5 minutes ago, J.R. said:

They are not standard fasteners, the closest that they would come to would be a toolmakers shoulder screw without the head and a recessed hex socket within the shoulder diameter.

 

The outside diameter would have been calculated for the desired rigidity, an 8mm hex would leave the wall thickness too thin, a 6mm one would risk breaking the tool so 7mm it is.

I just went back and looked at a summary of the standard, so yeah there's no 7 mm socket head in the preferred sizes list, there's 6 mm for M8 and 8 mm for M10. I'd imagine a 7 mm socket would be in line with using an M9 thread, which would be very custom, but if it were the case that M8 wasn't strong enough and packaging didn't allow for M10 it could be made.

 

All told, 7 mm socket head seems like a poor choice for that fastener given how hard it can be to undo caliper bolts; a 7 mm hex would be highly likely to strip before actually undoing the fastener.

It is not a fastener, its a guide pin with a reduced diameter threaded to retain it in position, the outside diameter of the pin is what governs the hexagon size contained within, not the thread at the other end, it has nothing to do with it.

 

If you look at your fastener standards you will see that the hexagon recess for a countersunk head screw is much smaller than that for a cap screw which is why the disc retaining screws moved on to the stronger TORX socket and they still strip out.

 

Better to use a 7mm hexagon than a 6mm one.

7mm allen key has turned up but it is now raining, typical.

Using a punch etc out very near the edge has got me out of trouble plenty times in the past - so don't overlook that tip.

 

Though in 50+ years of messing with cars, I've never ever had problems with disc - or drum retaining screws.  There was a trend to replace these disc retaining screws with stainless steel ones, I did that on 2 cars but not bothered on any newer ones, a spot of anti seize grease, like Copaslip works for me every time now.

 

Edit:- possibly even added to these bolts the first time I've removed the wheels since buying them new or used, just a bit of preventative maintenance maybe.

Edited 18 April, 20206 yr by rum4mo

1 minute ago, rum4mo said:

Using a punch etc out very near the edge has got me out of trouble plenty times in the past - so don't overlook that tip.

 

Though in 50+ years of messing with cars, I've never ever had problems with disc - or drum retaining screws.  There was a trend to replace these disc retaining screws with stainless steel ones, I did that on 2 cars but not bothered on any newer ones, a spot of anti seize grease, like Copaslip works for me every time now.

i was going to drill it out in the middle of the screw.

 

when you say punch it on the edge, is it with a pointy metal rod?

Yes and strike downwards in a direction to encourage/force it to unscrew.

1 minute ago, rum4mo said:

Yes and strike downwards in a direction to encourage/force it to unscrew.

hhmmmm.....i might give that a go, i dont think i have them punchy thing, i will have to have a look and see if i have one.

Small chisel etc, anything that is of a size to be able to use to make an impression on the outer edge and so enable you to get it started moving/unscrewing.

1 minute ago, rum4mo said:

Small chisel etc, anything that is of a size to be able to use to make an impression on the outer edge and so enable you to get it started moving/unscrewing.

actually i might have a tiny flat screwdriver in hand if i cant find a chisel. thank you, great idea! dont want to drill it out if the screw bit gets stuck inside and i wont be able put a new screw in.

Maybe a bit dangerous, but I have resorted to using a masonary nail to at least make a impact on the surface and maybe even to continue forcing it to rotate a seized screw.

well, just tried the punch method then the drill and i still cant get the little screw out!

 

this is what i did:

 

used a metal drill bit and drilled the middle of the screw then the drill bit snapped so i tried a small flat head screwdriver and trying to knock it downwards on the edge and still wouldnt budge!

ok an update:

 

managed to drill the head out, took the brake pads off the disc, took the disc out but the 3 bolts that holds the dust cover off is stuck solid. i think the only way to to dremmel a slot on the head and take the bolt out with a flat screwdriver. i can get to 2 of them but the 3rd one is bit awkward to get to.

 

always problems after another 😞 

Heat the bolts FIRST before even attempting to remove them, a simple blow torch will do.

heat it up till it gets red?

well you could do, but would take a while with a simple blowtorch, to get red hot, you would need oxy acet set to do it in good time.

 

It does not have to be red hot (glowing) even just 1-2 minutes will help expand and "release" the bolt, then as long as the head is ok (hex or allen key) or whatever, then attempt to remove it.

 

Always ensure if its  hexagon head (standard bolt) use a six point socket only, 12 point sockets will slip on a tough bolt, if its a recessed allen key or torx bit bolt, use a pick or similiar and ensure the head is clean and that your tool fits snuggly, always advisable to give allen or torx bits a small tap with a hammer to ensure they are as deep as they can go into the head before attempting to turn the fastener. ALWAYS watch your tool as you attempt to turn / undo the bolt and stop before it slips.

 

If it does not go first time, heat again for a little longer, always worth trying a few times BEFORE the bolts strips or head slips / wears where the tool or socket fits. If you can get to the bolt itself, a good tap on the bolt with a hammer can

also assist in "releasing it"

Edited 18 April, 20206 yr by UrbanPanzer

11 hours ago, UrbanPanzer said:

well you could do, but would take a while with a simple blowtorch, to get red hot, you would need oxy acet set to do it in good time.

 

It does not have to be red hot (glowing) even just 1-2 minutes will help expand and "release" the bolt, then as long as the head is ok (hex or allen key) or whatever, then attempt to remove it.

 

Always ensure if its  hexagon head (standard bolt) use a six point socket only, 12 point sockets will slip on a tough bolt, if its a recessed allen key or torx bit bolt, use a pick or similiar and ensure the head is clean and that your tool fits snuggly, always advisable to give allen or torx bits a small tap with a hammer to ensure they are as deep as they can go into the head before attempting to turn the fastener. ALWAYS watch your tool as you attempt to turn / undo the bolt and stop before it slips.

 

If it does not go first time, heat again for a little longer, always worth trying a few times BEFORE the bolts strips or head slips / wears where the tool or socket fits. If you can get to the bolt itself, a good tap on the bolt with a hammer can

also assist in "releasing it"

thank you, just looking at dremels and blow torches now.

12 hours ago, UrbanPanzer said:

well you could do, but would take a while with a simple blowtorch, to get red hot, you would need oxy acet set to do it in good time.

 

It does not have to be red hot (glowing) even just 1-2 minutes will help expand and "release" the bolt, then as long as the head is ok (hex or allen key) or whatever, then attempt to remove it.

 

Always ensure if its  hexagon head (standard bolt) use a six point socket only, 12 point sockets will slip on a tough bolt, if its a recessed allen key or torx bit bolt, use a pick or similiar and ensure the head is clean and that your tool fits snuggly, always advisable to give allen or torx bits a small tap with a hammer to ensure they are as deep as they can go into the head before attempting to turn the fastener. ALWAYS watch your tool as you attempt to turn / undo the bolt and stop before it slips.

 

If it does not go first time, heat again for a little longer, always worth trying a few times BEFORE the bolts strips or head slips / wears where the tool or socket fits. If you can get to the bolt itself, a good tap on the bolt with a hammer can

also assist in "releasing it"

which blow torch have you got?

thinking about this:

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BRAND-NEW-BUTANE-GAS-BLOW-TORCH-PIEZO-IGNITION-HANDHELD/161332085133?hash=item259024418d:g:ZGwAAOSwUVFb~YG2

1 hour ago, froggy8 said:

thinking about this:

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BRAND-NEW-BUTANE-GAS-BLOW-TORCH-PIEZO-IGNITION-HANDHELD/161332085133?hash=item259024418d:g:ZGwAAOSwUVFb~YG2

 

If you read the description, it suggest that it is suitable for craft work, jewellery making - I bought my wife one of them for cooking/baking, ie melting/burning sugar on top of things.

 

You need a proper plumbers gas torch, maybe look in Toolstation or Screwfix.

2 minutes ago, rum4mo said:

 

If you read the description, it suggest that it is suitable for craft work, jewellery making - I bought my wife one of them for cooking/baking, ie melting/burning sugar on top of things.

 

You need a proper plumbers gas torch, maybe look in Toolstation or Screwfix.

thank you, will have a look.

 

also i have another problem (whats new?  ) i am wanting to replace the 3 screws that is holding the brake shield, could you tell me which ones they are please?

 

thank you

The bolts for retaining the brake shields are p/n N 905 293 02 and are M6 X 10 3-off per side.  The screw for retaining the discs is N 106 483 01 and it is M6 X 16.

32 minutes ago, rum4mo said:

The bolts for retaining the brake shields are p/n N 905 293 02 and are M6 X 10 3-off per side.  The screw for retaining the discs is N 106 483 01 and it is M6 X 16.

sorry someone on mk1 thread have told me the part number but having problems finding ones like mine.

37 minutes ago, rum4mo said:

The bolts for retaining the brake shields are p/n N 905 293 02 and are M6 X 10 3-off per side.  The screw for retaining the discs is N 106 483 01 and it is M6 X 16.

the screw that keeps popping up is this:

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Genuine-VW-Brake-Disc-Cover-Plate-Dust-Shield-Hexagon-Bolt-N-90529302-/302343661206

 

it does not have anything in the middle but mine has a torq.

5 minutes ago, froggy8 said:

the screw that keeps popping up is this:

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Genuine-VW-Brake-Disc-Cover-Plate-Dust-Shield-Hexagon-Bolt-N-90529302-/302343661206

 

it does not have anything in the middle but mine has a torq.

 

What you need to consider is, that initially VW Group might have used a certain type of fastener, but with time evolved it into that hex headed bolts and deleted the original part fitted to cars when your car was built, that sort of thing will happen a lot and for good reasons and to reduce the number of parts required to cover the complete range of cars.

1 minute ago, rum4mo said:

 

What you need to consider is, that initially VW Group might have used a certain type of fastener, but with time evolved it into that hex headed bolts and deleted the original part fitted to cars when your car was built, that sort of thing will happen a lot and for good reasons and to reduce the number of parts required to cover the complete range of cars.

ok thank you, will keep looking.