatsoever on the inlet valves coking up. I will say that my injectors were as-new with no obvious build up, so good fuel must have played a part in that.

 

I will admit that I haven't tried seafoam myself - I've just read a lot of conflicting (i.e. polar opposite) opinions regarding its effectiveness, mainly on VW forums.  If you've had good results with it then good for you!  For me it it took a lot of effort with Valvoline EGR & Turbo Cleaner + brass bottle brushes and a plastic scraper to remove the carbon so I'm sceptical. However, rather than just pass on the opinions of others without proof myself, I'll happily edit my original post slightly to remove that opinion.

 

I put up the post as I haven't seen much on the forum about petrol decokes so thought the photos might be interesting to others.  Also, I enjoyed the work!

 

Cheers!

 

:sun:

I should have said "What petrol you use is irrelevant to the build-up on the valves".  So we both didn't convey our message very well.

 

Your post is interesting and relevant - especially with photos.

 

My 1.8tsi has 150,000km (90k miles).  The inlet was off at 95k km for a water pump and the build-up wasn't pretty.  My mech sprayed some solvent in the inlet but I doubt he did a great job (he was busy & wanted my car out of the shop)

 

Here's 6000km / 3800m of PCV blowby from the Forge catch can I use.  The water component evaporates in the inlet & the oily sludge is what cooks onto the inlet / valves, etc

 

Here are some videos of my inlets before / after a chemical clean at 143,000km with some DIY mixed cleaner (water, degreaser, mineral turps).  The results are nothing like doing a proper inlet removal but I believe if they were started early enough & done before each oil change (I do 7500km changes) then it might prevent having to do a mechanical clean like you did.

 

Cyl 2 before & after

Cyl 3 before & after

Edited 9 March, 201511 yr by brad1.8T

Interesting videos and you may well be right that it could slow down the coking up. Now that I've taken the manifold off once I reckon I could remove and refit it next time in two hours.  Also, I'm pretty sure I can get a cheap endoscope through the in-situ intake manifold like you did for future checks before I do another decoke.

 

A bit off topic but all the advice I've read is that gummed up intake manifolds can't be repaired.  That's why I fitted a new one.  However, rather than throw away the one I took off, I'm investigating refurbishing it as a good spare. I've already cleaned it in the workshop solvent bath at work and silicon greased it so it doesn't stick any more.  I've stripped and checked the actuator diaphragm - no splits and in good nick.  That leaves the electronics to check. Also, there is a small oil seal fitted between the position sensor switch and the flapper shaft non-drive end which is in poor state and could have allowed crap into the switch.  If I can source the oil seal and check/clean/replace the switch (if needed) then I reckon I can make it good as new.

Nice job. I'd love to have the time and tools to do this on my PD170, as I am sure it will be in a similarly dirty state after 110k miles.

Are you planning to fit an oil catch can or elephant mod to stop it happening again?

Brad and my car are both petrol, not diesel. 

 

For my part, I'll be monitoring the valves with a cheap endoscope through the intake manifold and will remove it again to give them a clean when they start to get too bad.

Edited 14 March, 201511 yr by Rizmod

Thought about doing this a few times myself, but no EML for me yet.

 

I notice you are local Rizmod so may call on you for help and a few beer tokens when I need it!

Stu,  if EML P2015 does rear its head then give me a shout. Riz.

Stu, if EML P2015 does rear its head then give me a shout. Riz.

You're a good man, cheers!

Guys my TSi Octavia VRS is in at the local Skoda dealers for inlet manifold replacement and they are saying they want to remove the head to deal with inlet valve carbon build up. Am I correct in saying the carbon build up is on the back of the valves and can be effectively dealt with without removing the head?

 

Would it be fair to say in that case that removing the head would be a bad idea? Obviously there's the cost of gasket, head bolts etc and a degree of risk involved?  

Guys my TSi Octavia VRS is in at the local Skoda dealers for inlet manifold replacement and they are saying they want to remove the head to deal with inlet valve carbon build up. Am I correct in saying the carbon build up is on the back of the valves and can be effectively dealt with without removing the head?

 

Would it be fair to say in that case that removing the head would be a bad idea? Obviously there's the cost of gasket, head bolts etc and a degree of risk involved?  

 

My garage told me this too, but I'm not paying that kind of money.  Unless something is broken, I think the method in this thread will suffice, otherwise you'd be looking at nearly a grand for parts and labour to strip the head and valves to clean them all manually. Surely it's the back of the valves that matter anyway as that's where the seal is made.

I'm currently looking into buying a car with the 2.0t tfsi engine. Am i correct in saying these are also affected by this problem? And if so, how is the yearly inlet chemical clean done like brad mentioned?

Depends 

 

I'm currently looking into buying a car with the 2.0t tfsi engine. Am i correct in saying these are also affected by this problem? And if so, how is the yearly inlet chemical clean done like brad mentioned?

 

As an instant expert on this having had to get up to speed pronto today it appears all petrol direct injection engines are prone to this but that the VW 2.0TSi as fitted to the 2008 on Octavia VRS is particularly prone. This has confusingly also been call the TFSi when fitted to the VRS even though it has TSi on the cam cover.

 

So I guess it depends what you mean by TFSi

 

If you mean the older Golf GTi type engine with belt driven cams I believe this may be less prone than the newer chain driven TSi.

 

I don't know about the yearly chemical clean, but if it works IMHO it should be part of the standard service schedule.

My garage told me this too, but I'm not paying that kind of money.  Unless something is broken, I think the method in this thread will suffice, otherwise you'd be looking at nearly a grand for parts and labour to strip the head and valves to clean them all manually. Surely it's the back of the valves that matter anyway as that's where the seal is made.

 

I agree I've told them to stick the new manifold on which should fix the fault code leading to the engine light being on and leave the valves.  

 

Once I've got my car back I'll probably take it somewhere else to get the cleaning of the valve backs done with the head in-situ. 

Depends

As an instant expert on this having had to get up to speed pronto today it appears all petrol direct injection engines are prone to this but that the VW 2.0TSi as fitted to the 2008 on Octavia VRS is particularly prone. This has confusingly also been call the TFSi when fitted to the VRS even though it has TSi on the cam cover.

So I guess it depends what you mean by TFSi

If you mean the older Golf GTi type engine with belt driven cams I believe this may be less prone than the newer chain driven TSi.

I don't know about the yearly chemical clean, but if it works IMHO it should be part of the standard service schedule.

I'm currently looking into purchasing a Leon FR so cheeky asking questions on Briskoda about it but i have owned Skodas for nearly 10 years so deserve a pass!! The Leon is a nice size for us now the wife finds the Octavia too big. Anyway, yes it would be the belt driven tfsi engine I'd be looking at as the later tsi engined cars are out of my price range unfortunately.

I'm currently looking into purchasing a Leon FR so cheeky asking questions on Briskoda about it but i have owned Skodas for nearly 10 years so deserve a pass!! The Leon is a nice size for us now the wife finds the Octavia too big. Anyway, yes it would be the belt driven tfsi engine I'd be looking at as the later tsi engined cars are out of my price range unfortunately.

 

Just been looking into this further and the earlier cars are not immune.  Maybe the Leon has had a clean up or preventative maintenance, probably worth asking

 

Frankly I'm amazed there isn't more fuss about this.  I know the VW group are not alone in having these issues but I'm horrified that Skoda apparently think its reasonable for me to face a £1000+ bill on a 50K mile car that's been fully main dealer serviced and for what appears to be predictable routine maintenance.    

Just been looking into this further and the earlier cars are not immune. Maybe the Leon has had a clean up or preventative maintenance, probably worth asking

Frankly I'm amazed there isn't more fuss about this. I know the VW group are not alone in having these issues but I'm horrified that Skoda apparently think its reasonable for me to face a £1000+ bill on a 50K mile car that's been fully main dealer serviced and for what appears to be predictable routine maintenance.

I agree totally. That's why i stopped using my Skoda main dealer years ago. Try to do most things myself these days. If i can't tackle a job i use a indie specialist. Trying to get you to cough up to have the head removed when a perfectly acceptable cleaning method is possible is shocking but not entirely surprising unfortunately. Watching manifold removal videos on Youtube the job doesn't look that bad just time consuming.

Can I double check 06J133201AS is the latest version of the IM? 

I agree I've told them to stick the new manifold on which should fix the fault code leading to the engine light being on and leave the valves.  

 

Once I've got my car back I'll probably take it somewhere else to get the cleaning of the valve backs done with the head in-situ. 

 

Just in case anyone is interested I took my car to JKM in Portsmouth who work on loads of these engines. I asked them to do the in-situ cleaning job. Imagine my surprise when they came back to say that they had inspected with a camera through the manifold and in their opinion the deposits did not yet warrant doing the job.  

 

So Azur Skoda in Chichester it seems were going to remove my cylinder head on a 5 year old 50K car at massive cost apparently without need.  I suspect I won't be darkening their door again.  

I decided that after trying a chemical clean that I would have to remove the manifold to assess the state of the valves as I still had an ever so slight hesitation at around 2000rpm. The car has covered 40500miles. the chemical clean had cleaned a little bit on cylinder 2 & 3 but had not done a great deal to 1 & 3. I spent 4 hours scraping at it with a screwdriver /  wire brushes, engine degreaser and carb cleaner.  The amount of gunk was unbelievable, especially on the splitters. They had thick built up crap on them.

 

All back together and now runs like a dream. Seems faster too.

 

I think now every time I service it I will be running a chemical clean to try and prevent it building as as fast.

Hi all,

Been to a dealership to do my service and been "Highly recommended" to do a "Throttle Body Service" that is not a part of a regular service and being done for an extra fee.

Am I being taken for a ride or it's a good thing to do once a year (as I've been told)?

Thanks

Hi all,

Been to a dealership to do my service and been "Highly recommended" to do a "Throttle Body Service" that is not a part of a regular service and being done for an extra fee.

Am I being taken for a ride or it's a good thing to do once a year (as I've been told)?

Thanks

 

 

How much are they asking? The throttle body is not the same as the inlet manifold, and if he's only cleaning the TB, it won't have any affect on the inlet valves/fins coking.  The TB can gunk up also however; in fact it's what I think is part of the problem on my car.  

Having just inspected my throttle body as part of my decoke at 40500 miles mine was totally clean and not effected in any way by oil / vapour mist